Acidently stumbled on this one <A HREF="http://users.ox.ac.uk/~peter/workhouse/index.html">http://users.ox.ac.uk/~peter/workhouse/index.html</A> Regards AudreyM

Hello Everone The youngest Marriage in my tree are my 2 X Gt Grandfather and Grandmother.- James Montgomery Miskelly and Elizabeth Haffen/Haughan They were married at Gretna Green on the 15th October 1853 and both aged 20years. The officiating "Minister" was Simon Lang who conducted many marriages at Gretna Green and I was fortunate to obtain a copy of the record from registers that were at that time held in a private collection - They are now I believe with the Society of Genealogists in London. Regards AudreyM

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The oldest relative I have is Mary Scott BROWN born 1880 at Ashkirk died in 1982 at the age of 102. As for marraiges my ancestors all waited till they were a bit older most being over 26 and my gandparents being 38 and 40 years of age.

>From: Jim Balmer <[email protected]> >Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2003 14:33:31 +0000 > >Lesley Robertson wrote: > >>John's illegitimacy wouldn't have mattered. Once his mother (and probably >>his father) had been hauled before their Kirk Elders and repented, that >>would have been it. > >Would have been what? Would John then have been officially legitimate? >Would his father and mother have been deemed to be married? What if his >father was unknown? > No, I meant that would have been the end of official recriminations. "it" - the end of the story. The original question was whether he would have had to marry outside his home parish because his parents hadn't wed. He wouldn't have been able to inherit (unless specifically mentioned in a will), but they wouldn't have "punished" him by making problems about his own marriage, etc. They reserved any humiliation for the "guilty couple" - including such things as making them sit on special stools at the front of the church during services for specified numbers of weeks to express their repentance. Lesley Robertson _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

Lesley Robertson wrote: > John's illegitimacy wouldn't have mattered. Once his mother (and > probably his father) had been hauled before their Kirk Elders and > repented, that would have been it. Would have been what? Would John then have been officially legitimate? Would his father and mother have been deemed to be married? What if his father was unknown? Jim Balmer

>From: Richard Francis <[email protected]> >Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2003 20:47:23 +0200 > >My gg grandparents (John CUNNINGHAM and Janet DAVIDSON) were married in >Coldstream on 18 April 1841, although both were resident in Greenlaw. This >may be related to the fact that John appears to have been illegitimate. > John's illegitimacy wouldn't have mattered. Once his mother (and probably his father) had been hauled before their Kirk Elders and repented, that would have been it. Coldstream was a popular place of 'irregular marriages" (what we would consider today as civil weddings), and it's possible that this is why they maqried there. If this was the case, it might be worth checking the Greenlaw Kirk Session so see whether they were required to explain themselves to the Kirk after the wedding (this often happened once the wife began putting on weight). If you're looking for his parents, and know where he was born, the relevant Kirk session might be helpful - the elders were worse than tabloid reporters.... Lesley Robertson _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail

Hi, My gg grandparents (John CUNNINGHAM and Janet DAVIDSON) were married in Coldstream on 18 April 1841, although both were resident in Greenlaw. This may be related to the fact that John appears to have been illegitimate. Would SKS have access to the records of Coldstream marriages and be able to look up further details? Thanks in advance! Richard Francis

Hi all I am right in thinking that in Scotland it is (or was) the case that the child was automatically legitimised if the parents subsequently married? So that for inheritance s/he would be in the same position as any other 'lawful' child? I think there may have been another 'clause' to the effect that this only worked if the parents were free to marry when the child was born. Comments???? Judy

Hi David, The Cumberland Place Names Index has the following in Kirkandrews on Esk parish: Braehead, NY 36 70 Browhead, NY 38 72 And I had always thought the two were the same when I came across them in the parish records! Petra ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Armstrong" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2003 1:12 AM Subject: [BORDER] KAonEsk/Canonbie~ARMSTRONG & EDGAR > On 20 June 1746 John ARMSTRONG married Sarah EDGAR at KirkAndrews on > Esk. I believe they lived at Brayhead (Farm?), although I haven't > managed to locate that on a map. > > Ever hopeful! > cheers > David Armstrong > Sydney

Hi Everyone, I haven't posted anything for a while but might have just cracked a lead on my ancestry in the KirkAndrews on Esk/Canonbie area on the border of Cumberland and Dumfries. On 20 June 1746 John ARMSTRONG married Sarah EDGAR at KirkAndrews on Esk. I believe they lived at Brayhead (Farm?), although I haven't managed to locate that on a map. Their children were: 1747 Jane 1749 John d 1752 1751 William 1754 John d 1758 1756 Thomas my 4G grandfather 1761 Sarah 1767 Fergus John ARMSTRONG snr died in June 1778. There was also a William ARMSTRONG, aged 91 who died at Brayhead in 1772 who I suspect is maybe John's father. Sarah Edgar was possibly baptised to Thomas and Jane at KAonE in 1718 making her 28 when married. Is there anyone on the list with links to any of the above. Ever hopeful! cheers David Armstrong Sydney

William Whinfield was vicar at Cornhill and curate at Branxton NBL from about 1755 to 1788. Questions: 1. Has anyone picked him up in Coldingham BEW after 1788 when he seems to have retired from Cornhill NBL? 2. When did he die? 3. Where is he buried? Thanks Cyril

Hello J Kesner & list, I am also looking for a William LAIDLER/LAIDLAW and of course any antecedents. My William was born around 1814, somewhere in Northumberland, possibly around Shotton in Kirknewton parish (or other possibilities further south), but he just gives "Northumberland" in the 1861 & 1871 censuses so he may not have been sure where he was born. I have been working my way through parish & non-conformist registers in that area but have not yet come across a family as per J Kesner's email, but will keep an eye out. Shepherds and hinds seem to have been quite mobile in the north of Northumberland, as I have noticed the same names pop in successive registers. As someone recently pointed out on the DUR - NBL list, if attached to a particular dissenting minister, some people were prepared to take their children quite a distance to be baptised and presumably at least occasionally to attend services. Do you have any more information about the Glendale/Ford family? I am very interested in any William LAIDLER/LAIDLAWs born around the 1780s, to eliminate or investigate further. My William's father could well have been born around then & the naming patterns of my William's children suggest that his own father was likely to have been called William . My William LAIDLER/LAIDLAW married Isabel(la) Whitehead, born in Scotland. I have not yet been able to find this marriage. His third son was called Joseph - he had seven sons & one daughter that I know about. By the way, I forget the correct name for the character, but I suspect the "p" in "Jepe" will probably in fact have been the now archaic character used for double "s". Regards, Ingrid, NZ

--part1_44.366118a0.2cbb0d6a_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --part1_44.366118a0.2cbb0d6a_boundary Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <[email protected]> Received: from rly-xj01.mx.aol.com (rly-xj01.mail.aol.com [172.20.116.38]) by air-xj01.mail.aol.com (v96.8) with ESMTP id MAILINXJ12-4fe3f899f9f3a4; Sun, 12 Oct 2003 14:38:50 -0400 Received: from lists5.rootsweb.com (lists5.rootsweb.com [207.40.200.41]) by rly-xj01.mx.aol.com (v96.8) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINXJ18-4fe3f899f9f3a4; Sun, 12 Oct 2003 14:38:26 -0400 Received: (from [email protected]) by lists5.rootsweb.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) id h9CIbWdL009340; Sun, 12 Oct 2003 12:37:32 -0600 Resent-Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2003 12:37:32 -0600 X-Original-Sender: [email protected] Sun Oct 12 12:37:31 2003 From: [email protected] Message-ID: <[email protected]> Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2003 14:37:58 EDT Old-To: [email protected] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10709 Subject: [BORDER] Laidler research Resent-Message-ID: <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Resent-From: [email protected] X-Mailing-List: <[email protected]> archive/latest/11378 X-Loop: [email protected] Precedence: list Resent-Sender: [email protected] X-AOL-IP: 207.40.200.41 I am searching for information on William Laidler, a shepherd, b. abt 1780 in. Scotland (shown on 1841 Census of Glendale, Ford, Northumberland with daughters Jane b. abt. 1811, Jessie, b. abt. 1820, and Joseph b. abt. 1823) Unable to verify birth site of William, Jane or Jessie (or Jepe as it was on the census) J. Kesner ==== BORDER Mailing List ==== Borders includes Selkirkshire, Roxburghshire, Berwickshire, Peebleshire. We also welcome family researchers for Dumfries and Galloway, Kirkudbrightshire, Northumberland and Cumbria --part1_44.366118a0.2cbb0d6a_boundary--

I am searching for information on William Laidler, a shepherd, b. abt 1780 in. Scotland (shown on 1841 Census of Glendale, Ford, Northumberland with daughters Jane b. abt. 1811, Jessie, b. abt. 1820, and Joseph b. abt. 1823) Unable to verify birth site of William, Jane or Jessie (or Jepe as it was on the census) J. Kesner

Hi Everyone Just to say that the Cumberland Surnames list has now been updated and now has 2654 names listed, please check your entries for any errors and advise me of any corrections and additions. This is proving a very useful aid particularly for those who are new to family history and those with brickwalls. You are now almost certain to find someone with a common interest, please make use of this. To access the list go to 'www.dfnoble.com/CULnames' Regards Gerald Sandwith _________________________________________________________________ On the move? Get Hotmail on your mobile phone http://www.msn.co.uk/msnmobile

Could it possibly be Cramlington in Northumberland? Winifred ----- Original Message ----- From: "wally anderson" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, October 10, 2003 2:44 AM Subject: [BORDER] Town/city > In the 1891 census a Jane Anderson is listed as br in Crainlington.It was hard to read.Would anybody recognize this place? > Wally > > > ==== BORDER Mailing List ==== > Borders includes Selkirkshire, Roxburghshire, Berwickshire, Peebleshire. We also welcome family researchers for Dumfries and Galloway, Kirkudbrightshire, Northumberland and Cumbria > >

Hi Wally, Could be Cramlington (in Northumberland)? Best regards - Mike Penrith, NSW, Australia

Hi there everyone on the list - still scratching my head over where my George BURN and Agnes TELFORD are. First born child in Wooler around 1823/24. George BURN was a carter/coachman travelling to Edinburgh/Wooler. We presume Wooler was their home town/base - searched a few films for the area with no luck at all. The family may have been Presbyterian non-conformists. My cousin is trying to search the Union Bridge marriages in the hope their names will crop up. Does anyone have any ideas I may not have covered ? Any chance of Gretna Green marriage lists ? thanks - Margaret Flaiban - Adelaide South Australia

Could it be Cramlington in Northumberland, a little north of Newcastle? Petra ----- Original Message ----- From: "wally anderson" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, October 10, 2003 2:44 AM Subject: [BORDER] Town/city > In the 1891 census a Jane Anderson is listed as br in Crainlington.It was hard to read.Would anybody recognize this place? > Wally >