Beverly, you are correct in regard to "stress" on the pacifist youth. Also remember, as anabaptists who did not believe in infant baptism and practiced adult baptism, thes e"Young Men" often were not yet members of the church and had not been baptized, and were not under the discipline of the church. I know many stories ('Civil War Times) in which the "non-resistant" men were simplycarried off to training camps, where they soon deserted and fled and hid away. Emmert ----- Original Message ----- From: <Bb43@aol.com> To: <brethren@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2008 12:39 PM Subject: Re: [BRE] church logo question > Hi, Emmert. > > I have Michael Meyers as my ancestor. My notes say he was raised a > Mennonite, and became a Brethren when he married into the Beeghly family. > He "presided > over an extensive membership for approximately thirty years." Five of his > sons became ministers, two became deacons, and two of his daughters > married > ministers. > > In light of all that service, I find it interesting that a relative of > mine > joined the DAR based on Michael's war service. At the age of 15 he joined > the > 3rd Co. of the 2nd Battalion of the Lancaster Co. militia. He was a > substitute 'fifer and drummer", so if he saw battle he probably didn't use > any weapons. > > The stresses on these young men must have been tremendous at that time. > But > I guess there was a forgiveness mechanism within the church, because he > went > on to be a devoted Brethren. > > Beverly > > > > **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for > fuel-efficient used cars. > (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) > > ------------------------ > Search the Archives at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/BRETHREN > ------------------------ > Support Our Sponsoring Agency > The Fellowship Of Brethren Genealogists (FOBG) > For further information contact Ron McAdams mailto:McAdamsr@hotmail.com > ------------------------ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > BRETHREN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Bev; I am new to this and wonder where one goes to find a DAR application online. Thanks for any help. Marcia in Florida ----- Original Message ----- From: <Bb43@aol.com> To: <brethren@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2008 4:09 AM Subject: Re: [BRE] A start...Meyer > Hi, Bill. > > Couldn't sleep tonight, so I found my copy of the DAR application I got > online. > > Ten people have become members based on the service of Michael Meyers - > the > lines run through his children Michael who married Elisabeth Lichty, Jacob > who > married Hannah Lichty, Barbara who married Jacob C. Lichty, and Martin who > married Sally Witt. (This is my line.) > > E. M. Flickinger became a member in 2003, based on her documentation > through > Martin and Sally. I have much of the same documentation (as I listed in > an > earlier post.) But the documentation between Martin L. and Michael Meyers > is > stronger than mine.. > > But based on your previous post, I looked up his regiment listed on the > DAR > papers, and the list is from the City of Philadelphia Militia. At that > time I > don't believe his family lived in Philadelphia, so without seeing the > specific > reference in the Pennsylvania Archives, it seems rather unlikely this > fifteen > year old soldier was the same Michael Meyers that is my ancester. > > Thanks, > Beverly > > > > **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for > fuel-efficient used cars. > (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) > > ------------------------ > Search the Archives at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/BRETHREN > ------------------------ > Support Our Sponsoring Agency > The Fellowship Of Brethren Genealogists (FOBG) > For further information contact Ron McAdams mailto:McAdamsr@hotmail.com > ------------------------ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > BRETHREN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

If you are having trouble finding proof for a DAR line, each chapter and state has a Lineage Research Volunteer.  If you need help finding a record in a specific county and can't travel there, the Lineage Research Volunteer in that community might be able to help.  You can also ask assistance from the Chapter Registrar who can access information on people who have gone in on that same line through online resources as well as help you order copies of papers you need.  On the National Website you can ask for them to look up a patriot.  Hang in there and ask your local or state chapters for help.  They love to work with anyone they can. Terry Healy

Wow! More to ponder. Thanks, Cheryl. **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)

Hi, Bill. Couldn't sleep tonight, so I found my copy of the DAR application I got online. Ten people have become members based on the service of Michael Meyers - the lines run through his children Michael who married Elisabeth Lichty, Jacob who married Hannah Lichty, Barbara who married Jacob C. Lichty, and Martin who married Sally Witt. (This is my line.) E. M. Flickinger became a member in 2003, based on her documentation through Martin and Sally. I have much of the same documentation (as I listed in an earlier post.) But the documentation between Martin L. and Michael Meyers is stronger than mine.. But based on your previous post, I looked up his regiment listed on the DAR papers, and the list is from the City of Philadelphia Militia. At that time I don't believe his family lived in Philadelphia, so without seeing the specific reference in the Pennsylvania Archives, it seems rather unlikely this fifteen year old soldier was the same Michael Meyers that is my ancester. Thanks, Beverly **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)

Hi Cheryl, Isn't Brothersvalley in Bedford Co? If so, it's mid-central Pa in the mountains. Washington Co, Greene Co, and Fayette Co form SW Pa. If you have time, does the book mention surnames ANTHONY, LANE or LEHN, SEPTER? I also have BAKER (Beckar) and BAIL but no exact dates except grown children by 1790. Judy On 6/30/08, wsiebrass@aol.com <wsiebrass@aol.com> wrote: > > Beverly, > ? > > I've been reading "Two Centuries of Brothersvalley Church of the Brethren 1762 1962" by H. Austin Cooper over the past week or so. Cooper specifically talks about the mustering of Brethren youth during the time of the Revolutionary War. He states that "Young Dunkers flocked to the Drill Grounds. . .", this despite "great wrath from the fathers of the Church and parents of many of the youth." According to Cooper, "The desire was so great amonth the young men of the settlement and the flame had been fanned so high by the Indian trepidations . . .that the Brothers Valley Militia leaped into existence." > > > > Cooper says, "At least nineteen sons of these staunch Brethren and Seventh Day Baptists in Stony Creek and Brotherton joined the Brothers Valley Militia in 1774." He states, "All of them followed General George Washington through his campaigns, and some of them stayed with him at Valley Forge. Several of them were promoted up through the ranks from privates to higher officers." > > > BrothersValley was in southwestern PA, while your ancestor was in southeastern PA, but I suspect the situation was similar.

Beverly, ? I've been reading "Two Centuries of Brothersvalley Church of the Brethren 1762 1962" by H. Austin Cooper over the past week or so. Cooper specifically talks about the mustering of Brethren youth during the time of the Revolutionary War. He states that "Young Dunkers flocked to the Drill Grounds. . .", this despite "great wrath from the fathers of the Church and parents of many of the youth." According to Cooper, "The desire was so great amonth the young men of the settlement and the flame had been fanned so high by the Indian trepidations . . .that the Brothers Valley Militia leaped into existence." Cooper says, "At least nineteen sons of these staunch Brethren and Seventh Day Baptists in Stony Creek and Brotherton joined the Brothers Valley Militia in 1774." He states, "All of them followed General George Washington through his campaigns, and some of them stayed with him at Valley Forge. Several of them were promoted up through the ranks from privates to higher officers." BrothersValley was in southwestern PA, while your ancestor was in southeastern PA, but I suspect the situation was similar. Cheryl S. -----Original Message----- From: brethren-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:brethren-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Bb43@aol.com Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2008 12:39 PM To: brethren@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [BRE] church logo question Hi, Emmert. I have Michael Meyers as my ancestor.? My notes say he was raised a Mennonite, and became a Brethren when he married into the Beeghly family. He "presided over an extensive membership for approximately thirty years."? Five of his sons became ministers, two became deacons, and two of his daughters married ministers. In light of all that service, I find it interesting that a relative of mine joined the DAR based on Michael's war service.? At the age of 15 he joined the 3rd Co. of the 2nd Battalion of the Lancaster Co. militia.? He was a substitute 'fifer and drummer", so if he saw battle he probably didn't use any weapons. The stresses on these young men must have been tremendous at that time.? But I guess there was a forgiveness mechanism within the church, because he went on to be a devoted Brethren. ???????????????????????????????????? Beverly

Emmert Bittinger who contributes quite a bit to this website, wrote an extensive two part article on the Meyer family in Mennonite Family History in the mid 1990's that includes Michael. I also forgot that I have a copy of the second page of the DAR application for Michael, and it refers to his children, along with birth dates taken from the family Bible. Don't have the applicant's name, but it was a woman born in 1885. Bill Thomas -----Original Message----- From: brethren-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:brethren-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Bb43@aol.com Sent: Monday, June 30, 2008 9:55 PM To: brethren@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [BRE] A start Actually, Mary Ann, I believe I have documentation back to Elder Michael Meyers, in addition to the research done by relatives with the DAR (I accessed the record on line from the DAR website, and you can probably, too.) My mother knew and lived with Michael William Meyers (he was her grandfather and lived with them until he went to California). I have transcriptions of newspaper articles and obituary that links him to his father Martin L. Meyers in Morrill, Kansas. Also census from Cedar Rapids, Iowa and Morrill, Kansas, link them. I also have a transcript of Martin Meyers' obituary that links him back to Michael William. It also points to his father Michael Meyers of the Dunkard faith, from Somerset County . The other linkage I have to Michael Meyers comes from three sources: the DAR records, a printing from "The Meyer Family: Ten Generations", that my sister picked up when she visited Pennsylvania. It was privately published by the "Historical Committee of the Meyer Family in America", 1959. (Can't vouch for the accuracy of this organization, since I'm not ffamiliar.) And finally from the work of Jane Evans Best, in her articles for the Pennsylvania Mennonite Heritage periodicals. They are back issues, but can be back ordered. I could sift through my stacks of paper to be filed for more specific information on these sources, if you would like, but probably not until the weekend. Beyond that, it is very tricky to document, although Best goes back to Switzerland in her research, and I believe she is/was a respected genealogist. But I really can't speak for any research I've done myself that goes beyond Martin L. Meyers. Hope that helps, Beverly **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) ------------------------ Search the Archives at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/BRETHREN ------------------------ Support Our Sponsoring Agency The Fellowship Of Brethren Genealogists (FOBG) For further information contact Ron McAdams mailto:McAdamsr@hotmail.com ------------------------ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BRETHREN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Re: Hildebrand/Schantz Joseph Schantz (Johns) emigrated from Switzerland in 1769, and was single at the time. He immigrated with his unmarried sister Veronica. Joseph married a Holly from Salisbury Township, in Lancaster County (opposite end of the county from Ephrata). His sister married a Christner. One writer hypothesizes that his father was Michael Schantz of Fronsburgerhof in the Alsace region between Germany and France. Not sure where you connect Anna to Joseph? (See AAMG, and various Johnstown histories). I have never seen a Hildebrand associated with the family of Joseph Johns. Bill Thomas -----Original Message----- From: brethren-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:brethren-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of OhioWeaver@aol.com Sent: Friday, June 20, 2008 10:40 PM To: brethren@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [BRE] BRETHREN Digest, Vol 3, Issue 223 How nice to receive a reply Bill. And you rightly mentioned the Schantz family, founder of Johnstown. To be precise my ancestor Abe was the one who drew up the deed for Joseph to purchase the acreage. I have all the info needed from the date of 1776 when he married Anna Schantz. What I lack is any data that can show Abe's birth parents and any siblings. I also have the info on one Johannes Hildebrand of Ephrata and the founding of the Brethren movement from Schwartznau, Germany. This Johannes (John) was well know at the Ephrata Cloister and from those records it is known that a daughter of his married Valentine Mack (son of Alexander Mack). In one translated German document is also said that Johanne ALSO had 5 sons, none of them were named. It's those 5 sons who COULD be a father to my Abraham. Are their any scholars who can supply those sons names? Thank you I have my family on Rootsweb under the title World Connect Family Trees, on database by keyword: FROM COLONIAL PIONEERS **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) ------------------------ Search the Archives at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/BRETHREN ------------------------ Support Our Sponsoring Agency The Fellowship Of Brethren Genealogists (FOBG) For further information contact Ron McAdams mailto:McAdamsr@hotmail.com ------------------------ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BRETHREN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Nanette, My G Grandfather was George Willis Fishel (1873-1964) Lived in Dillsburg, Carroll Twp, York Co, PA. They called it Beavertown. He went to Arnold's EUB. George's father was Isaac Fishel (1834-1904) lived in Dillsburg also. He was a Lutheran. Carroll twp was created from Franklin twp. George Willis Fishel was married to Catherine May Sheaffer (Katie). And Isaac Fishel was married to Leah Wolf (Muzzie). It would be great if you found them in your books. Thank you so much for your time and energy. Best regards, ED

I just joined the DAR this year and yes they are very picky. I had to gather birth, marriage and death certificates, census, obits etc to get my application approved. I agree it's not easy to become a member. It took me a year!! Joyce in Indiana

Thank you, Bill. I just responded to Mary Ann, as she asked for my documentation. If you see mistakes please let me know. I would prefer the DAR record to be wrong than to give up my relationship to the Brethren Michael Meyer. But I am new to this enterprise, and will be thankful for anything that could clear up the confusion. Beverly **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)

Actually, Mary Ann, I believe I have documentation back to Elder Michael Meyers, in addition to the research done by relatives with the DAR (I accessed the record on line from the DAR website, and you can probably, too.) My mother knew and lived with Michael William Meyers (he was her grandfather and lived with them until he went to California). I have transcriptions of newspaper articles and obituary that links him to his father Martin L. Meyers in Morrill, Kansas. Also census from Cedar Rapids, Iowa and Morrill, Kansas, link them. I also have a transcript of Martin Meyers' obituary that links him back to Michael William. It also points to his father Michael Meyers of the Dunkard faith, from Somerset County . The other linkage I have to Michael Meyers comes from three sources: the DAR records, a printing from "The Meyer Family: Ten Generations", that my sister picked up when she visited Pennsylvania. It was privately published by the "Historical Committee of the Meyer Family in America", 1959. (Can't vouch for the accuracy of this organization, since I'm not ffamiliar.) And finally from the work of Jane Evans Best, in her articles for the Pennsylvania Mennonite Heritage periodicals. They are back issues, but can be back ordered. I could sift through my stacks of paper to be filed for more specific information on these sources, if you would like, but probably not until the weekend. Beyond that, it is very tricky to document, although Best goes back to Switzerland in her research, and I believe she is/was a respected genealogist. But I really can't speak for any research I've done myself that goes beyond Martin L. Meyers. Hope that helps, Beverly **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)

I am in process of this now. At least, this will help any descendants from our lifetimes on down. My Best, Iris in Wisconsin On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 9:14 PM, Joyce Underwood <groovygrammy@insightbb.com> wrote: > I just joined the DAR this year and yes they are very picky. I had to > gather > birth, marriage and death certificates, census, obits etc to get my > application approved. I agree it's not easy to become a member. It took me > a > year!! > Joyce in Indiana > > > ------------------------ > Search the Archives at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/BRETHREN > ------------------------ > Support Our Sponsoring Agency > The Fellowship Of Brethren Genealogists (FOBG) > For further information contact Ron McAdams mailto:McAdamsr@hotmail.com > ------------------------ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > BRETHREN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Just a quick look on the PA Archive website shows five Michael Meyer listings. Revolutionary War records typically only list a name. It takes more than a name to identify the veteran status of an ancestor. Especially one that has a common name like Meyers, and whose family has a pacifist history both before and after that war. My Amish DAR ancestors are from the 1920's, but my Hessian has a brand new tombstone. The actual veteran lived and died clear across the state from mine. The desire to have a Rev. War Vet in the family often clouds ones judgment. Bill Thomas -----Original Message----- From: brethren-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:brethren-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Judy Florian Sent: Monday, June 30, 2008 6:50 PM To: brethren@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [BRE] church logo question Meyer's Family On 6/30/08, William Thomas <wbtst2@atlanticbb.net> wrote: > > Research on my family, has shown the DAR to be very, very unreliable. I > have several Amish ancestors with DAR tombstones (utter non-sense) and > another ancestor who was actually a Hessian soldier who fought for the > British! > > Bill Thomas >== Just a comment... All the DAR applications I've found for my families have major flaws (submitted 1920s). The Nat'l DAR Office said, sometimes, "proof" was not submitted, just listed and accepted without being seen. I found it a challenge (a fun one) to prove why one DAR application was wrong. It ended up involving at least 3 unrelated lines, 6 men with the same name (3 sets of Srs & Jrs), and 3 States. That the first name was "John" certainly didn't help--LOL. Personally, I'd verify every word on an OLD DAR App and seek primary and secondary records to prove or disprove each statement. Judy ------------------------ Search the Archives at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/BRETHREN ------------------------ Support Our Sponsoring Agency The Fellowship Of Brethren Genealogists (FOBG) For further information contact Ron McAdams mailto:McAdamsr@hotmail.com ------------------------ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BRETHREN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Well it has taken me 7 years! Diane Marie Kerchner Education Consultant and Advocate COPAA SEAT Graduate Healthy Children Project, Learning Disabilities Asso. of CA Collaborative on Health and Environment-Learning & Developmental Disabilities Initiative Workgroup FASD California Task Force Southern California Woman's Christian Temperance Union Phone: 626-665-1172 FAX: 626-332-2303 diane@youcanlearn.org -----Original Message----- From: brethren-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:brethren-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Joyce Underwood Sent: Monday, June 30, 2008 7:14 PM To: brethren@rootsweb.com Subject: [BRE] DAR I just joined the DAR this year and yes they are very picky. I had to gather birth, marriage and death certificates, census, obits etc to get my application approved. I agree it's not easy to become a member. It took me a year!! Joyce in Indiana ------------------------ Search the Archives at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/BRETHREN ------------------------ Support Our Sponsoring Agency The Fellowship Of Brethren Genealogists (FOBG) For further information contact Ron McAdams mailto:McAdamsr@hotmail.com ------------------------ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BRETHREN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

In regard to the DAR applications. I know for a fact that a person can no longer join the DAR on one of the old applications. You must go back and provide proof in order to join. They have tightened up a lot and it is not easy to get a application accepted. Jo Ann in Houston **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)

On 6/30/08, William Thomas <wbtst2@atlanticbb.net> wrote: > > Research on my family, has shown the DAR to be very, very unreliable. I > have several Amish ancestors with DAR tombstones (utter non-sense) and > another ancestor who was actually a Hessian soldier who fought for the > British! > > Bill Thomas >== Just a comment... All the DAR applications I've found for my families have major flaws (submitted 1920s). The Nat'l DAR Office said, sometimes, "proof" was not submitted, just listed and accepted without being seen. I found it a challenge (a fun one) to prove why one DAR application was wrong. It ended up involving at least 3 unrelated lines, 6 men with the same name (3 sets of Srs & Jrs), and 3 States. That the first name was "John" certainly didn't help--LOL. Personally, I'd verify every word on an OLD DAR App and seek primary and secondary records to prove or disprove each statement. Judy

Beverly: I suspect that the Brethren Michael Meyer and the Michael Meyer of the militia are two different people. The 2nd Battalion came from the Lebanon County area, which was were the Brethren Michael Meyer was raised. However, that area was also the home of a number of Meyer families including several Michael Meyer's. Those Meyer families were of the Reformed faith. Michael Meyer the Brethren was Mennonite and married into the Amish Beegley family, who converted to the German Baptist faith. His father Rudolph Meyer was a non-associator. That is not a formula that fits into military service, especially at age 15. Research on my family, has shown the DAR to be very, very unreliable. I have several Amish ancestors with DAR tombstones (utter non-sense) and another ancestor who was actually a Hessian soldier who fought for the British! Bill Thomas -----Original Message----- From: brethren-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:brethren-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Bb43@aol.com Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2008 12:39 PM To: brethren@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [BRE] church logo question Hi, Emmert. I have Michael Meyers as my ancestor. My notes say he was raised a Mennonite, and became a Brethren when he married into the Beeghly family. He "presided over an extensive membership for approximately thirty years." Five of his sons became ministers, two became deacons, and two of his daughters married ministers. In light of all that service, I find it interesting that a relative of mine joined the DAR based on Michael's war service. At the age of 15 he joined the 3rd Co. of the 2nd Battalion of the Lancaster Co. militia. He was a substitute 'fifer and drummer", so if he saw battle he probably didn't use any weapons. The stresses on these young men must have been tremendous at that time. But I guess there was a forgiveness mechanism within the church, because he went on to be a devoted Brethren. Beverly **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) ------------------------ Search the Archives at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/BRETHREN ------------------------ Support Our Sponsoring Agency The Fellowship Of Brethren Genealogists (FOBG) For further information contact Ron McAdams mailto:McAdamsr@hotmail.com ------------------------ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BRETHREN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear Ed, I have some books on York Co and there are a ton of Fishels/Fissels/Fischels. Can you narrow it down a little? Most were Moravians. Nanette **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)