Thanks for the input, Charani: >There were several instances in Walton when one of the overseers was >female. Most of the time though she nominated a man to stand for her. Sarah Greenfield evidently played a full part in the duties of the post, though in a couple of places she notes that payments were made "on the advice of J Coombs" (the churchwarden). >I'm not sure what the qualifications were, but the ability to write >wasn't one of them! Sadly the Nailsea overseers acounts only survive as a (apparently mid-late Victorian) transcription so I cannot assess the handwriting. But Sarah's entries have characteristics of their own, including more extensive use of people's initials instead of names, and the use of numerals in place of months (8m^th for August, for example). She was apparently highly literate and well educated. Unfortunately at this time the rates returns are not included in the overseer's accounts - assessment and collection of rates had apparently been "outsourced" to the schoolteacher at this time - so I cannot see what property she held. Incidentally, I cannot resist the following entry for those who share my macabre affection for inappropriate wording: 12th October 1807 - Paid Mr Help his bill for the Jurymen & Coroner when they sat on the Body of James Vawer - 13 shillings 8 pence ha'penny. Best wishes, Ian

Ian Sage wrote: > Thanks for the input, Charani: YW :)) > Sarah Greenfield evidently played a full part in the duties of the post, > though in a couple of places she notes that payments were made "on the > advice of J Coombs" (the churchwarden). Bowing to the advice of one more experienced. Sarah was earlier than the lady in Walton (IIRC). My notes are on my other computer which isn't fired up atm. > Sadly the Nailsea overseers acounts only survive as a (apparently mid-late > Victorian) transcription so I cannot assess the handwriting. But Sarah's > entries have characteristics of their own, including more extensive use of > people's initials instead of names, and the use of numerals in place of > months (8m^th for August, for example). She was apparently highly literate > and well educated. It would seem so, although use of initials and the use of numerals could also hide any problems she had with the spelling of names and months but that could be because she didn't want to make any mistakes given what may have been a relatively unusual position for a woman to hold. > Unfortunately at this time the rates returns are not included in the > overseer's accounts - assessment and collection of rates had apparently been > "outsourced" to the schoolteacher at this time - so I cannot see what > property she held. That's a shame. Walton's overseers don't give the property, only the amounts paid. I can't think offhand what sources there might be other than a will possibly (if extant). It's too early for the usual sources. > Incidentally, I cannot resist the following entry for those who share my > macabre affection for inappropriate wording: > > 12th October 1807 - Paid Mr Help his bill for the Jurymen & Coroner when > they sat on the Body of James Vawer - 13 shillings 8 pence ha'penny. I have a slightly macabre sense of humour and had to have a chuckle over that <G> Who was Mr HELP? I have a HELP(E)S family who ended up in Bristol. They're proving to be a bit of a headache (knocking your head against a brickwall does tend to have that effect after a while ;)) ). -- Charani (UK) OPC for Walton, Greinton and Clutton, SOM Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM http://wsom-opc.org.uk

I think that Overseers' Accounts and Church Wardens' Accounts are fantastic - not only do you usually get the names of rate payers but such an insight into what the money was spent on and how life was led at that time. I can't lay my hands on my notes for the following but I seem to remember that in Weston-super-Mare one year the Overseers' accounts were beautifully written and presented but the Overseer made his mark when signing them! Further investigation showed that the accounts were actually kept my his wife. Comments about this were made elsewhere in the records but the situation was allowed to continue. The originals need to be examined and they are not easy to transcribe or index but are well worth the effort of studying although you have to take them year by year. There are some exceptions to this. In the Reference Section of Weston-super-Mare Library are printed extracts from the Weston Overseers' Accounts by Brian Austin. These are arranged by surname of recipient so you can see every payment for each person (all done pre-computer) Nailsea & District Local History Society has the text of a publication about the Nailsea Poor Rate in 1828 available online http://www.ndlhs.org.uk/ebooks/Nailsea1828-final.pdf Mary Mason has included Portbury Church Wardens' Accounts on her Portbury Hundred site http://www.portbury-hundred.co.uk/accportbury.htm Outside this area. Paul Mansfield has examined the Enmore Overseers' Accounts. See http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/SOM/Enmore/index.html These are just a few which come to mind - what others are there? Pat

Pat Hase wrote: > I think that Overseers' Accounts and Church Wardens' Accounts are > fantastic - not only do you usually get the names of rate payers but such an > insight into what the money was spent on and how life was led at that time. This entry is also from Walton: At a Vestry held this 1 day of August 1784 Whereas the small pox now broke out in this parish, We do hearby [sic] Agree for the Church Wardens & Overseers to Gett a Man to Inoculate the inhabitence [sic] of this parish in number about 70 And we do further agree to give the Sum of three Guineas and half and no More as Witness our Hands ?3 13s 6d > I can't lay my hands on my notes for the following but I seem to remember > that in Weston-super-Mare one year the Overseers' accounts were beautifully > written and presented but the Overseer made his mark when signing them! > Further investigation showed that the accounts were actually kept my his > wife. Comments about this were made elsewhere in the records but the > situation was allowed to continue. 8>< > These are just a few which come to mind - what others are there? I have those for Walton from 1819 to 1836 but they are not online as yet. I also have a partial transcription of the books from 1757-1784 but, as you say, they are difficult to read. The first time one of the ladies of the village is mentioned as an overseers is 1758 when Sarah PALMER, widow, was appointed along with Samuel WHITE "for their own estates". The 2nd entry, appropriate given today is Easter Monday, reads (my notes are in angle brackets): Easter Monday Mar the 27th 1758 we whose names are under written Do allow of the foregoing accts and Do nominate and appoint Sarah PALMER widdow and Samuel WHITE to serve the office of overseers for the Year ensuing. The mark of Stephen GREGORY <mark resembles cap V> Richard POLTON, William WATKINS, Richard PINKARD, Joseph HOBBS, John WITHY <all sign> It's unfortunate that whenever a female overseer is mentioned subsquently, it's formally: Mrs HURMAN, Mrs RAWLINGS, Mrs IVISON, Mrs HOOPER and so on. -- Charani (UK) OPC for Walton, Greinton and Clutton, SOM Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM http://wsom-opc.org.uk