"Would the terms Dunker or Dunkard Brethren and German Baptist be used interchangeably in this era?" Certainly. They original called themselves 'brethren" (lower case) and later other began to call them German Brethren or German Baptist. Outsiders began to call them Dunkers or Dunkards due to the belief that demanded three times full emersion for baptism. There were constant problems of "modernization" and the desire to staying isolated from the "world". Many Annual Meetings were devoted to what was "good" and "bad". Sunday Schools for example. The conservatives did not like it, but the progressives wanted them so that children could read the Bible. "Should carpets be allowed on dirt floors?" was another such issue. Finally, in 1882 various leaders in the Brookville-Trootwood area of Montgomery Co. began to have meetings that resulted in the original split between the conservatives and progressives (the house still stands and is a private residence). Today we have many such divisions such as Grace Brethren, Church of the Brethren, Old Baptist Brethren (very conservative), etc. I well remember as a child seeing buggies going by our home near Brookville going to church where the men went in one door and the women and children in another. The buggies are now gone, and the shed for the horses during cold weather has only recently been demolished. But there are still two ultra-conservative churches near Covington, OH that use horse and buggies. BTW, the United Brethren in Christ and in years past the United Brethren and Evangelical United Brethren (the two merged with the Methodist church to become United Methodist in 1964) were not related to the above group. Message: 1 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2014 06:19:39 -0700 From: Melanie Rice <mjrice.denver@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [BRE] BRETHREN Digest, Vol 9, Issue 20 To: RRRhoads@aol.com Cc: brethren@rootsweb.com Message-ID: <CADOsdMBZX2wRtPcpvV=qye_uXVxCyqS4qrf7J_=Vz_udHpuNmQ@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 I knew what you meant. :) On Thu, Feb 13, 2014 at 6:14 AM, <RRRhoads@aol.com> wrote: > Woops! Make that Western townships. > > In a message dated 2/13/2014 8:02:03 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, > mjrice.denver@gmail.com writes: > > Cousin Roger! Good to hear from you! I hope you're doing well. I wish > this family left a trail like T. J. Rhodes did! > > "My experience is that when a couple in those days were married by a J.P. > it is > evidence that the couple was of two different denominations." > > I had not considered the different faiths angle. I also had no idea that > German was spoken for so long in some areas. Would a relatively > assimilated (into the melting pot) family have likely spoken both > languages? > > 1800 found the Sherow's living in a Scot-Irish area of Augusta County, > VA. There, they married into the Andrew and Weikle families, in the > Scot-Irish Presbyterian church. When they arrived in Miami Valley, OH, ca > 1810, they disbursed and didn't buy land immediately adjacent to the rest > of the family. The Andrew family landed in Montgomery County, and the > Sherow family in Miami County: Union & Concorde twps. Once there, most > subsequent marriages we find are by JOP, rather than ministers. > > I and a couple of other Sherow cousins are trying to dig further on this > line, and we are trying to establish the original nationality of "Sherow, > Sherrow, Sharow, Shero, Sharo, Shiro." We have never seen it spelled > Shearer, Sherrer, ect. - which I believe would be the more German variant. > > Once in the Miami Valley, the family married into the Young and Peck > families. A local history says Philip Young joined the Brethren late in > life. > > Thank you! > > > > > > > On Thu, Feb 13, 2014 at 4:57 AM, <RRRhoads@aol.com> wrote: > >> Message: 1 >> Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 18:55:31 -0700 >> From: Melanie Rice <mjrice.denver@gmail.com> >> Subject: [BRE] German Baptist marriage record questions >> To: BRETHREN@rootsweb.com >> Message-ID: >> <CADOsdMC7Bmu5H5V_y2kx6gFpjTbBW3wwvzza8rff4=UGGnwj5g@mail.gmail.com> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 >> >> If a couple was married by a German Baptist minister in 1827, >> PrebleCounty, OH - *may >> I presume that one or both of their families were brethren?* >> >> During that time period, in relatively newly settled Ohio, would a German >> Baptist minister have married couples who were not part of their church? >> >> The specific marriage record is for a Caty Sharow to a Daniel Brucker, on >> May 17, 1827, Preble County, OH. >> >> Also, if other couples I am researching in the same vicinity and time >> period were NOT married by a minister of the gospel, *may I presume the >> couple was not religious?* Would there be legitimate reasons that church >> members would be married by a JOP? >> >> I am working on a difficult family line that seems to have ties in Miami, >> Montgomery and Preble counties, OH, from about 1810 - 1840+. >> >> Do I understand correctly that* the designation "German Baptist" is >> synonymous with Dunker Brethren in the early 1800s, Ohio?* >> >> Lastly, *would the German Baptist churches in the Miami Valley have >> spoken >> ONLY German at that time? Could the churches have been bilingual? What >> about the members?* The family I'm working on (Sherow, etc.), came from >> a >> Scot-Irish settlement in Augusta County, VA, and appears to have been >> assimilated. My research so far indicates they likely spoke English by >> the >> time they arrived in the Miami Valley, about 1810. >> >> Thank you! >> >> Melanie Rice >> Denver, Colo. >> ------------------------------------------- >> >> Melanie, >> Hey, your one of mine, cuzz (through Thomas Jefferson Rhodes)! My >> experience is that when a couple in those days were married by a J.P. it >> is >> evidence that the couple was of two different denominations. As for the >> spoken >> language, I think that German was spoken among most German descendants >> until >> as late as the 1870s based on German language tombstones in Montgomery >> Co. >> I know that the Evangelical Lutheran (aka German) churches had German >> language preaching until the 1930s. High schools in rural areas (e.g. >> Brookville) had German courses that ended with WW I when Germany started >> the war. >> When the citizens of Brookville demanded the school stop all German >> courses, the school officials refused. Whereupon the citizens stormed >> the school >> and burned the books. >> >> Roger Rhoads