Hi Viv, >Can other listers comment on any patterns or otherwise on the >English side of the border, I can only go with my own families in Northumberland where there was no real pattern on first names, apart from the first son after the father's father and first daughter after mother's mother. After that it was a bit random. My belief is that then as now, if the daughter did not like her in-laws, then there was no way she would name her children after them... However in three families, over a period of three generations in the 1800s, the children were given the mother's surname as their middle name. e.g. Mary Harrison Marriner was the daughter of Barbara Stokoe Harrison who in turn was the daughter of Barbara Stokoe. Very handy for finding the mothers surname... Best regards - Mike Simpson, Penrith, NSW, Australia Email: agene@tpg.com.au HomePage: http://www.bigfoot.com/~agene

Hi Mike, >and first daughter after mother's mother. After that it was a bit random. My >belief is that then as now, if the daughter did not like her in-laws, then >there was no way she would name her children after them... :) Absolutely, though I can't help but think there must have been a lot of Scottish brides in the past who would have liked to have done likewise. >However in three families, over a period of three generations in the 1800s, >the children were given the mother's surname as their middle name. e.g. Mary >Harrison Marriner was the daughter of Barbara Stokoe Harrison who in turn >was the daughter of Barbara Stokoe. Very handy for finding the mothers >surname... Yes indeed. Actually this reminds me of a family I once traced in Glasgow who consistently passed down the middle name of the mother of the person a child was named after - in addition to the named-after name. For example the 2nd daughter was duly named after her father's mother (Catherine Langwill) but was given the additional middle name Brackenridge (the maiden name of Catherine Langwill's mother i.e. the child's great-grandmother), leading to the hefty nomenclature Catherine Langwill Brackenridge Brown. The family did this consistently with many sons and daughters - it gave me a shock when I realised what they were doing. This was a family with a strong idea of lineage. But again that was a fairly exceptional case, albeit one that was adapting the more commonly seen Scottish naming pattern. Viv

----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Simpson" <agene@tpg.com.au> To: <BORDER-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, October 23, 2000 11:37 PM Subject: RE: Naming Pattern > Hi Viv, > > >Can other listers comment on any patterns or otherwise on the > >English side of the border, > Heres my 2 pennorth My North Northumbrian family reasonably consistently used 1st girl after fathers mother 2nd girl after mothers mother 3rd girl after mother 1st boy after mothers father 2nd boy after fathers father 3rd boy after father however since almost everyone in norhthumberland in 18-19th C was called William Thomas John James, Elizabeth Mary Ann or Jane it is neither here nor there what they did, its only fun to spot the patterns. The most helpful one I ve experienced being that of giving girls their grandmothers maiden name as a middle name (think about it and see how nice that is) Chris .