Mike Gould wrote: > It is with great regret that I have to let you all know of the recent death > of Hugh Watkins. Many of you will have been helped by Hugh and some will > have known him personally as a "Bunfighter" for many years. He will be a > great loss to family historians, in particular for the Bristol and Somerset > area. > > Hugh's obituary notice is on the following web page: > > http://www.bmdsonline.co.uk/3365719 > > Our thoughts are with his family and friends tonight. Thank you for letting us know. Hugh was certainly a larger than life character and he will be greatly missed. My condolences to his family and friends. -- Charani (UK) OPC for Walton and Greinton, SOM Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM http://wsom-opc.org.uk

I am saddened by the news of Hugh's death. We had met several times - at the Bunfights and at Family History Fairs as well as online. He was ever helpful, friendly and extremely knowledgeable about the historical context in which our ancestors operated. His suggestions, often cryptically expressed, but always relevant were so generously given. I will miss him. Pat ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Gould" <mike.gould@ndirect.co.uk> To: <bristol_and_district@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 6:08 PM Subject: [B&D] Hugh Watkins > > Hi All, > > It is with great regret that I have to let you all know of the recent > death > of Hugh Watkins. Many of you will have been helped by Hugh and some will > have known him personally as a "Bunfighter" for many years. He will be a > great loss to family historians, in particular for the Bristol and > Somerset > area. > > Hugh's obituary notice is on the following web page: > > http://www.bmdsonline.co.uk/3365719 > > Our thoughts are with his family and friends tonight. > > Mike Gould > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > BRISTOL_AND_DISTRICT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

I only met Hugh once at the 2008 bunfight organised by Nancy Frey. He was certainly larger than life and we had a long chat over a drink I will also miss his blog Tony ----- Original Message ----- From: <Bernpeg@aol.com> To: <bristol_and_district@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 7:29 PM Subject: Re: [B&D] Hugh Watkins > So sorry to read of the death of Hugh Watkins. A friendly and larger > than > life character. > Bernice > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > BRISTOL_AND_DISTRICT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Thanks for letting us know Mike. Yes, he has been a regular attendant at all the bunfights. I didn't realise he was ill, he's been posting quite regularly but I hadn't seen any of his postings since Christmas. Liz www.btinternet.com/~e.newbery OPC for Street, Somerset ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Gould" <mike.gould@ndirect.co.uk> To: <bristol_and_district@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 6:08 PM Subject: [B&D] Hugh Watkins > > Hi All, > > It is with great regret that I have to let you all know of the recent > death > of Hugh Watkins. Many of you will have been helped by Hugh and some will > have known him personally as a "Bunfighter" for many years. He will be a > great loss to family historians, in particular for the Bristol and > Somerset > area. > > Hugh's obituary notice is on the following web page: > > http://www.bmdsonline.co.uk/3365719 > > Our thoughts are with his family and friends tonight. > > Mike Gould > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > BRISTOL_AND_DISTRICT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi All, It is with great regret that I have to let you all know of the recent death of Hugh Watkins. Many of you will have been helped by Hugh and some will have known him personally as a "Bunfighter" for many years. He will be a great loss to family historians, in particular for the Bristol and Somerset area. Hugh's obituary notice is on the following web page: http://www.bmdsonline.co.uk/3365719 Our thoughts are with his family and friends tonight. Mike Gould

Dear Hugh and family, Just want to let you know how much I appreciated your friendship, and help with our Genealogy. It was always done with good humour and, I know, with a twinkle in your eye. Be with the stars, with the wind and the sunshine. May you rest well, dear friend. Edna ~ sunny Ottawa

Hi Mike, Thanks for letting us know. I visited the site, signed up left my message and have uploaded a photo of Hugh which I took at the Bunfight in Stanton Wick in 2008. That was my one and only meeting with Hugh and I recall what a 'character' he was. He will be sadly missed. Regards, Nancy Frey Newcastle, Ontario, CANADA OPC for Ansford & Castle Cary, Somerset Moderator of Yahoo! Catsash Hundred Group Moderator of Yahoo! Glaston Twelve Hides Hundred Group Moderator of Yahoo! NorthWiltshire Group Moderator of Yahoo! SouthWiltshire Group Moderator of Yahoo! WestWiltshire Group Moderator of Yahoo! FULFORD_North Devon Group Moderator of Yahoo! DAVIDGE Connections Group ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Gould" <mike.gould@ndirect.co.uk> To: <bristol_and_district@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 1:08 PM Subject: [B&D] Hugh Watkins > > Hi All, > > It is with great regret that I have to let you all know of the recent > death > of Hugh Watkins. Many of you will have been helped by Hugh and some will > have known him personally as a "Bunfighter" for many years. He will be a > great loss to family historians, in particular for the Bristol and > Somerset > area. > > Hugh's obituary notice is on the following web page: > > http://www.bmdsonline.co.uk/3365719 > > Our thoughts are with his family and friends tonight. > > Mike Gould >

So sorry to read of the death of Hugh Watkins. A friendly and larger than life character. Bernice

That is indeed sad news, I had never met Hugh but know how much he contributed to family history and to this list, my thoughts are with his friends and family, Cathy

Hi Charani, Yes...a lot of coverage on the TV here in NZ. awful conditions for you. What happened to global "warming"? Peter On 1/7/10, Charani <familyhunter@family-hunter.co.uk> wrote: > I'm sure many of our overseas members know about the wintery > conditions in the UK at the moment and the disruption they are causing. > > For those who haven't seen any pictures, this link will give an idea > of what it's like: > <http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/bristol/hi/people_and_places/newsid_8443000/8443483.stm> > > I had both my children off school/college today - and a 5'6" snowman > in the back garden to prove it!! > > I read that white Christmasses are very much a thing of the past > although commonplace in the 18th and 19th centuries. It got me > thinking about the kind of conditions our ancestors faced and how they > coped with them, given they didn't have the benefits of central > heating and well insulated homes such as we have these days. > > It can't have been fun trying to keep the home and family warm. > > -- > Charani (UK) > OPC for Walton and Greinton, SOM > Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM > http://wsom-opc.org.uk > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > BRISTOL_AND_DISTRICT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Well I don't want to open a can of worms here but it's the difference between weather and climate. Weather is short-term and will always show extreme variations from time to time (hot, cold, wet, dry etc) but climate change is more about the longer-term trends in climate over decades or centuries or millennia (within which there will be short-term fluctuations of varying durations). Of course there could be a long-term climate trend of more extreme short-term variations! Maybe we are seeing that e.g. a number of years in the past decade have been among the warmest on record. But it's the average over a longer period that's important for future societies. For example, I wouldn't buy any property near very low-lying coasts with eroding cliffs; fortunately much of Bristol is hilly and those parts would escape any rise in sea levels! Adrian O Beckenham, Kent ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Ashford" <brabazon10@gmail.com> To: <bristol_and_district@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 12:26 AM Subject: Re: [B&D] Snowy Bristol > Hi Charani, > > Yes...a lot of coverage on the TV here in NZ. awful conditions for you. > > What happened to global "warming"? > > Peter > > On 1/7/10, Charani <familyhunter@family-hunter.co.uk> wrote: >> I'm sure many of our overseas members know about the wintery >> conditions in the UK at the moment and the disruption they are causing. >> >> For those who haven't seen any pictures, this link will give an idea >> of what it's like: >> <http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/bristol/hi/people_and_places/newsid_8443000/8443483.stm> >> >> I had both my children off school/college today - and a 5'6" snowman >> in the back garden to prove it!! >> >> I read that white Christmasses are very much a thing of the past >> although commonplace in the 18th and 19th centuries. It got me >> thinking about the kind of conditions our ancestors faced and how they >> coped with them, given they didn't have the benefits of central >> heating and well insulated homes such as we have these days. >> >> It can't have been fun trying to keep the home and family warm. >> >> -- >> Charani (UK) >> OPC for Walton and Greinton, SOM >> Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM >> http://wsom-opc.org.uk >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> BRISTOL_AND_DISTRICT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > BRISTOL_AND_DISTRICT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

For information and comment -------- Original Message -------- Subject: FFHS-NEWS Administration charge for certificates Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2010 18:49:58 -0000 From: News from the Federation of Family History Societies Administration charge for certificates We have recently been asked if it is in order for a local register office to impose an administration charge in addition to the standard cost of £7 for a birth, marriage or death certificate. This is something which has been asked previously but we have again put the question to the General Register Office at Southport. The answer received yesterday was ?Our view remains as expressed in the guidance ? that the fees for certificates issued by superintendent registrars are set by statute and a superintendent registrar has no power to charge an additional fee, such as an administrative charge. Only where the local authority provides an additional, discretionary service, is it able to charge a supplementary fee (to recover the cost) under the powers available to it under the Local Government Act 2003.? In view of this reply it may be pertinent to ask local register offices which do levy such additional charges, under what authority they feel able to do so. Roger Lewry FFHS Archives Liaison 6 January 2010 -------- Original Message ends -------- -- Charani (UK) OPC for Walton and Greinton, SOM Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM http://wsom-opc.org.uk

I'm sure many of our overseas members know about the wintery conditions in the UK at the moment and the disruption they are causing. For those who haven't seen any pictures, this link will give an idea of what it's like: <http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/bristol/hi/people_and_places/newsid_8443000/8443483.stm> I had both my children off school/college today - and a 5'6" snowman in the back garden to prove it!! I read that white Christmasses are very much a thing of the past although commonplace in the 18th and 19th centuries. It got me thinking about the kind of conditions our ancestors faced and how they coped with them, given they didn't have the benefits of central heating and well insulated homes such as we have these days. It can't have been fun trying to keep the home and family warm. -- Charani (UK) OPC for Walton and Greinton, SOM Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM http://wsom-opc.org.uk

Early on in Church history it was decided that to be valid Baptism had to be in the name of the 3 persons of the Trinity so presumably most churches might decide e.g JW's had not been properly baptised Ann >

Hi Richard, This posting is a 'keeper'! I've never seen the situations pointed out so clearly in such a concise manner. Many, many thanks for enlightening my day. I've not snipped here because I think some listers might not have read your original posting and I wouldn't want them to miss anything. Regards, Nancy Frey Newcastle, Ontario, CANADA OPC for Ansford & Castle Cary, Somerset Moderator of Yahoo! Catsash Hundred Group Moderator of Yahoo! Glaston Twelve Hides Hundred Group Moderator of Yahoo! NorthWiltshire Group Moderator of Yahoo! SouthWiltshire Group Moderator of Yahoo! WestWiltshire Group Moderator of Yahoo! FULFORD_North Devon Group Moderator of Yahoo! DAVIDGE Connections Group ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Carruthers a.k.a. Carruthers-Zurowski" <leliwite@hotmail.com> To: <bristol_and_district@rootsweb.com>; "Liz Hicks" <e.newbery@btinternet.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 2010 10:56 AM Subject: Re: [B&D] Two baptisms > > Well, I'm not a Vicar or Churchwarden as someone on the list asked for, > but I was a candidate for Holy Orders in the Church of England at one time > (and was even offered the living of Withernsea cum Hornsea by my cousin if > and when I got ordained...) > > Anyway, one can only be "validly" baptised once according to the the > Christian religion in all its branches so far as I know. Now, of course, > some hold with infant baptism and some not, so for the latter, they may > seek to baptise a child who has only been "christened". Of course, > christening and baptism mean the same thing, but some churches don't use > the terms christen(ing) (from "to Christian") at all, seeing it as the > root of "the problem". > > This said, not all Christian denominations view each other as valid parts > of the Church (meaning the community of the Christian faithful), so they > might decide to conduct a "valid" baptism for converts from a "suspect" > denomination. > > There are even cases where what most might not see as a Christian > denomination do this (e.g. Mormonism, and to return the favour a convert > from Mormonism to Anglicanism is normally baptised, because though the > words they use may be correct the intention behind their use is > doctrinally so divergent as to warrant a "proper" baptism). > > Now, turning to the case not discussed (whereas emergency or private > baptism and later reception or half-baptism has been covered): there is > conditional baptism. That arises in cases where the person requesting > baptism or their sponsors (godparents and parents) may be unsure as to > whether the person has been baptised before. In this instance, the > officiant adds a small preamble to the baptismal sentence, basically > saying that if this person is unbaptised, I baptise them in the name of > the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost... > > Now, in High Church Anglican (and other) circles, it is quite usual to > undergo a ceremony called the Asperges, where the blessed water also used > for baptism is sprinkled or even sloshed over members of the congregation > to symbolise their membership in the community of the baptised and > emphasise the cleansing powers of the blessed waters of baptism. The > accompanying chant speaks poetically of this. > > Also, it is quite usual now to baptise infants at Easter or another major > feast day in a lengthy service in which all members of the congregation > are invited to join in in the service saying the words to renew their own > often infant baptismal vows (in which case they were made by the officiant > and the godparents). > > One also comes across the baptism of "those of Riper years" (i.e. > non-infants). This cropped up in my Wiltshire research where one son of my > Quaker Harmer ancestors from Rodbourne Cheney sought baptism so that he > could be married in the local parish church. For the Quakers this was a > serious offence as was marriage by a priest, and so he was expelled, but > then he would have known that this was the likely outcome. Quakers do not > believe in ceremonies such as baptism, though they may feel that they have > been baptised by the Spirit, with no outward sign of the event, except > perhaps a new and holier mien. > > What was interesting about the baptism of my Quaker ancestral uncle was > that the person who indexed the record thought that the Riper Years > reference in the parish register referred to his parents, his mother in > particular, which apart from being perhaps ungallant, led to some people's > conclusion that she was a remarkable mother who had brought forth a child > in her old age like Sarah bearing Isaac in the Bible. Not so, her son > simply sought baptism as an adult. > > I may be useful for family historians to get hold of an old Book of Common > Prayer (1662) to see what the "rubrics" (rules) for baptism and other > church rites were. One of my mother's favourites as a child bored by long > sermons was to read the "Table of Kindred and Affinity" of the Church of > England. It is quite enlightening for people to see for instance that > while it was uncanonical to marry one's mother/father etc. or deceased > husband's brother (or wife's sister), it was never forbidden to marry a > cousin of whatever degree (provided they didn't also fall into another > forbidden category of closer kinship). By contrast, the Roman Catholic > Church has long forbidden the marriage of cousins up to and including the > eighth degree of kinship, but allowing uncles and nieces to marry (as I > like to tell my nieces with an avuncular leer!), provided on got a > dispensation from the religious authorities (ditto for cousin marriages). > These dispensation papers can be very useful to researcers. > Richard > Anglican mother/father originally a Roman Catholic rec'd into the One True > Church before marriage (and correspondingly excommunicated from Rome!);) > *=On my father's mother's side I have a delightful kinswoman who was born > a Thauberger. Her parents were both born Thaubergers (one born in Canada, > the other in Russia) and her father's parents both also Thaubergers. He > maternal grandmother was the only non-Thauberger, but when asked revealed > sheepishly that her own mother was indeed a Thauberger! I'd love to see > those dispensation papers. BTW, my cousin is high-functioning and normal > to all outward appearances...;) > Richard Carruthers, M.A. (Oxon.)

I think its a harder frost than we've had for years that persists all day & if the snow comes along the M4 tonight it will stay around . Ann -West London Phil Warn wrote: > Good morning B&Ders, > > A white one this morning, I vould not make up my mind whether we had > had a sprinkling of the white stuff or a heavy frost this morning here > in outer London. > > >

Sometimes there is a note in the box where the Minister signs his name, not always as obvious as the regular margin note, or the line written across and below the baptism. Yvonne Scrivener Canberra ACT Australia -----Original Message----- From: bristol_and_district-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:bristol_and_district-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Charani It was sometimes called a "half baptism" and was, as you rightly surmise, when the child was weak and sickly and not expected to survive. Anyone could do this baptism: the midwife, a member of the child's family or anyone else present at the birth. It didn't have to be the parish priest.

Well, I'm not a Vicar or Churchwarden as someone on the list asked for, but I was a candidate for Holy Orders in the Church of England at one time (and was even offered the living of Withernsea cum Hornsea by my cousin if and when I got ordained...) Anyway, one can only be "validly" baptised once according to the the Christian religion in all its branches so far as I know. Now, of course, some hold with infant baptism and some not, so for the latter, they may seek to baptise a child who has only been "christened". Of course, christening and baptism mean the same thing, but some churches don't use the terms christen(ing) (from "to Christian") at all, seeing it as the root of "the problem". This said, not all Christian denominations view each other as valid parts of the Church (meaning the community of the Christian faithful), so they might decide to conduct a "valid" baptism for converts from a "suspect" denomination. There are even cases where what most might not see as a Christian denomination do this (e.g. Mormonism, and to return the favour a convert from Mormonism to Anglicanism is normally baptised, because though the words they use may be correct the intention behind their use is doctrinally so divergent as to warrant a "proper" baptism). Now, turning to the case not discussed (whereas emergency or private baptism and later reception or half-baptism has been covered): there is conditional baptism. That arises in cases where the person requesting baptism or their sponsors (godparents and parents) may be unsure as to whether the person has been baptised before. In this instance, the officiant adds a small preamble to the baptismal sentence, basically saying that if this person is unbaptised, I baptise them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost... Now, in High Church Anglican (and other) circles, it is quite usual to undergo a ceremony called the Asperges, where the blessed water also used for baptism is sprinkled or even sloshed over members of the congregation to symbolise their membership in the community of the baptised and emphasise the cleansing powers of the blessed waters of baptism. The accompanying chant speaks poetically of this. Also, it is quite usual now to baptise infants at Easter or another major feast day in a lengthy service in which all members of the congregation are invited to join in in the service saying the words to renew their own often infant baptismal vows (in which case they were made by the officiant and the godparents). One also comes across the baptism of "those of Riper years" (i.e. non-infants). This cropped up in my Wiltshire research where one son of my Quaker Harmer ancestors from Rodbourne Cheney sought baptism so that he could be married in the local parish church. For the Quakers this was a serious offence as was marriage by a priest, and so he was expelled, but then he would have known that this was the likely outcome. Quakers do not believe in ceremonies such as baptism, though they may feel that they have been baptised by the Spirit, with no outward sign of the event, except perhaps a new and holier mien. What was interesting about the baptism of my Quaker ancestral uncle was that the person who indexed the record thought that the Riper Years reference in the parish register referred to his parents, his mother in particular, which apart from being perhaps ungallant, led to some people's conclusion that she was a remarkable mother who had brought forth a child in her old age like Sarah bearing Isaac in the Bible. Not so, her son simply sought baptism as an adult. I may be useful for family historians to get hold of an old Book of Common Prayer (1662) to see what the "rubrics" (rules) for baptism and other church rites were. One of my mother's favourites as a child bored by long sermons was to read the "Table of Kindred and Affinity" of the Church of England. It is quite enlightening for people to see for instance that while it was uncanonical to marry one's mother/father etc. or deceased husband's brother (or wife's sister), it was never forbidden to marry a cousin of whatever degree (provided they didn't also fall into another forbidden category of closer kinship). By contrast, the Roman Catholic Church has long forbidden the marriage of cousins up to and including the eighth degree of kinship, but allowing uncles and nieces to marry (as I like to tell my nieces with an avuncular leer!), provided on got a dispensation from the religious authorities (ditto for cousin marriages). These dispensation papers can be very useful to researc! hers*. Richard Anglican mother/father originally a Roman Catholic rec'd into the One True Church before marriage (and correspondingly excommunicated from Rome!);) *=On my father's mother's side I have a delightful kinswoman who was born a Thauberger. Her parents were both born Thaubergers (one born in Canada, the other in Russia) and her father's parents both also Thaubergers. He maternal grandmother was the only non-Thauberger, but when asked revealed sheepishly that her own mother was indeed a Thauberger! I'd love to see those dispensation papers. BTW, my cousin is high-functioning and normal to all outward appearances...;) Richard Carruthers, M.A. (Oxon.) ---------------------------------------- > From: liverpud-49@rogers.com > To: e.newbery@btinternet.com > Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2010 08:00:05 -0500 > CC: BRISTOL_AND_DISTRICT@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [B&D] Two baptisms > > Hi Liz, > > Sometimes a child is privately baptised and then publicly. > Then a child might be sickly and the baptism is deemed to be urgent, > & the child recovers and is baptised again. The name part might be > just an afterthought for some reason. > > Edna - frosty Ottawa > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BRISTOL_AND_DISTRICT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message _________________________________________________________________ Eligible CDN College & University students can upgrade to Windows 7 before Jan 3 for only $39.99. Upgrade now! http://go.microsoft.com/?linkid=9691819

Hoping someone maybe able to assist. >From a birth certificate I have Francis PONTING was born the 1st December 1837, son of Thomas PONTING and AMelia nee ROW. However I have also received information from the BAFHS: Baptismal Registers 1813 - 1837 that state he was baptised on the 29th November 1835 baptised at St Philip and Jacob living St James. Someone on the list has kindly re-checked the source and it seems to be correct. Obviously he was unable to be baptised before he was born. Either it was transcribed incorrectly or there was another child called Francis born and then died before 1837. I wondered if anyone on the list have a copy of the BAFHS "They Lived in Bristol" 1813 -1837 to see if there is a burial for this Francis or any other Ponting family members from Bristol, listed below. Thomas PONTING c.1802 – 1871 Amelia ROW 1807 – 1888 Issue: Catherine PONTING 1827 – George PONTING 1829 – 1903 Henry PONTING 1831 – 1903 migrated to Australia Thomas PONTING 1833 – 1915 Francis PONTING 1837 – 1902 migrated to Australia Amelia Mary PONTING 1839 – 1855 Emma PONTING 1842 – Phoebe PONTING 1844 – 1882 migrated to Australia Ellen/Helen PONTING 1847 – Matilda PONTING 1851 – 1867 I am descended from Henry PONTING who migrated to Australia. Michelle Nichols Sydney NSW Australia

My friends living in the Emirates had a baby girl at 26 weeks gestation. The mother is German, the father is Lebanese and described as a Muslim although he does not support his religion. You have to have a religion on your passport to live in the Emirates. Anyway, my friend was delighted when the nurse told them that they had baptised their daughter. My friend thought this was wonderful as she didn't want her to be considered a Muslim. However, on her passport it says Muslim, this has to follow the father's religion. So, officially she's Muslim but baptised a Christian. I'm sure there must be many unusual cases. Liz www.btinternet.com/~e.newbery OPC for Street, Somerset