hi Jeanne, it may be worth getting in touch with the University of Oslo. Give them all the details, and ask them to advise you or point you in the right direction. Norway was still a part of Denmark in 1807, but not for much longer, so, it is just possible your medallion has Danish links. They'll be able to cope with English language correspondence on the following e-address but it might be worth apologising for not having any Norwegian. Here's a general enquiry address: international@admin.uio.no good luck :-) le durachd fionnghal > > The words are in Norwegian........they say... > > Erindring af Dom 29 November. (Apparently in old > > Norwegian) KMM 1807 > > In Remembrance of 29 November.....HMM 1807 > > Hans Mathias Moller - my gr-grandmother's > > grandfather. ___________________________________________________________ What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Yahoo! Mail Championship. http://uk.rd.yahoo.com/evt=44106/*http://mail.yahoo.net/uk

it's just great when you're on a roll. will you let us all know when you find out? i'm sure everyone n the list si as fascinated with your discovery as i am :-) le durachd :-) fionnghal > > The words are in Norwegian........they say... > > Erindring af Dom 29 November. (Apparently in old > > Norwegian) KMM 1807 > > In Remembrance of 29 November.....HMM 1807 > > Hans Mathias Moller - my gr-grandmother's > > grandfather. ___________________________________________________________ What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Yahoo! Mail Championship. http://uk.rd.yahoo.com/evt=44106/*http://mail.yahoo.net/uk

congratulations, what a wonderful souvenir of your Moller family history. :-) did anyone suggest what it may refer to? le durachd :-) fionnghal > The words are in Norwegian........they say... > > Erindring af Dom 29 November. (Apparently in old > Norwegian) > KMM > 1807 > > In Remembrance of 29 November.....HMM 1807 > Hans Mathias Moller - my gr-grandmother's > grandfather. Another great lister found this as > well for me, > ___________________________________________________________ All New Yahoo! Mail – Tired of unwanted email come-ons? Let our SpamGuard protect you. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html

So far, that is unknown. I will have to research that further; unfortunately life (and a job) interfere with my completely devoting myself to the answer 24 hours a day :) :) I've come so far in a week that I can hardly comprehend, so I'm happy for the moment. Jeanne ----- Original Message ----- From: "fionnghal nicphadraig" <fionnghalnicphadraig@yahoo.co.uk> To: <border@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 1:36 AM Subject: Re: [BORDER] 1733 Medallion - THE ANSWER! congratulations, what a wonderful souvenir of your Moller family history. :-) did anyone suggest what it may refer to? le durachd :-) fionnghal > The words are in Norwegian........they say... > > Erindring af Dom 29 November. (Apparently in old > Norwegian) > KMM > 1807 > > In Remembrance of 29 November.....HMM 1807 > Hans Mathias Moller - my gr-grandmother's > grandfather. Another great lister found this as > well for me, > ___________________________________________________________ All New Yahoo! Mail - Tired of unwanted email come-ons? Let our SpamGuard protect you. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BORDER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I received a TON of response to my request for help in deciphering my 1733 medallion, and I want to thank all of you who took the time to help out. You went "above and beyond" and provided me with lots of history aside. I think a lot of people thought it was a great mystery to be solved and had fun while helping me at the same time. Many of you asked to be notified when an "answer" had been found. One person suggested that the words might not be Irish or Scottish at all--they might be Norwegian. And, in the end, that is exactly what it turned out to be. The words are in Norwegian........they say... Erindring af Dom 29 November. (Apparently in old Norwegian) KMM 1807 In Remembrance of 29 November.....HMM 1807 Hans Mathias Moller - my gr-grandmother's grandfather. Another great lister found this as well for me, After all of these years thinking the medallion was of Irish-Scot origin, I now believe that it is from my gr-grandmother's family (Moller =M) from Trondheim, Norway. Thru marriage, the Mollers and the Littles came on down the generations, from Norway and Canada........to me. You were all wonderful............many, many thanks for all of the effort you put into finding the answer to this puzzle. If you wanted to take a last look, go to http://users.ecenet.com/wdcopper/medallion.html Jeanne

Alistair said: Yes, organised Christian religion was prominent in SCT from the year 1690 it seems (Fig 7 of Kathleen Cory's fine book) so I had wondered why the Scottish Record Office and other authorities referred to registers for 1500s! Examples, Aberdeen St Nicholas 1563, Anstruther Wester 1573. Maybe those had have been corruptly written up by "creative" Clerks.... ** Well, the Reformation in Scotland happened over a period, but was mainly 1559-1560 when the Catholic church was replaced by the reformers. The new authorities immediately started their new administration and wrote up their accounts for posterity, but many have not survived to the present day, and that's why so few are found at that early date. There is no indication that any session clerk overstepped the bounds of his office, but lots of indication of session clerks failing to keep decent records.[such as run off with a lady; gone to the Americas; or just died leaving large gaps in the register!]. Many former priests became ministers in the new church; and later when the Church of Scotland was forced by the king to become Episcopal, few ministers raised strong objections; and likewise in 1689 when the church returned to Presbyterianism. Many later registers were lost through fires, flood or dampness in a church loft; or taken away by a departing minister and not returned (some of these were handed back by the family centuries later!). Such are the vagaries of life. Gordon.

Thanks Gordon, you spoke well on this fact of early days' religious life: > Alistair pointed out that the OPRs only covered Church of Scotland and > that there were records of other faiths. > True as far as it goes, Alistair, but the period in question was the > 17th century, and at that time it was C. of S. or nothing! I plead Guilty as charged, but being a 'windbag' I like to toss more grist into the mill. My reply was less about 17th century, and more about the region of interest. Yes, organised Christian religion was prominent in SCT from the year 1690 it seems (Fig 7 of Kathleen Cory's fine book) so I had wondered why the Scottish Record Office and other authorities referred to registers for 1500s! Examples, Aberdeen St Nicholas 1563, Anstruther Wester 1573. Maybe those had have been corruptly written up by "creative" Clerks.... > Catholics were to be found only in the Highlands and Islands with very > few surviving records until the 1800s. Similarly, early Episcopal > records were mainly taken over by the Church of Scotland in 1689, and > don't resume until the 18th century. The Congregationalists start in > 1794, and the Baptists at a similar period. There were Quakers, but > mainly in Aberdeenshire, in the 18th century. > The Reformation led to All or nearly all Roman Catholic records being > destroyed in the 16th century, and all that exists now is what survived > in the Papal Archives in Rome, some of which has been published by the > Scottish History Society, but this mainly refers to priests, and the > upper classes making supplications to Rome, and mostly 14th/15th century. Thanks again, that last para will sit nicely as I shall tip it into Cory's book opposite the church History chart. Book title: TRACING YOUR SCOTTISH ANCESTRY. A good read! Alistair

Hi Jeanne, Best I can come up with is:- Erin Irving 24th day of November KMM 1807 Regards, Mike Simpson Penrith, NSW, Australia http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~agene  

a chance to petition the Prime Minister to reduce the classified period for census data from 100 years to 70 years. only 8,844 have signed to date 8.30am 22 Jan '07 [available for sigining by British citizens or residents only i'm afraid] http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/censusinfofreed ___________________________________________________________ New Yahoo! Mail is the ultimate force in competitive emailing. Find out more at the Yahoo! Mail Championships. Plus: play games and win prizes. http://uk.rd.yahoo.com/evt=44106/*http://mail.yahoo.net/uk

hi, i know one of you is researching Elders. i'm afraid i no longer have an mail address for you. I have the 1873 Scottish Landowners return and it includes a James Elder, address: Gogar - somewhere around Edinburgh i suspect, it doesn't specify; owns 120acres at a gross annual value of £105 - a tidy sum then! hope it might be of some use to you le durachd fionnghal ___________________________________________________________ What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Yahoo! Mail Championship. http://uk.rd.yahoo.com/evt=44106/*http://mail.yahoo.net/uk

Hi! Can't see it all but some of the words look like - Ervin Irving November 1807 Margaret

Hi, I have at least two James Elders whose dates would correspond with the 1873 date, but suspect, if my relatives, couldn't be so wealthy. Just kidding. Would appreciate a copy or part of the return to which you refer. J Payne in Canada ----- Original Message ----- From: "fionnghal nicphadraig" <fionnghalnicphadraig@yahoo.co.uk> To: "BORDER-L" <BORDER-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 5:44 PM Subject: [BORDER] Elder - 1873 Scottish Landowner > hi, i know one of you is researching Elders. i'm > afraid i no longer have an mail address for you. > > I have the 1873 Scottish Landowners return and it > includes a James Elder, address: Gogar - somewhere > around Edinburgh i suspect, it doesn't specify; owns > 120acres at a gross annual value of £105 - a tidy sum > then! > > hope it might be of some use to you > > le durachd > fionnghal > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your > email personality. Take the quiz at the Yahoo! Mail Championship. > http://uk.rd.yahoo.com/evt=44106/*http://mail.yahoo.net/uk > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > BORDER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > >

I suspect that Isabella was geographically disadvantaged. Teviotfield is not in Northumberland or Westmoreland. I strongly suspect that it would have been in Roxburghshire. Jim

Alistair pointed out that the OPRs only covered Church of Scotland and that there were records of other faiths. True as far as it goes, Alistair, but the period in question was the 17th century, and at that time it was C. of S. or nothing! Catholics were to be found only in the Highlands and Islands with very few surviving records until the 1800s. Similarly, early Episcopal records were mainly taken over by the Church of Scotland in 1689, and don't resume until the 18th century. The Congregationalists start in 1794, and the Baptists at a similar period. There were Quakers, but mainly in Aberdeenshire, in the 18th century. The Reformation led to All or nearly all Roman Catholic records being destroyed in the 16th century, and all that exists now is what survived in the Papal Archives in Rome, some of which has been published by the Scottish History Society, but this mainly refers to priests, and the upper classes making supplications to Rome, and mostly 14th/15th century. Gordon.

For records before 1660, you basically have to use national records, such as sasines, testaments(wills, land and property records, and the Register of Deeds (which often included people borrowing and lending money in the period before banks existed). There are annual indexes to the Register of Deeds - OOPS - they start 1661!!! Well, the Register of Sasines index for Berwick and Lauderdale runs in one alphabetical sequence from 1617-1780, in 2 volumes.(pub. HMSO, 1928) Then there is an online index to the testaments - free to search on the scotlandspeople site, though you have to pay to view/order copies of the actual wills/inventory/etc. The land and property records are found in the Register of the Great Seal(11 vols running from 1306 to 1668). Other published sources are the Register of the Privy Council of Scotland (up to 1691), and Register of the Privy Seal(16th century). There are also the odd specialist source such as "The MSS of the Duke of Athole and of the Earl of Home" (pub. Historical MSS Commission, 1891), and the "Chartulary of the Cistercian Priory of Coldstream" (pub. Grampian Club, 1879), both of which have a few Chirnside references contained within. There are other possibilities (e.g. Registers of Hornings; Exchequer Rolls of Scotland/Accounts of the Treasurer of Scotland), but the above are the most likely to produce results. Gordon Johnson <www.kinhelp.co.uk>

That certainly seems to be the concensus, Margaret. Thanks for your input and taking the time to write. Jeanne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Margaret Barnes" <margaretbarnes@blueyonder.co.uk> To: <border@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 1:55 PM Subject: [BORDER] medallion > Hi! > Can't see it all but some of the words look like - Ervin Irving November > 1807 > Margaret > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > BORDER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Mike.............that's great.....you were so nice to take the time......I'm printing out all and plan to review them at the end of the week--will try to let everyone know. :) Jeanne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Simpson" <agene@optushome.com.au> To: <border@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 3:16 PM Subject: Re: [BORDER] 1733 Medallion Mystery Hi Jeanne, Best I can come up with is:- Erin Irving 24th day of November KMM 1807 Regards, Mike Simpson Penrith, NSW, Australia http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~agene ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BORDER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Gordon: Thanks very much for the information. My big brickwall seems to be the marriage of Alexander Russell (Russel) to Beatrix (Beatrice) Tait, June 18, 1663, in Chirnside. Myself and several cousins are all hung up on this. I recently purchased the Surnames of Scotland, by Black, and this , mentions Robert Russell (family surname) of Berwickshire rendering homage in 1269 (Bain II, p. 207), which is 400 years earlier, but with the difficulty in getting records or information to fill the gap it's next to impossible. I tried Scotlandspeople a few years back, and had a bad experience in that acturate information was provided by me and resulted in negative response. After using up all credits, I notified their website and was basically told my information was right, but that it would cost quite a bit for them to allow them to coopy the suppoorting documentation and then they would not say it was accurate. At that time you had 48 hours to research, but, now I think that's been extended, am tempted to give it another try. As all my family has Scottish roots, Mac/McDonalds, Russells, McEwans, Crocketts, Marshalls, etc., there are a lot of brickwalls. My other side is LeVatte's of Main-a-dieu, Nova Scotia. Well, thanks for letting me bend your ear with some of the frustrations, and again another thank you for the info. Rusty Russell ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gordon Johnson" <gordon@kinhelp.co.uk> To: <border@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 11:10 AM Subject: [BORDER] Chirnside pre-1660 > For records before 1660, you basically have to use national records, > such as sasines, testaments(wills, land and property records, and the > Register of Deeds (which often included people borrowing and lending > money in the period before banks existed). > There are annual indexes to the Register of Deeds - OOPS - they start > 1661!!! > Well, the Register of Sasines index for Berwick and Lauderdale runs in > one alphabetical sequence from 1617-1780, in 2 volumes.(pub. HMSO, 1928) > Then there is an online index to the testaments - free to search on the > scotlandspeople site, though you have to pay to view/order copies of the > actual wills/inventory/etc. > The land and property records are found in the Register of the Great > Seal(11 vols running from 1306 to 1668). > Other published sources are the Register of the Privy Council of > Scotland (up to 1691), and Register of the Privy Seal(16th century). > There are also the odd specialist source such as "The MSS of the Duke of > Athole and of the Earl of Home" (pub. Historical MSS Commission, 1891), > and the "Chartulary of the Cistercian Priory of Coldstream" (pub. > Grampian Club, 1879), both of which have a few Chirnside references > contained within. > There are other possibilities (e.g. Registers of Hornings; Exchequer > Rolls of Scotland/Accounts of the Treasurer of Scotland), but the above > are the most likely to produce results. > Gordon Johnson > <www.kinhelp.co.uk> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BORDER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I have an Isabella Johnson/Johnstone born 1857 Shields, Northumberland. Her mother was Elizabeth...I don't have a father's name. She was my great grandmother. She married Charles Henry May. Diana DSL DSL <bescot@sbcglobal.net> wrote: I have an Isabella Johnson born abt 1821 in Teviotfield, Northumberland on the 1861 census and Westmoreland on the 1871 census. I have not been able to find a Teviotfield. Her father is listed as John Johnson on her marriage license in 1844 to Thomas Stanistreet in the parish of Eccles, Lancashire. Have looked for her as single on the 1841 census and found several servant girls in the pendleton, Lancashire area abt her age but can not pinpoint one as my Isabella. If you have a Johnson data base could you look for an Isabella dau of John born in Teviotfield abt 1821 that went to Pendleton, Lancashire by 1844. Gordon Johnson wrote: Alistair pointed out that the OPRs only covered Church of Scotland and that there were records of other faiths. True as far as it goes, Alistair, but the period in question was the 17th century, and at that time it was C. of S. or nothing! Catholics were to be found only in the Highlands and Islands with very few surviving records until the 1800s. Similarly, early Episcopal records were mainly taken over by the Church of Scotland in 1689, and don't resume until the 18th century. The Congregationalists start in 1794, and the Baptists at a similar period. There were Quakers, but mainly in Aberdeenshire, in the 18th century. The Reformation led to All or nearly all Roman Catholic records being destroyed in the 16th century, and all that exists now is what survived in the Papal Archives in Rome, some of which has been published by the Scottish History Society, but this mainly refers to priests, and the upper classes making supplications to Rome, and mostly 14th/15th century. Gordon. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BORDER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BORDER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Hugs, Diana Michael's Reno

Try Teviotdell or Teviotdale. This is a valley in the Teviot Hills of border-land where reivers used to hide out.. Don ----- Original Message ----- From: "DSL DSL" <bescot@sbcglobal.net> To: <border@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 9:53 AM Subject: Re: [BORDER] Teviotfield ? > > I have an Isabella Johnson born abt 1821 in Teviotfield, Northumberland > on the 1861 census and Westmoreland on the 1871 census. I have not been > able to find a Teviotfield. Her father is listed as John Johnson on her > marriage license in 1844 to Thomas Stanistreet in the parish of Eccles, > Lancashire. Have looked for her as single on the 1841 census and found > several servant girls in the pendleton, Lancashire area abt her age but > can not pinpoint one as my Isabella. If you have a Johnson data base could > you look for an Isabella dau of John born in Teviotfield abt 1821 that > went to Pendleton, Lancashire by 1844. > > Gordon Johnson <gordon@kinhelp.co.uk> wrote: > Alistair pointed out that the OPRs only covered Church of Scotland and > that there were records of other faiths. > True as far as it goes, Alistair, but the period in question was the > 17th century, and at that time it was C. of S. or nothing! > Catholics were to be found only in the Highlands and Islands with very > few surviving records until the 1800s. Similarly, early Episcopal > records were mainly taken over by the Church of Scotland in 1689, and > don't resume until the 18th century. The Congregationalists start in > 1794, and the Baptists at a similar period. There were Quakers, but > mainly in Aberdeenshire, in the 18th century. > The Reformation led to All or nearly all Roman Catholic records being > destroyed in the 16th century, and all that exists now is what survived > in the Papal Archives in Rome, some of which has been published by the > Scottish History Society, but this mainly refers to priests, and the > upper classes making supplications to Rome, and mostly 14th/15th century. > Gordon. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > BORDER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > BORDER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message >