I have found that a lot of the are missing for Roxburgh and Selkirk. Try http://www.vivdunstan.clara.net/genuki/ROX/ for info on Lillislief. From the Online IGI I found you what is likely Roberts's marriage and some of James siblings. If you have access to a Family History Centre I recommend you try the Scottish Church Records CD. From my understanding of Scottish Origins if you don't type in the name exactly right you won't find anything. The Scottish Church Records CD is much more forgiving. (It could just be listed under a different spelling, or just not exist (Lots of mine from Roxburgh and Selkirk don't). Robert BROWN Sex: M Spouse: Helen DUNLOP Marriage: 5 Jan 1839 Selkirk, Selkirk, Scotland Batch M117787 2. Thomas BROWN - International Genealogical Index Gender: M Christening: 21 Apr 1839 Selkirk, Selkirk, Scotland 3. Hellen BROWN - International Genealogical Index Gender: F Birth: 25 Apr 1856 Selkirk, Selkirk, Scotland 4. Scott BROWN - International Genealogical Index Gender: M Birth: 7 Oct 1859 Selkirk, Selkirk, Scotland Dwelling: Maisondieu Cottage Census Place: Kelso, Roxburgh, Scotland Source: FHL Film 0224041 GRO Ref Volume 793 EnumDist 1 Page 1 Marr Age Sex Birthplace Thomas BROWN M 40 M Selkirk, Selkirk, Scotland Rel: Head Occ: Roadman Jane BROWN M 45 F Yarrow, Selkirk, Scotland Rel: Wife Occ: Roadman Wife Robert BROWN U 16 M Kirkhope, Selkirk, Scotland Rel: Son Occ: Gen Lab George BROWN 12 M Ancrum, Roxburgh, Scotland Rel: Son Occ: Scholar William BROWN 7 M Roxburgh, Roxburgh, Scotland Rel: Son Occ: Scholar Children of Thomas Brown and Jane Johnstone 1. Barbara BROWN - International Genealogical Index Gender: F Birth: 15 Jun 1866 Melrose, Roxburgh, Scotland 2. George BROWN - International Genealogical Index Gender: M Birth: 30 Sep 1868 Ancrum, Roxburgh, Scotland 3. William BROWN - International Genealogical Index Gender: M Birth: 27 Dec 1873 Roxburgh, Roxburgh, Scotland 4. Ellen BROWN - International Genealogical Index Gender: F Birth: 24 Jan 1862 Yarrow, Selkirk, Scotland 5. Robert BROWN - International Genealogical Index Gender: M Birth: 2 Jul 1864 Kirkhope, Selkirk, Scotland Barbara is with her Grandparents Dwelling: 109 Wood St Census Place: Galashiels, Selkirk, Scotland Source: FHL Film 0224036 GRO Ref Volume 775 EnumDist 10 Page 35 Marr Age Sex Birthplace Robert BROWN M 63 M Selkirk, Selkirk, Scotland Rel: Head Occ: Road Man Ellen BROWN M 62 F Selkirk, Selkirk, Scotland Rel: Wife William BROWN U 20 M Liliesleaf, Roxburgh, Scotland Rel: Son Occ: Roadman Barbara BROWN 15 F Darnick, Roxburgh, Scotland Rel: Grand Daur Williams birth does not show up which is Odd, I searched by Batch number and first names and all sorts of variations. Maybe he just did not get registered. I would try earlier Census records and track the family back that way. I hope some of this is useful Sheila I Hale Jean Duff wrote: > > Hi Listers > > According to the 1881 census my ancestor was born in Lilliesleaf 1853 is this in Roxburghshire? According to our family bible James Brown was born in January 1853 (no day) to RObert Brown & Helen Dunlop but I cannot find him in the Scottish Origins Database. Have tried the year before and year after no luck. I can find his marriage in 1878 and have all the details but I am interested in finding him to get his parents details. ANyone got any suggestions. > > I am coming to Scotland in January from sunny Australia and want to visit the borders area hence asking where is LIlliesleaf > > Thanks > > Jean Duff > > Signup for your free Virtual Countries E-mail address at http://www.scotland.com

Hi. Jim wanted to know about obtaining passenger lists for North Am. from the U.K. We have had tens of thousands of immigrants arrive in Halifax over the centuries. Here is the Nova Scotia web-site where, no doubt, people can help you. Our Nova Scotia Rootsweb address is: NOVA-SCOTIA-L@rootsweb.com but first send to: NOVA-SCOTIA-L-request@rootsweb.com and write the word "subscribe" in the main body - no subject words. Same procedure as Borders web. There are volumes of a series in the reference libaries in North Am.that are just lists of passengers immigrating here. These have up-date volumes added periodically. The Public Achives keeps the Canadian lists on microfilm in the provincial capitals. Also, you can subscribe to The Ships List with rootsweb as above and get help there. They have specific ship lists on-line. Cheers, Ron

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Could someone out there tell me where one obtains passenger lists to Canada and the USA from the UK? I'd like to do a bit of digging on ancestors that emigrated from Scotland in the early 20th century if such are readily available. Don't suppose any of them would be 'on-line'? Jim Arnott Victoria, BC, Canada

> Researching descendants of Robert Elliot and Margaret Fairbairn married 13 > August 1858 Roberton,Selkirk. > Children :--Janet born 17 sept 1858 Lilliesleaf,Roxburgh > Jane Born 24 April 1861 Bowden Roxburgh > James born 24 Aug 1863 Bowden > Margaret born 11 Jan 1867 St.Boswells Roxburgh > Elliot 15 Jan 1869 St.Boswells Roxburgh > Esther 13 June 1870 St.Boswells Roxburgh > Mary born 27 Sept 1873 St.Boswells.Roxburgh > Regards Coral Hi, Coral, I too am researching ELLIOT in ROX. Please take a look at my line of research below to see if we have any connections. This is the line of research I am following at present. Those names appearing above William ELLIOT married to Christina POW are what I am researching - no proof as yet they are of my line. Got them from IGI. Regards, Judy HALL. *William ELLIOT and Janet EASTON had a son, *Thomas ELLIOT in 1807 in Foulshiels, Castleton. *Thomas ELLIOT married Janet DOUGLAS and had the following children: *1.William ch 28 Nov 1839 Castleton ROX ( this date matches with 1881 census entry which has my William as 41 years old and born in Castleton). 2.Elizabeth Beattie chr 25 March 1841 Castleton 3.Jean Easton chr 7 June 1842 Castleton 4. Helen chr Sep 1844 Castleton 5. Janet Anne chr 29 April 1846 Castleton 6. John chr 15 Nov 1847 Castleton *William ELLIOT (b. Castleton, Rox, SCT c 1839 married Christina POW (b.Morebattle, Rox, SCT 1838) on 30 Nov 1866 at Teviothead Smithy, Rox, SCT. William was a ploughman. (I know William and Christina are definitely in my line as they are mentioned on children's birth certificates along with their date of marriage) Children: (Christina had the following children before her marriage: 1.Christian POW b 1861 2.Mary POW b 1865 (agricul labourer 1881 census) marr ??Jack) William and Christina's children were: 3.Elisabeth Pow b 23 June 1867 Kirktown mar. BLAKE * 4.Helen Dickson b. 16 Aug 1869 Minto mar. John Waldie GARDNER ( b 25 June 1871 to William GARDNER and Betsy WALDIE) on 9 Dec 1892 at West Cote, Parish of Cavers.- lived Hawick area, Rox, SCT emig Australia 1913 on 'HMS SHROPSHIRE' 5.Gavin Pow b 14 June 1875 mar. Alice Rose TOMBS (b 1879 to Thomas and Caroline (nee LIFIELD) TOMBS (Gavin) emig. to Australia in 1899 on 'Duke of Portland' 6.James Pow b 9 July 1873 Edgerston In 1881 the family lived in Doorpool Cottage, Southdean, Rox, SCT (Census). William was an agricultural labourer. *Helen Dickson Elliot married John Waldie GARDNER Children: (Helen had a son, 1.Andrew, before her marriage - stayed in Scotland when family emigrated - he took over John's job as Farm Steward at Earl of Minto's home farm at Hassendeanbank, near Hawick, ROX, SCT) 2.William b 1893 mar Sarah PITMAN (b 1897 to Charles and Caroline PITMAN , Laidley, QLD - she's still alive - 103 at present - in a nursing home in Laidley, Qld, Aus) *3.Christina Elliot b 1895 mar Norm Francis (b 4. John mar Jewel HEISER 5 .Betsy Waldie b 1898 mar William FULTON (b 1892 to William and Martha (nee PORTER) FULTON) 6 .Mary Helen McCreadie b 1902 mar Henry Norman HODGES (b 1900 to William and Sarah HODGES Laidley, QLD) 7.James (Jim) b 1906 mar Gertrude MENGEL (b 1907) *Christina Elliot GARDNER and Norm FRANCIS mar 6 Oct 1923 Laidley, Qld, AUS Children: 1. Betty b 1924 Laidley mar Keith SHEWAN (b 1922 Roy Stanley and Beatrice Helena (nee Francis) SHEWAN mar 1945 Ipswich 2. Ken b 1926 Ipswich mar Joyce GREENHILL (1926) 1950 Ipswich *3. Lorna b 1933 Ipswich mar. Don Hall (b 1929 Ipswich to William and Florence Ruth (nee GEE) Hall) ) 1954 Ipswich 4. Margaret b 1936 Ipswich mar. John PLOETZ 1957 Ipswich 5. Gwenda b 1938 Ipswich mar Greg SCHUBEL 1961 Ipswich *Lorna mar Don HALL 1954 Ipswich, Qld, AUS Children: *1.Judith b 1955 Ipswich (ME) 2. Susan b 1957 Ipswich mar David DODGSON (b Melbourne 1957) 1983 Brisbane 3. Lynette b 1960 Ipswich mar. Michael BAYARD (b 1958 Ipswich) 1985 Ipswich

Unsubscribe please ----- Original Message ----- From: <BORDER-D-request@rootsweb.com> To: <BORDER-D@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2000 12:00 AM Subject: BORDER-D Digest V00 #218

Researching descendents of Robert Elliot and Margaret Fairbairn married 13 August 1858 Roberton,Selkirk. Children :--Janet born 17 sept 1858 Lilliesleaf,Roxburgh Jane Born 24 April 1861 Bowden Roxburgh James born 24 aug 1863 Bowden Margaret born 11 Jan 1867 St.Boswells Roxburgh Elliot 15 jan 1869 St.Boswells Roxburgh Esther 13 June 1870 St.Boswells Roxburgh Mary born27 Sept 1873 St.Boswells.Roxburgh Regards Coral

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> Thanks to everyone who has joined this discussion on the 'CLARK' spellings. > All records of my family appear to also follow the change from CLERK to CLARK > around the early 1800's. > I realize that spellings change over time. Anyone have any ideas about what > could have prompted this change from CLERK to CLARK? Perhaps greater influence > from the English? > I would imagine that the pronunciation wouldn't have changed between the > different spellings? (Are they both pronounced the same by a native of > Scotland?). Anyone doing scotish family history needs to have a talent for "fuzzy spelling". Since the records were made by the Minister or Parish Clerk, who tended to write precisely what they thought the spelling should be, many family names are subject to abrupt changes of spelling when either the Minister or Parish Clerk changed. I actually have one baptismal record where the family name is spelled 3 ways in the single entry (Baldie for the father, Baldy in the margin, Bawdie for the grandfather). Researchers should also understand that there is no such thing as a "general purpose" scottish accent and you can somtimes see the effect of this in changing spelling with migration. For example, the NE of Scotland has a very distinctive accent. One of my lines from this area spelled their name Kemlo/Kemloe when there. A couple of individuals moved south (just to Angus) where two different Ministers recorded them as Kemley/Kemlie. Those who went west seem to have lost their K in favour of a G, ending with Gemlo. However, since Ministers and Schoolmasters (often the Parish Clerk) tended to move around the country, how they heard (and thus spelled) names being said to them can't really be predicted. Lesley Robertson ******************************************************************** Dr Lesley A. Robertson CBiol FIBiol Kluyver Laboratory for Biotechnology, Delft University of Technology, Julianalaan 67, 2628BC, Delft,The Netherlands tel 31 15 2782421; fax 31 15 2782355; email L.A.Robertson@stm.tudelft.nl.

There was a query about Archibald MILLER on the list. I don't know if these Miller's and mine are connected or not. One of Thomas Miller's sons, John (1797-1874), stayed in Scotland and married Jane Aimers. Children: Jane, Thomas, Agnes, Robert, Agnes, John and Mary. I couldn't find an Archibald or Hugh in my information, but my information may not be complete. Let me know. Thanks. Ray LaFever 30 Manor Farm Road Staatsburg, NY 12580 rlafever@juno.com ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

Hi all, Thanks to everyone who has joined this discussion on the 'CLARK' spellings. All records of my family appear to also follow the change from CLERK to CLARK around the early 1800's. I realize that spellings change over time. Anyone have any ideas about what could have prompted this change from CLERK to CLARK? Perhaps greater influence from the English? I would imagine that the pronunciation wouldn't have changed between the different spellings? (Are they both pronounced the same by a native of Scotland?). Just to put an interesting twist on this all. In Australia if I were pronouncing the Surname CLARK or CLERK I would distinguish between them by sounding the 'A' or 'E'. However if a person is a 'clerk' (a person who performs clerical work) then we pronounce it sounding the 'A' (i.e. 'klärk' apparently from the British - according to my dictionary). Anyway, sorry if I'm getting off the track, but I do find all this rather interesting... Kind regards, Cameron Clark. Melbourne, Australia. > > Subject: Clark/Clerke > Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2000 11:44:08 +1000 > From: "Mike Simpson" <agene@tpg.com.au> > To: BORDER-L@rootsweb.com > > I have been following the discussion re the spelling of CLERK/CLARK/CLARKE > with interest as I have CLARK connections just over the border in Norham. > > I have done a count of the 1881 census for the Eastern border counties, > Berwick, Peebles, Roxburgh and Selkirk and the spellings are as follows:- > CLARK 478 > CLERK 9 > CLARKE 19 > So it would appear that by 1881 the spelling had normalised to CLARK and > that CLERK had almost disappeared. > > Best regards - Mike Simpson, Penrith, NSW, Australia > Email: agene@bigfoot.com > HomePage: http://www.bigfoot.com/~agene > > ______________________________

Hi, I'm trying to help someone find their Border family. Archibald MILLER emigrated to the US from Hawick in the 1870's. His father was Hugh MILLER- mother was Janet Bell ( MILLER). They settled with Archibald's sister Margaret ( died 1980) and brother Hugh Walter MILLER in Maynard, Mass. Another sister Jean MILLER married Alec 'Lel' CHARTERS - they remained in the Hawick area and had 2 sons - Will & Joe. Jean & Margaret used to exchange letters every week or so. Will CHARTERS had 3 sons - Alec, Robin and Gerald. Robin is believed to have died young . Caroline Ruth (Miller) CARBARY ,now in her 70's ,would love to learn of any CHARTERS or MILLER relative still living in the Borders. "Talking about her family in Scotland brings tears to her eyes" says daughter Cathy Can anyone help? Allan formerly of Hawick

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Someone posted a message enquiring about a Nesbit family which I didn't save. I then came across this site while looking for something else: http://www3.mistral.co.uk/helmstone/nisbett/nesd2.htm It might be of use. Lesley Robertson ******************************************************************** Dr Lesley A. Robertson CBiol FIBiol Kluyver Laboratory for Biotechnology, Delft University of Technology, Julianalaan 67, 2628BC, Delft,The Netherlands tel 31 15 2782421; fax 31 15 2782355; email L.A.Robertson@stm.tudelft.nl.

I have been following the discussion re the spelling of CLERK/CLARK/CLARKE with interest as I have CLARK connections just over the border in Norham. I have done a count of the 1881 census for the Eastern border counties, Berwick, Peebles, Roxburgh and Selkirk and the spellings are as follows:- CLARK 478 CLERK 9 CLARKE 19 So it would appear that by 1881 the spelling had normalised to CLARK and that CLERK had almost disappeared. Best regards - Mike Simpson, Penrith, NSW, Australia Email: agene@bigfoot.com HomePage: http://www.bigfoot.com/~agene

> I am searching for the family of Alexander Nisbet, born May 17, 1808 in > Hutton, Berwick.... Alexander's father I believe was William Nisbet born March 1, 1772 in Hutton, mother Elizabeth Moffat. Thank you. Charlotte > cgranewall@home.com Charlotte, I can't help you with your Alexander Nisbet, b. 1808, but I want to let you know that I am searching for information onWelam (William) Nisbeth, b. 1596. He emigrated to Sweden in 1627 to serve as an officer in the Swedish army during the Thirty Years War. Several of his descendants through the years carry the name Alexander Nisbeth, including one of my ancestors. Here is what a translation of the Swedish records have to say about him: "Originating in Scotland where it derived its name from the property of Nisbeth in the county of Berwick and where in 1296 James and John Nisbeth carried the name. In that country it has since branched out to the houses of Nisbeth, Dean, Craigintinie, Dirliton, Grenholm, Rochell and Carfin." "Welam Nisbeth, ... born 1596 in Scotland, descendant of the house of Rochell, arrived in Sweden in 1627, second lieutenant in the Life Guards, captain etc. major, lieutenant colonel 1657, died 1660 at Kunggården, buried in Old Upsala Church were his coat of arms and flag with inscription were placed. Married first to Christina Gray...." If, in your travels back in time, you encounter old Welam (William), would you please let me know? Many thanks. Best regards, Jeanne Nelson -- ABSOLUTELY FAMILY! http://absolutely.anthill.com/ FAMILY NEWSLETTER NEWS http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~bruce/FamNewsNews.htm

As someone reared in Roxburghshire I cannot recall at anytime hearing CLARK, they were always CLERKS. CLARK was English pronunciation. Also there were very few Priests in 1950s as most of the folk were Presbyterian, I remember at High School in Kelso when at the end of Term we were all marched to St Johns Church, the Catholics left the line to go to their church, and there was only a handful. Maxton and Bowden would have been Church of Scotland and the Preacher would have been the " Minister". Selkirk may have had a RC church. Marion researching: Balmer, Jeffrey, Neil, Holmes, Affleck, Ormiston, Renwick, Temple in Roxburghshire Gibb, McDougall, Pringle Hume, Berwickshire 1700's Sims, Fletcher from Langholm 1700's

From the 1881 Census Dwelling: Allendale Cottages Census Place: Medomsley, Durham, England Source: FHL Film 1342190 PRO Ref RG11 Piece 4950 Folio 42 Page 78 Marr Age Sex Birthplace Charles BEADLING M 21 M Burradon, Northumberland, England Rel: Head Occ: Coal Miner Rachael Ann BEADLING M 21 F Haswell, Durham, England Rel: Wife Thomas BEADLING 1 M Tanfield, Durham, England Rel: Son Other Beadling's from Burradon Dwelling: 10 Office Row Census Place: Burradon In Tynemouth, Northumberland, England Source: FHL Film 1342229 PRO Ref RG11 Piece 5088 Folio 14 Page 22 Marr Age Sex Birthplace Robert BEADLING M 48 M Chirton, Northumberland, England Rel: Head Occ: Coal Miner Mary BEADLING M 45 F West Moor, Northumberland, England Rel: Wife Hannah BEADLING U 23 F Willington, Northumberland, England Rel: Daur Occ: Dressmaker Isabella BEADLING U 19 F Burradon, Northumberland, England Rel: Daur Jane BEADLING 12 F Burradon, Northumberland, England Rel: Daur Occ: Scholar Mary BEADLING 4 F Burradon, Northumberland, England Rel: Daur Dwelling: Fryers Terrace Census Place: Longbenton, Northumberland, England Source: FHL Film 1342228 PRO Ref RG11 Piece 5086 Folio 130 Page 39 Marr Age Sex Birthplace Joseph BEADLING M 26 M West Moor, Northumberland, England Rel: Head Occ: Fireman At Coalmine Eng Driv Margaret BEADLING M 23 F Fawdon Sq., Northumberland, England Rel: Wife Luke BEADLING 3 M Burradon, Northumberland, England Rel: Son John BEADLING 10 m M Burradon, Northumberland, England Rel: Son Dwelling: 32 Office Row Census Place: Burradon In Tynemouth, Northumberland, England Source: FHL Film 1342229 PRO Ref RG11 Piece 5088 Folio 17 Page 27 Marr Age Sex Birthplace Thomas BEADLING M 59 M Chirton, Northumberland, England Rel: Head Occ: Coal Miner Margaret BEADLING M 51 F Burradon, Northumberland, England Rel: Wife Isabella BEADLING U 26 F Burradon, Northumberland, England Rel: Daur William BEADLING U 23 M Burradon, Northumberland, England Rel: Son Occ: Coal Miner Margaret BEADLING U 21 F Burradon, Northumberland, England Rel: Daur Occ: Dress Maker Thomas BEADLING U 18 M Burradon, Northumberland, England Rel: Son Occ: Fireman John BEADLING 13 M Burradon, Northumberland, England Rel: Son Occ: Scholar Mary BEADLING 8 F Burradon, Northumberland, England Rel: Daur Occ: Scholar The only Beadling that shows up in the Commonwealth war graves commision site is a J Beadling http://yard.ccta.gov.uk/cwgc/register.nsf A T could transcribe as a J. If you get Rachael birth certificate I could try again for her parents. Lots of Woodwards. Sheila I Hale thomas wrote: > > Greetings and thank you for reading this and for those of you able to assist me a VERY BIG THANK YOU. > > I am seeking ancestors and I have no-one who is able to assist me. I have tried LDS and many web sites to no avail. > > My great grandmother was a RACHEL WOODWARD (fATHER POSSIBLY JOHN). She was born in 1859/60 in or around Northumberland I think. She married a Beadling and had a son named Thomas and a daughter named Nancy. I have been led to believe Thomas died in the first world war but I have not been able to locate any proof. > > I have found no details on Nancy. Rachel married Jonathan Dawson in the early 1890's and has a son named Benjamin. I understand she had sisters or other family. It appears all were coal miners. Rachel, Jonathan and Benjamin emigrated to NZ in the early 1900's. > > RHYMER - (jonathan) All I know is he is a relative, and would have been born probably in the early to mid 1800's. My great grandfather wrote to England requesting the bithcertificate (we have a copy of this request) but no details as to who this person was or the date of birth. My great grandfather would have been born in mid 1800. > > If you can assist - A BIG HUG FOR YOU AND THANKS...............

Often the parish clerk did the recording and not the ministers. Looking thru the Maxton parish records I found an inscription written by my ancestor Robert HANDYSIDE. In it he says he has recorded only those baptisms that had been paid for. HANDYSIDE was the parish schoolmaster at the time. He also was paid to act as Kirk session recorder and spells his own name differently over the years. His children are recorded with different spellings of HANDASYDE also. The Maxton Monumental Inscriptions XIV,published by the Borders Family History has a list of Ministers. It shows David Clerk 1770-1776. No Clerks in the MI's though. >Hi All, > >I have been looking through some of the OPR's and admiring (or trying to >decipher) some of the handwriting over the years. I have noticed that for the >parishes that I am currently searching through that the handwriting styles >appear to change at about the same time periods. This has drawn me to ask if >the same parish priest be responsible for a number of neighboring parishes - or >would there have been 1 priest per parish. > >Does anyone have of know of a list of Parish Priests for the different Border >Parishes? I am particularly interested in Bowden, Maxton and Selkirk around >1750 - 1780. > >The other reason that this is particularly interesting for me is that I have >just found 3 distinct records from around this period where my CLARK family has >been spelt CLERK. If it was the same priest then this is fairly understandable >- however if different priests all spelt it this way then maybe the family at >the time used to spell it this way? I know names change spelling all the time - >but it is interesting to pinpoint a period that a particular spelling may have >been used in. > >Kind regards, >Cameron Clark. >Melbourne, >Australia. >

Good afternoon everyone, this is a popular family - I'm fairly sure I posted data about this couple last week - on thei son John, possibly! > I'm a new researcher and need to know if there > is someone with access to the Whitsome OPR who could look up information > on my g-grandfather, James Millar (er), of Duns? He was born >about 1819 and died May,1855, although I have been unable to >document this. His occupation was a teacher in Duns, and he >married Mary Galbraith 9/11/1846 in Duns. The marriage record >of James & Mary in the IGI is the only record I feel comfortable >with. I do not know the names of James' parents so this presents >a a bit of a problem. > James Miller b. to John Miller & Mary Spark, 2nd March, 1818. Whitsome & Hilton. I've only got the crude data here at work. I know there's siblings, and I know there's more data on the Sparks, but if you want it, it'll be much easier to get the data from the organised database on the machine at home. This information comes from the Scots Origins Index to the OPR. It would probably be worth asking your local LDS to get the OPR film and check the full entries - there might be additional information. lesley Robertson ******************************************************************** Dr Lesley A. Robertson CBiol FIBiol Kluyver Laboratory for Biotechnology, Delft University of Technology, Julianalaan 67, 2628BC, Delft,The Netherlands tel 31 15 2782421; fax 31 15 2782355; email L.A.Robertson@stm.tudelft.nl.