reply to thomas breedlove..thanks for your AMEN opinion. what lineage are you from? willette

thats ok tom you can rain on my parade. yes, charles did appear as a witness later but that is not his date of birth evidently i know you are bent on documented evidence which makes you a valuable source. but surely you began somewhere at some point. the fact remains we are all still interested in certain proofs to establish credibility of our own findings..yes, it does get frustrating at times. but consider the number of years that has already gone into these researchs and still no real satisfaction for many of us at some point enough is enough..and a certified professional has to help i did send out an email to the firm in england ,should reply soon. by the way going through my files of the virginians in the revolution p.91 i noticed a breedlove sur name "of Rockingham,E.????might be interesting to check up on. catch you later. willette. also, i have been in contact with family of the watkins and herndons waiting for a reply.

Willette, I too have to agree with Marlyn, I use the LDS records a lot, but you have to watch them, there are many, many errors in them, and I have tried to get errors corrected concerning my grandfather of another line, and once it is entered into their records they make changing it very, very difficult. Also spoke with a town historian in upstate N.Y. who said she has, for a fact, just put someone's name in the records and if it then proves to be wrong someone down the line can correct it. This from a town historian who has done extensive work for many years in that area. I fear this could be the policy of many people who do research for others and are not personally involved with (ie: closely related to ) the particular family they are compiling information for. This further shows the necessity to prove all of our work at least as far as possible and not blindly accept some of these records, but just use them as possible guidelines for our research. Good luck. Beth Porter

thanks tom king for your reply. again, has anyone contacted gerry hill personally to find what the source of info was.

-----Original Message----- From: Willette Smith <willette@bigisland.com> To: breedlove-l@rootsweb.com <breedlove-l@rootsweb.com> Date: Monday, October 02, 2000 9:46 AM Subject: charles breedlove alohamarilyn owen. this seems to be the problem, i do not show thomas 1730 in my list of children for charles 1685 mary parr 1689. mary 1723 was the last child

-----Original Message----- From: Willette Smith <willette@bigisland.com> To: dvporter@aol.com. <dvporter@aol.com.> Date: Monday, October 02, 2000 9:31 AM Subject: benjamin breedlove/mary watkins descendancy aloha beth porter. thank you for your reply. are you connected to the subject lineage? i understand what you mean about lds salt lake city records believe me i constantly tugged my hair for three mo.s straight sorting through all the breedloves. however i stand by my findings. because, the road has not been opened yet to declare charles breedlove/mary parr-did not come out of thin air. he was born in va. in 1685. this implys his parents were there!!! etc. someone somewhere knows of this. i am still doing my own research on this. sorry if some do expect to find full documentation in my submission. it was designed to touch base with people of this lineage and those working with it. everyone has their own opinions. thank you for yours.

The messages of Willette seem to have a lot of people wondering. There are no mention of a James born 1655, Thomas born 1690 or Cornelius born 1692 in Hope Perry Breedlove's manuscripts. The source for James and Thomas comes from an Ancestral FIle submission of Gerry Hill who probably made some typos in the file she sent. The listing for James Breedlove born 1655 has sons born in 1783, 1785 and 1787, which may be James (Jr) born about 1755 or ealier. The listing for Thomas born 1690 shows him as the son of Thomas Breedlove and Sarah Broaddus, so again we know that this Thomas had to be born at least after his parents abt 1750 or so. Both of these Ancestral File listings are wrong as anyone could tell just by looking at the dates of the others connected to them. A person didn't live 130+ years and then have children and a son couldn't be born before his parents. There is no listing for a Cornelius born before 1780 on the Fmmily Search of IGI or Ancestral File. There were no earlier submission to TIB files for Cornelius Breedlove. Some TIB's were enterred in the IGI but not all of them. Tom King ________________________________________________________ 1stUp.com - Free the Web Get your free Internet access at http://www.1stUp.com

Dear Willette, You give the "Morman Archives" as you source for a James Breedlove in Virginia in 1655, but what is THEIR source??? What is the PRIMARY documentatiion here?? What county in Virginia was a record for a James Breedlove on that early date found? As for Charles Breedlove having brothers Thomas & Cornelius, what is the documentation for that? Where did these two brothers live? Charles Breedlove had a SON, Thomas [my ancestor], born c. 1730, who had a SON Cornelius, born c. 1769. As far as I know, the given name Cornelius entered the Breedlove family with this Cornelius, named for his maternal grandfather, Cornelius Vaughan. I use the LDS records all of the time, and their microfilmed copies of the primary records [such as wills, court records, land records, marriage registers, etc] are excellent. Many of their family submitted records are good too, but some are not. These records are only as good as the expertise of the researcher who submitted them can make them. They should always be independently verified. But if there was a James Breedlove somewhere in Virginia in 1655, with wife Kindness, I should like to find him! Even Hope Perry's book, as excellent as it is in many respects, has errors in it. Other people's research can only point the way for us. Marilyn Owen

On 1 Oct 2000, Marc Breedlove wrote: At 02:49 PM 10/1/00 -0700, Willette Smith wrote: >this is the sequence i worked on: 1.james breedlove 1655 va. sp. (kindness) 1659. 2. charles breedlove 1685-1758 va. sp.mary parr 1689 va.(brothers;thomas breedlove 1690 va. and cornelius breedlove 1692 va.) This is the first I've heard of a known ancestor to Charles B (b 1685), and of brothers to Charles B. Is this well established? What's the documentation? Thanks, Marc Breedlove After seeing the question, "where did Charles come from" posed in this forum a number of times, I also ask for the documentation. Tom Breedlove

charleston,s.c. (had 8 children ) 6.(*)benjamin watkins breedlove and letty wade had one child...john watkins breedlove 1803 grenville, s.c. ×××××××××××××××××××××××××××××××× **This information could tie my lost Breedlove's in. Where did this long lost information come from??? Suzie Breedlove researching the family of Ruben Breedlove and Pricilla Bolton.

reply to brian. as i have stated before i ran across james 1655, va. as the earliest breedlove listed at salt lake city archives..(kindness)..in hope's book they were trying to connect the james's and kindness.. it had already been established that charles and mary had the 7 children i listed. one of which was james so. lucretia. onr sister was kindness breedlove. thomas 1690, and cornelius 1692 were also established at slc records, with family's. you might want to search this yourself. as my msg earlier today stated."this is the sequence i worked on".. ibelieve bill breedlove on line has something of record ehere he is explaing his findings regarding james's,kindness,etc. my reply today was jumping in on the previous msg's earlier last year . i added that a reply to the england firm would be in order (at this time) that perhaps could clarify all our questions..inclusively..should anyone be interested. i realize earlier submissions to slc required contact with the submiters personally. at the time (last summer) i did not have my own computer at home. i have just now began to tap into what has been submitted online..before i continued with my research.also hoping someone out there had rstablished in this years time missing links. i have made a few breakthroughs..sorry if you did not get the trend of my message before. i was not trying to shake the family tree,but i guess i did. it was a beginning point for me, of what my findings had been not necessarily to show documentations of at this point . i wanted to establish my descendancy (from hope's book) for the colaboration aspect.(and i believe you are on the mary watkins end of it..you did not give much info. when i asked you.. i like to know who i am talking to (from what lineage).. i notice there are some seasoned players here..many know where i'm coming from which makes it easier to reply..as i have said i am new at this. hope this is a satisfactory answer for you. catch you later.

submission by willette smith 10/01/2000.. you will find this info in hope p. breedlove book.

At 02:49 PM 10/1/00 -0700, Willette Smith wrote: >this is the sequence i worked on: 1.james breedlove 1655 va. sp. (kindness) 1659. 2. charles breedlove 1685-1758 va. sp.mary parr 1689 va.(brothers;thomas breedlove 1690 va. and cornelius breedlove 1692 va.) This is the first I've heard of a known ancestor to Charles B (b 1685), and of brothers to Charles B. Is this well established? What's the documentation? Thanks, Marc Breedlove

To Willette Smith, Since at least your first couple of generations of Breedloves is at odds with the established thinking of other Breedlove researchers on how the line goes, could you please give your sources for your information? Thanks Marilyn Owen

i forgot to include my email address in the body of that msg. i am still new at this.i have two email addresses willette@ilhawaii.net or willette@bigisland.com. that i use. thanks.

this is the sequence i worked on: 1.james breedlove 1655 va. sp. (kindness) 1659. 2. charles breedlove 1685-1758 va. sp.mary parr 1689 va.(brothers;thomas breedlove 1690 va. and cornelius breedlove 1692 va.) 3. children of charles and mary:..nathan breedlove 1711 va. sp. mary 1712 va.; allman breedlove 1713 va., philip breedlove 1715 va. james breedlove(*) 1717-1764 va. sp.lucretia 1720, charles breedlove 1719 va., kindness breedlove 1721 va., mary breedlove 1723 va. (charles and mary had 7 children) 4.(*) (james and lucretia's 9 children as follows) john breedlove 1740 va. sp. elizabeth watkins 1744,charlotte,va. (they had 6 children.. i have descendancy),benjamin breedlove 1741-1793 va, sp. mary watkins 1741-1787 va. (had 8 children, and my descendancy), robert breedlove 1743 va., nathanial breedlove 1745 va., ann breedlove 1747 va., james jr. breedlove 1748-1795 va. sp. mary m. kindness 1752 va., isabel breedlove 1750 va., sally breedlove 1752 va., and judith breedlove 1754 va. 5. (benjamin and mary children as follows) benjamin watkins breedlove(*) 1764-1804 va. sp. letty wade d.1829. they had one child. ,thomas breedlove 1771 va.(had 8 children) sp. lydia verlinda 1780 s.c., nathan breedlove 1775 va.(had 7 children) sp.(?) 1777 ga., john watkins breedlove 1776-1833 culpepper,co. va. sp. nancy parker 1770-1836 hancock,va.(had 10 children), nancy breedlove 1778 charlotte, va., charles breedlove 1780 charlotte,va.,samuel breedlove 1782 charlotte,va. , frances breedlove 1785-1840 va. sp. john lamar 1781- charleston,s.c. (had 8 children ) 6.(*)benjamin watkins breedlove and letty wade had one child...john watkins breedlove 1803 grenville, s.c. sp. sarah nesbitt had 10 children as follows; (*)benjamin watkins breedlove 1828-1909 greenville,s.c. sp. sarag fisher 1829 greenville,s.c., rebecca breedlove 1830,martha breedlove 1632,mary n. breedlove 1834, james breedlove 1836, sarah breedlove 1838, john watkins breedlove 1842-1927(had 11 children) sp. sarah minerva de hart, harriet e. breedlove 1842, jane breedlove 1844 and jessee breedlove 1846 . 8. the 5 children of benjamin watkins breedlove and sarah fisher are as follows; m.a. (martha) breedlove 1851, julius nichols breedlove 1853-1922 lake toxawat,n.c. sp.nancy elvira owen 1856-1936 n.c. ,claudia breedlove 1855, richard breedlove 1857, sarah l. breedlove 1860, sp. john h. reid 1856..(benjamin remarried a Dill and had joseph breedlove 1867) 9. (the 11 children of julius and nancy are as follows) john watkins breedlove 1876-1963 n.c. sp. alice la mance 1877 senieca,oconee, s.c., mary arlicia "leecie"breedlove 1877-1898, rufus t. breedlove(usarmy) 1880-1903 n.c., mack vance breedlove 1881-1965 n.c.sp. effie lou nicholson 1898 sylvia run,jackson co.n.c.(5 children), selma idella breedlove 1884-1951, william miles breedlove 1886-1971 n.c. sp. minnie todd, melvin walker breedlove 1888-1968 n.c. sp. ida cornelia hall 1886-1970 n.c., taylor ephron breedlove 1891-1960 n.c. sp. gusta arvie, ida viola breedlove 1893-1976 n.c.(5 children) sp. sixtant lusk 1885-1967, dora melinda breedlove 1896-1981 n.c. (4 children) sp. dewey thrift, julius bunyon breedlove 1898-1995 n.c.(8 children) sp. julia leopard ...10. (the 7 children of melvin walker breedlove and ida cornelia hall are as follows) clyde rufus breedlove 1914-1962 n.c. sp.wilma sarah parker 1913-1989 tuckaseigee, n.c., nola pauline breedlove sp.roy ottis bryson 1910-1985 n.c., jasper ridell breedlove 1919-1989 n.c. sp. christine moody d.1988, charles walker breedlove 1920-1984 n.c. sp. inez nettles, richard alport breedlove 1924-1941 n.c., howard melvin breedlove 1927-1995 n.c. sp. betty jean bryson 1931-1952 n.c., ida cornelia breedlove sp.clyde henry stewart 1922-1992 n.c. NOTE: due to the many questions of this lineage-and others, i submit the following letter from england. < i did not have a copy of hope p, breedlove book or cd on it. contributing to much info. in 1955 was lula judith breedlove of greenville, s.c. i believe is of the family of russwell breedlove/ida roper, walter breedlove/may dean- ernest breedlove/gladys willey. these were the children of john watkins breedlove/alice la mance..julius nichols breedlove and nancy elvira owen first child(son) LETTER: from The Institute of Heraldic and Genealogical Studies..(20 sept. 1999) address; Northgate, Canterbury, Kent, CTI IBA, England (c.r. humphrey-smith, f.s.a) "dear mrs. smith, i have received your letter of 29th august which is of cosiderable interest because it is addressed to us at the property we set up nearly forty years ago. the origin of your information is quite clear. i am, nevertheless, still able to assist you and while $10 of 1953-1959 was the going rate, i cannot do the same amount of work within that sum today! if you care to make a cheque in the sum of $185 payable to "Achievements", which is the trading arm of this charity, i woild be happy to undertake the necessary investigations to give you a full report on the BREEDLOVE origins, history and coat of arms, together with an illustration. (this letter will be signed on my behalf during my absence) signed for him.. my suggestion is for those seriously interested and connected to "sign in" for a committment on the retainer (? today) in reply to this letter. i will email this firm soon to get procedures.."Aloha"

> NAME: willette smith > EMAIL: willette@ilhawaii.net > DATE: Sep 29 2000 > URL: http:// > QRYTEXT: breedlove, benjamin va. sp. mary watkins va. son benjamin watkins breedlove va, sp.letty wade; son john watkins sp.sarah nesbitt;son benjamin watkins breedlove sp.sarah fisher; son julius nichols breedlove sp. nancy elvira owen , children; john watkins breedlove sp.alice la mance,mary arlicia breedlove, rufus t. breedlove, mack vance breedlove sp. effie lou nicholson, selma idella breedlove, william miles breedlove sp. minnie todd , melvin walker breedlove sp. ida cornelia hall,taylor ephron breedlove sp. gusta arvie, ida viola breedlove sp. sixtant lusk, dora melinda breedlove sp. dewey thrift, julius bunyon breedlove sp. julia leopard. >

Here is one of the posts to GenConnect in the last two days. Tom ----- Original Message ----- > --- > NAME: Mary C. Breedlove > EMAIL: bmaryc230@aol.com > DATE: Sep 30 2000 > QRYTEXT: I am seeking any information on Levi Breedlove(my Grandfather) born in Bainbridge Ga. Moved to Jackson County Fl and married Mary Jane Massenburg.There children were 1.Levi,Jr 2.Louie(my Father)3.John Wesley 4.Priscilla 5.Gertude 6.Maybelle. Any information on this line of the Breedlove Family would be greatly appreciated. > Thanks, > Mary C. Breedlove > Jamaica,NY

Dear Willette, To get to any mailing list archive on RootsWeb, go to the web page: http://searches2.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl And in the space "name of list" provided, just type in BREEDLOVE and hit the "submit query" button. This will take you to the BREEDLOVE-L archive page. Have fun! Tom ----- Original Message ----- From: Willette Smith <willette@bigisland.com> To: <BREEDLOVE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2000 1:46 PM Subject: [BREEDLOVE-L] benjamin breedlove/mary watkins > having trouble finding breedlove archives. help >

> Hope Breedlove and I used to correspond, perhaps 30 years ago..I am sure he > would be pleased that his material is still being used.. > Years ago he sent me a copy of his booklet, most of the information I probably > used..But, the book I mailed it to Marilyn Owen and it was lost in the > mail...that never happened to me again..any books I mail now I insure... > Once in a while I hear something on the TV about Stone Mountain, GA--and I > always think of Hope Perry Breedlove. > Was Hope a man? Funny, I just always assumed "Hope" was a woman!