> The western Brethren > claimed that feet should be washed between supper and Bread of Communion and > they, the western Brethren, claimed the victory over the Virginia Brethren. > Somewhere between 1820 and 1826 there was > cut off about 1,500 Brethren and sisters in Kentucky. This left only a > small remnant of Far western Brethren, the old ones having died. George > Wolfe in Union County, ILL, myself in Rutherford Co., Middle Tennessee, > having never seen each other, met in Morgan County, Illinois in 1834......" In this letter you've raised two points to me - The first is that Isham GIbson names them first as "Western Brethren" - then identifies those who have moved on to Illinois as "Far Western Brethren". I wonder if this is a distinction in terms? I've called these "Western Brethren" the "Frontier Brethren" (wish I had had this letter - maybe I would have identified them a little different. Or should I maybe rename, and reword the whole book? - since it is still only in .pdf? David Eller called all of them "Far Western Brethren". I disagree with this term, on several basis - which I have tried to identify. The second is that I read the number of Brethren who were cut off (the Brethren Association - in Indiana said: "expelled") as 1500 families (which means to me a husband and wife, and their children) - quite a number, as I was discovering. This could possibly be read either way. David Eller stated it: "1500 Brethren" meaning a total of 1500 people. The original of Abraham Cassel's history on the Far Western Brethren has disappeared. I tried to find it. It is no longer at Juniata College, but it seems David Eller did see it. I suspect Abraham Cassel got his number from Isham's letter. Merle C Rummel

Merle, Brumbaugh called them Far Western Brethren in 1899 in his final chapter. I presume he got the term from Cassell, who, in turn, apparently borrowed the term from Isham Gibson's letters. Cassell accepted Gibson's count of 1,500 Brethren and sisters being cut off. (I can send you copies of the two Gibson letters I have for your reference. I got them from Michael Hodson.) Like you, I wonder if Gibson used the term Western Brethren to stand for those in western Kentucky, and then when they were kicked out of the fellowship, might he have extended the term to Far Western to indicate those who moved further west into Missouri and Illinois. As for your use of the term Frontier Brethren, for me it differentiates between the Kentucky Brethren east of the Green River who assimilated into the Association in Kentucky and Indiana around issues such as universal restoration and mode of baptism, whereas, as I understand the Far Western situation, as written by Gibson, the issue was more about the mode of Communion. Gibson was cut off (expelled) in 1869 for his views about Communion. In his letter he said that 1,500 Brethren and sisters in Ky were cut off. I assume that he was counting up both the husbands and the wives, but maybe not the children since they would not have been baptized. He may have exaggerated. I can tell you that my grandma Wrightsman, who was Isham Gibsons granddaughter, was more Gibson than Wrightsman as her side of the family told some pretty tall tales at the annual Gibson reunions in Morgan County, IL. She was convinced that her grandpa baptized Abraham Lincoln, either that, or she relished telling a tall tale with a straight face. I spent a lot of time with her as my brother and I ate lunch every school day in her kitchen. Her food was good, and her stories were even better. Dwayne Wrightsman -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Merle C Rummel Sent: Sunday, January 30, 2011 10:19 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [BRE] "Somewhere between 1820 and 1826 there was cut off about 1, 500 Brethren and sisters in Kentucky" > The western Brethren > claimed that feet should be washed between supper and Bread of Communion and > they, the western Brethren, claimed the victory over the Virginia Brethren. > Somewhere between 1820 and 1826 there was > cut off about 1,500 Brethren and sisters in Kentucky. This left only a > small remnant of Far western Brethren, the old ones having died. George > Wolfe in Union County, ILL, myself in Rutherford Co., Middle Tennessee, > having never seen each other, met in Morgan County, Illinois in 1834......" In this letter you've raised two points to me - The first is that Isham GIbson names them first as "Western Brethren" - then identifies those who have moved on to Illinois as "Far Western Brethren". I wonder if this is a distinction in terms? I've called these "Western Brethren" the "Frontier Brethren" (wish I had had this letter - maybe I would have identified them a little different. Or should I maybe rename, and reword the whole book? - since it is still only in .pdf? David Eller called all of them "Far Western Brethren". I disagree with this term, on several basis - which I have tried to identify. The second is that I read the number of Brethren who were cut off (the Brethren Association - in Indiana said: "expelled") as 1500 families (which means to me a husband and wife, and their children) - quite a number, as I was discovering. This could possibly be read either way. David Eller stated it: "1500 Brethren" meaning a total of 1500 people. The original of Abraham Cassel's history on the Far Western Brethren has disappeared. I tried to find it. It is no longer at Juniata College, but it seems David Eller did see it. I suspect Abraham Cassel got his number from Isham's letter. Merle C Rummel ------------------------