----- Original Message ----- From: "Browning" <browning@cameron.net> To: <BORDER-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2000 3:10 PM Subject: Longs/Langs in this county ca 1600 Hello ???? You didn't sign your e-mail so I didn't know who to address it to. You say you are looking for Longs/Langs in Wales. What part of Wales do they come from and did you send it to this site by mistake as this is the site for the Border of Scotland and England, not Wales. All the best Barry in South Wales > New to this list. Looking for Longs/Langs in this county of Wales.My decendant is Ware Long ca 1691. Was in Virginia , USA.. Said to have come from Wales.Thanks for any help. > >

William RAE married Isabel RENWICK no dates available son Robert RAE born 13 Aug 1821 Kirklands, Earlston Parish, Bew Sct. died 8 Dec 1891 Hume, Bew, Sct. Can anyone please help with a connection or any information. Kind regards Ann Cape Town

Hello all, I'm having problems tracing my SCOTT roots through Ireland as well. Are there any good books on this subject, or does anyone know of a person that does Scots-Irish geneaology services? I'm so stuck, I'm willing to pay for professional at this point. Stephen

I have "A dictionary of scottish emigrants to Canada before confederation" on loan. This lists emigrants in alpha order up to 1855 and includes family, age,etc.. I would be glad to do lookups for those that are interested. I got it to research my G-G-Grandfather Archibald Galbraith who was born in Antrim Co, Ireland in 1807 and arrived in Upper Canada sometime in before 1840. He was not in it since my family came from Scotland through Ireland. Does anyone know of a similar reference for those that came from Ireland? Doug Galbraith (NC-USA)

New to this list. Looking for Longs/Langs in this county of Wales.My decendant is Ware Long ca 1691. Was in Virginia , USA.. Said to have come from Wales.Thanks for any help.

Hi everyone. Would like a look up of the 1871 Census for North Seaton Colliery for Elizabeth Reay age 46, Ephraim Reay age 45, Mary age 22, and Isabella Teasdale age 41. They could be listed together or separately. I believe Ephraim married after 1861 census. They are listed with their father Robert Reay in this location in the 1861 Census. Robert died in 1865 so would not appear on the 1871 Census. --------------------------------------------------------- I am also looking for information on the Bell family listed in the 1861 Census for North Seaton Colliery. Robert Bell age 22 and his wife Ann age 18 (possible daughter of Robert Reay above) and their son Thomas age 1 month. I am looking for a possible marriage registry in the North Seaton Colliery area and a birth registry or baptism for Thomas Bell in this same area and possibly a death notice for this same Thomas. My records, which have been proven incorrect before, do not list a child born in England. Robert and Ann supposedly immigrated to Canada and then the USA around 1863. Their first child, that I have listed, was born in the USA in 1864. ---------------------------------------------------------- Any help I can get with the above would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance. Susan USA

Greetings all, I am new to this particular list as I think I may have finally found where my gggrandfather and his brother came from. Any connection out there? peggy William Scott b. abt 1800 SCT + Elizabeth White b. ? 3 Feb 1800 Falkirk, Stirling, SCT married abt 1820-1 Roxburgh, SCT 1. James b. abt 1822 2. Thomas b. 4 Jan 1824 d. 5 Oct 1883 3. William b. 8 Nov 1826 d. 26 April 1907 + Catherine McPherson (1822- 1875) 1. Jane (1852- 1917) 2. Duncan (1856- 1904) 4. Christina b. 1829 Thomas & William immigrated to Ontario sometime before 1852. Both are buried in Ayr, Waterloo, Ontario. Duncan is my ggrandfather. I'll post with more detail later.

Would dearly love to hear from people with Grahams from these areas. Thanks for all your help! Delia

To all you "native" listers ... Tomorrow in Hastings, New Zealand is Scottish Day, the start of Scottish week that culminates with the Hawke's Bay Highland Games at Lindesfarne College over Easter Weekend. Many of our shops have tartan in the window, we have pipers, dancers, performers, poetry reading competitions (Burns of course!) and all sorts adding to the festivity of the week. Did you know that over half of New Zealand's population has Scottish blood in them? Or that New Zealand was the first place outside of Scotland to host the Edinburgh Tattoo? (five sold-out performances!) Yes, while much of the goings-on (Highland pipes, tartan, highland dancing and kilts) might make the stauchest Borderer cringe, I'm sure it would stir in them a little of national pride. So from your antipodean cousins, "Here's to you!". We'll be thinking especially fondly of you over the next week. Yours Aye Doug -- Doug Bailey - BAILEY.O@xtra.co.nz 233 Heretaunga Street West Hastings, New Zealand. Phone: 64 - 6 - 876 8787

With regard to: " This friend is manic-depressive and her doctor here in Michigan has made a 20 year study of the connection between Celts with scandinavian blood and manic-depression! He says the combination of the two heiritages produced a mutant gene that causes manic-depression....I'm worried...for my children!"": 1.Spontaneous mutations in human genes are very common (some occur every generation), but are largely kept under control through mixing of genes through normal reproductive processes. This is why sexual reproduction is common in higher organisms; constant asexual reproduction -cloning- would repeat an increasing number of mutations (i.e. errors) and the species would die out. 2. It is thus generally accepted in the scientific community that a larger gene pool is more beneficial than a smaller gene pool because there is a then a less likelihood of 'bad' recessive genes becoming dominant. I.e. less inbreeding is better than more inbreeding. 3. My point in #2 above is that "mixing" Scandinavian Norse populations with Island Celt populations would tend to be beneficial in that the gene pool would be more robust (larger.) 4. While there is not much question that different populations carry different physical traits (e.g. Africans as a group tend to have different skin color than Scandinavians as a group) there is very little information on psychological traits being carried in large populations. It is theoretically possible that IF two populations were each more predisposed towards, say, depression, then a combination of the two could maybe create a greater predisposition towards depression. But these are all very very big IFs and virtually no large scale studies have been done on the subject. The rest is speculation. In any event it is *certainly* not a question of "creating a mutant gene". 5. Please also keep in mind that: a) the Norse invasions of occurred quite some time ago. IF the issue you raise were a problem (and I don't believe it is), there's been an awful lot of other mixing since then, customs and laws on incest being what they are. b) American Scots-Irish (or Scotch-Irish or Ulster Scots) refer to a relatively small group of people whose ancestors immigrated to Ulster from Scotland, and then some of whose descendents left Ulster for America. There would have been some intermarrying with (other then residing) Irish, but the thinking is that there wasn't much. 6. You may want to ask your friend to get you a copy of the scientific study that her doctor has done, and see if it meets rigorous research standards. 7. If you are worried about your children, I'd highly recommend giving them lots of love and listening to them when they speak, vs. listening to your friend. Cheers, Doug Doug

Hi Lucille A "deoch `n doris" is a farewell drink. I imagine that it's possible to have more than one! The lyrics can be found at http://www.sirharrylauder.com/lyrics/deoch.html , and, if you have RealPlayer, you can hear Harry sing it at http://www.besmark.com/lauder.html Regards Rob McMurdo Brisbane, Australia Lucille A Richmond wrote: > > This has nothing to do with the Black Watch conversation, but I saw a > mention of Harry Lauder -- could someone translate "wee doch and dooris" for > me? > > Lucille Richmond >

This has nothing to do with the Black Watch conversation, but I saw a mention of Harry Lauder -- could someone translate "wee doch and dooris" for me? Lucille Richmond ----- Original Message ----- From: <Davis1624@aol.com> To: <BORDER-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2000 8:52 PM Subject: Re: BORDER-D Digest V00 #108 > In a message dated 4/12/0 10:28:33 PM, BORDER-D-request@rootsweb.com writes: > > << Hi Listers, > Would anyone on list know anything about the Black Watch Tartan, which > family or clan are allowed to wear it etc. ? > Family Legend says my family are, but need information to either prove or > disprove this. > Many thanks, > Chrissie. >> > > Chrissie, > Many years ago it seems that I read a book by Sir Harry Lauder that mentioned > the Black Watch Tartan. While that is not an answer, perhaps it might be a > clue. > L&S > Bob Davis > Vancouver, WA > > ______________________________

Regarding Black Watch there are plenty of sites on the internet . Here are a few : as quoted from http://www.virtual-pc.com/journal/disp_020.htm: "It is now generally accepted that the dark tartan adopted at the time of regimentation in 1739 was what already had been worn by at least some of the Companies.Whether the Black Watch tartan was worn by the Campbells, Grants and others as clan tartans, or whether the military tartan was based on an existing design, will no doubt continue to be a subject for discussion, but the historical fact is clear that after its adoption by The Highland Regiment it became official for all troops in the government service wearing Highland dress. " from Scottish Military History site: http://subnet.virtual-pc.com/~mc546367/journal.htm#research Image of Black Watch tartan: http://www.virtual-pc.com/journal/bwtartan.htm "Six Independent Companies (of soldiery) were raised to police the Highlands of Scotland, so creating a Regiment called the Black Watch. Before 1740, they used a dark tartan which came to be called the Black Watch. Its origin is still argued but when tartan was proscribed it became the Government tartan and is now a Universal one, that all may wear. " from Regiments who wear the Black Watch and Black Watch web ring : http://www.angelfire.com/biz3/SolidFashionGuide/blackwatchlinks.html The Black Watch: http://www.highlanderweb.co.uk/culloden/theduke.htm Photo of my grandma's brother who died in the Black Watch during a slaughter in France . Sadly his dress uniform is not a kilt at all :( but I think there may be a tartan on his dress hat on the left image . http://www.accessin.com.au/~curran/MABONe.html Here is a beautiful photo of modern dress Black Watch : http://www.rmhnet.com/blackwatch/ Mary Wrightson wrote: > Greetings, Chrissie. > > My husband's mother was called Flora Macdonald and because of that I wove > tartan lap rugs for my three children and others. My great aid for this > project came from Donald C. Stewart's most interesting book, 'The Setts of > the Scottish Tartans,' first published in 1950 but reprinted several times. > > On pages 21 - 24 he has a great deal to say about the Black Watch tartan, > the origin of which seems to have caused much controversy. There seem to > be several clans laying claim to it. The custom when a regiment was formed > was that the men wore the tartan of their commander. The first commander > of the Black Watch regiment had no clan tartan - hence the puzzle. Where > did the design originate? > > I bought the book in Oban Scotland, in 1980. I guess it will still be in > print. > > Cheers, Mary Wrightson, South Australia. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: chrissie <chris@chrissie.demon.co.uk> > To: <BORDER-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, 12 April 2000 23:36 > Subject: Black Watch Tartan > > > Hi Listers, > > Would anyone on list know anything about the Black Watch Tartan, which > > family or clan are allowed to wear it etc. ? > > Family Legend says my family are, but need information to either prove or > > disprove this. > > Many thanks, > > Chrissie. > >

I would like to thank everyone who replied to my posting regarding the Black Watch Tartan, especially Doug McLean, Yvette Hope, mfp, Mary Wrightson, Clive Dakers, Rick A. Francis. I am now better informed regarding who is allowed to wear it. My 2xgrandfather was in the Highland & Sunderland regiment. Many thanks, Chrissie.

Greetings, Chrissie. My husband's mother was called Flora Macdonald and because of that I wove tartan lap rugs for my three children and others. My great aid for this project came from Donald C. Stewart's most interesting book, 'The Setts of the Scottish Tartans,' first published in 1950 but reprinted several times. On pages 21 - 24 he has a great deal to say about the Black Watch tartan, the origin of which seems to have caused much controversy. There seem to be several clans laying claim to it. The custom when a regiment was formed was that the men wore the tartan of their commander. The first commander of the Black Watch regiment had no clan tartan - hence the puzzle. Where did the design originate? I bought the book in Oban Scotland, in 1980. I guess it will still be in print. Cheers, Mary Wrightson, South Australia. ----- Original Message ----- From: chrissie <chris@chrissie.demon.co.uk> To: <BORDER-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, 12 April 2000 23:36 Subject: Black Watch Tartan > Hi Listers, > Would anyone on list know anything about the Black Watch Tartan, which > family or clan are allowed to wear it etc. ? > Family Legend says my family are, but need information to either prove or > disprove this. > Many thanks, > Chrissie. >

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Hi listers Please allow me to reintroduce my "McLean/Buncle Genealogical Data Base" This site is devoted to the descendants of two McLean and one Buncle family. It contains many useful links to Genealogy and Family History Societies within both Australia and Scotland. Listed are seven generations of one McLean family, six generations of another McLean family plus twelve generations of Buncle/Bonkels If you are aware of any Genealogical or Family History Societies with web pages I would be please to hear from them. Regards Doug McLean Australia URL: http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Canyon/6387/ A web site dedicated to genealogist in general and the McLean/Buncle lines in particular

The border reivers information is most interesting to me, especially the mentions about viking "infiltration" in Scotland. I have a close friend who is Scots/Irish and also has information passed down in her family about viking ancestors. This friend is manic-depressive and her doctor here in Michigan has made a 20 year study of the connection between Celts with scandinavian blood and manic-depression! He says the combination of the two heiritages produced a mutant gene that causes manic-depression. He claims thats the reason so many Irish people drink excessively - they are self- medicating their symptoms with alcohol.....Has anyone heard anything like this! ? I also have both Scots/Irish and Scandinavian blood as does my husband............Now I m worried!! Not for me - for my children!

In a message dated 4/12/0 10:28:33 PM, BORDER-D-request@rootsweb.com writes: << Hi Listers, Would anyone on list know anything about the Black Watch Tartan, which family or clan are allowed to wear it etc. ? Family Legend says my family are, but need information to either prove or disprove this. Many thanks, Chrissie. >> Chrissie, Many years ago it seems that I read a book by Sir Harry Lauder that mentioned the Black Watch Tartan. While that is not an answer, perhaps it might be a clue. L&S Bob Davis Vancouver, WA

unsubscribe pzagarella@hotmail.com ----- Original Message ----- From: <BORDER-D-request@rootsweb.com> To: <BORDER-D@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2000 6:22 PM Subject: BORDER-D Digest V00 #108