Agree. Tina Vickery Representative at Large. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sherri" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2010 6:02 AM Subject: Re: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Call the Question > The question has been called on Motion 2009/10-23 by Tina Vickery and > seconded by Jeff Kemp. As stated below by Tina, a 2/3 majority is > required > to pass, which would call for an immediate vote on the motion being > discussed. > > Please signify your response to the Calling of the Question by either > "agree" (which would indicate that your choice is that a vote on Motion > 2009/10-23 would be taken immediately) or "disagree" (which would indicate > that discussion should continue on Motion 2009/10-23). > > > Sherri Bradley > National Coordinator > USGenWeb Project > Information about the USGenWeb Project at http://usgenweb.org > Advisory Board Agenda http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.php > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf Of Tina S. Vickery > Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2010 12:32 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Call the Question > > Sherri, I believe the phrase in Parlimentary Procedure is "Calling the > question". > > "The motion to call the previous question requires a second, may not be > debated, and requires a two-thirds majority to pass. If it passes, a vote > on > > the pending motion is taken immediately. If it fails, discussion continues > on the pending motion." > > I call the question on MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of the Grievance > Procedures. > > Tina Vickery > Representive at Large > > USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in > the subject and the body of the message > > > USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

disagree Linda K Lewis * sent from Treo * -----Original Message----- From: "Sherri" <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: 4/22/10 4:02 AM Subject: Re: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Call the Question The question has been called on Motion 2009/10-23 by Tina Vickery and seconded by Jeff Kemp. As stated below by Tina, a 2/3 majority is required to pass, which would call for an immediate vote on the motion being discussed. Please signify your response to the Calling of the Question by either "agree" (which would indicate that your choice is that a vote on Motion 2009/10-23 would be taken immediately) or "disagree" (which would indicate that discussion should continue on Motion 2009/10-23). Sherri Bradley National Coordinator USGenWeb Project Information about the USGenWeb Project at http://usgenweb.org Advisory Board Agenda http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.php -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Tina S. Vickery Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2010 12:32 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Call the Question

Which was last week ago................. Alice Allen NENC CC Rep *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 4/12/2010 at 6:08 AM [email protected] wrote: >Please note that the message forwarded by David Samuelsen earlier this >morning was incorrect. Applications are being accepted through 15 April >2010 as indicated here below. > >Sherri > >********************** >Reposting as a reminder - applications are being accepted through 15 April >2010. > > >Sherri Bradley >National Coordinator >USGenWeb Project >Information about the USGenWeb Project at http://usgenweb.org >Advisory Board Agenda http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.php > ><snip>

I also disagree. For pretty much the same reasons. Alice NENC CC Rep *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 4/22/2010 at 7:30 AM [email protected] wrote: >I don't think two days is sufficient time to allow for discussion. I >disagree. > > >Dale Grimm > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On >Behalf Of Sherri >Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2010 6:02 AM >To: [email protected] >Subject: Re: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Call the Question > >The question has been called on Motion 2009/10-23 by Tina Vickery and >seconded by Jeff Kemp. As stated below by Tina, a 2/3 majority is required >to pass, which would call for an immediate vote on the motion being >discussed. > >Please signify your response to the Calling of the Question by either >"agree" (which would indicate that your choice is that a vote on Motion >2009/10-23 would be taken immediately) or "disagree" (which would indicate >that discussion should continue on Motion 2009/10-23). > > >Sherri Bradley >National Coordinator >USGenWeb Project >Information about the USGenWeb Project at http://usgenweb.org Advisory >Board >Agenda http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.php >

It's illegal to vote on an illegal motion. Sturgis page 87, "POINT OF ORDER, Purpose, To call the attention of the assembly and of the presiding officer to a violation of the rules ...." Sturgis page 221, Rights of Members #11, "To have a fair hearing ...." Sturgis page 221, Rights of Members can only be limited by a specific limitation in the bylaws. The Rights of Members to have a fair hearing, cannot be limited or denied in Procedures. The reason for this is so a minority (14 members of the AB) can't deny or limit the rights of the majority (1,794 USGenWeb members). Therefore this is an illegal motion. W. David Samuelsen SWSC

This part rings of censorship.... "The consequences for breaking the confidentiality of the grievance process will be: "..... ". Consequences for breaching the confidentiality of the grievance process by someone outside of the grievance will be determined on a case-by-case basis by the Advisory Board that may include a disciplinary hearing and penalties applied based on the results of the findings." In example: I have no part in the grievance, but I know of grief between John and Joe, yet if I talk about it to anyone I face a consequence???? That's like laying a gag order down and I have to wonder how this is going to fly. Also, I thought you might want to know that you have duplicate paragraphs at the end of the page. Of the last three paragraphs, the first two are dupes. Colleen On 4/20/2010 7:18 PM, Sherri wrote: > Presented by Larry Flesher and seconded by Ann Allen Geoghegan and dated 19 > April 2010, the motion reads: > > The grievance process begins when the grievance is filed with the Grievance > Committee. Once received by the Grievance Committee Chair, a notice will be > submitted to the Advisory Board and posted on the EXEC list that includes > the names of all parties involved and a short (5-10 words max) description > of the violation. This will serve as the Advisory Board's cue to cease and > desist any involvement until and unless the grievance resolution is > appealed. > > The grievance confidentiality begins when the grievance is filed with the > Grievance Committee. The party filing the grievance must acknowledge AT THE > TIME OF FILING that they understand and agree to abide by the > confidentiality of the grievance process. All other parties must > acknowledge AT THE TIME OF NOTIFICATION that a grievance has been filed that > they understand and agree to abide by the confidentiality of the grievance > process. > > Grievance confidentiality extends to all parties (including the mediators, > arbitrators and GC members) from the time the grievance process begins. > Failure by one of the parties to agree to abide by the confidentiality of > the grievance process is grounds to automatically and immediately lose the > grievance. > > The consequences for breaking the confidentiality of the grievance process > will be: > > . If the grievance team determines one of the parties to the grievance has > broken confidentiality, that party automatically and immediately loses the > grievance with no option to re-file. > > . A general statement such as "I've filed a grievance and cannot discuss it" > in answer to a question is not considered a breach. > > . If the confidentiality is breached by someone outside of the parties > involved, the parties involved should not be penalized. > > . If the confidentiality is broken by the mediator, an arbitrator or the GC > representative to the mediation/arbitration portion of the grievance, the > grievance gets reassigned to give the parties involved another chance to get > the issue resolved. > > . Consequences for breaching the confidentiality of the grievance process by > someone outside of the grievance will be determined on a case-by-case basis > by the Advisory Board that may include a disciplinary hearing and penalties > applied based on the results of the findings. > > > Specifically, the following modifications to the Standing Rules will be > made: > > Section V of the Standing Rules, item E, number 1 will be modified to read: > The grievance process begins when a complaint is made by any of the > following: (Items a-c remain unchanged.) In addition, the following will > be added as a separate item after the last paragraph of number 1. "The > grievance confidentiality begins when the grievance is filed with the > Grievance Committee and extends to all parties (including the mediators, > arbitrators and GC members) from the time the grievance process begins. > > Item E, number 2 will be modified to read: The initial complaint should be > brought to the Grievance Coordinator, and must include the following > information: (Items a-f remain unchanged.) Item g will be added, which will > state "An acknowledgement that the member understands that the > confidentiality of the grievance process begins when the complaint is filed > and that they agree to abide by the confidentiality of the grievance > process." > > Item E, the first paragraph of subsection number 4 will be modified to read: > "Upon receiving the initial complaint, the Grievance Coordinator will assign > it a number, and appoint one of the permanent committee members to review > the complaint to determine whether it meets the requirements outlined in > subsection C of this Section. At the same time, the Grievance Committee > Chair will send a notice to the Advisory Board and to be posted on the > BOARD-EXEC mail list that includes the names of all parties involved and a > short (5-10 word max) description of the violation. This will serve as the > Advisory Board's cue to cease and desist any involvement until and unless > the grievance resolution is appealed." > > The second paragraph of subsection 4 will be modified to read: "The review > of the complaint will result in an "accept" or "reject" determination from > the Committee Member assigned. The review at this level should assume that > the facts stated in the complaint are true, and the determination of the > viability of the grievance made based upon a review of the by-laws, > policies, or procedures alleged to have been violated. The recommendation > and the reasons therefore, shall be provided to the Grievance Committee as a > whole, and voted upon." > > The fourth paragraph of subsection 4 will be modified to read: "If accepted > as a viable grievance, the parties shall be so informed. The parties must > acknowledge at the time of notification that a grievance has been filed and > that they understand and agree to abide by the confidentiality of the > grievance process. Failure to agree to abide by the confidentiality of the > grievance process is grounds to automatically and immediately lose the > grievance. A Committee Member, volunteer mediator and two volunteer > arbitrators will be assigned. The parties to the grievance, the Committee > Member, mediator, and arbitrators will then be subscribed to a private email > list.” > > The first paragraph of subsection 6 will be modified to read: " When the > team is seated, the parties shall be so advised by the Mediator. Everyone > will be reminded that the grievance confidentiality extends to all parties > (including the mediators, arbitrators and GC members) from the time the > grievance process begins and that failure to abide by the confidentiality of > the grievance process is grounds to automatically and immediately lose the > grievance. The parties shall have seventy-two (72) hours to submit to the > Mediator a written statement of their position on the issues of the dispute. > The mediator shall provide the position statements to the team members for > their review." > > The current subsection 9 will be renumbered to subsection 10. > > The following subsection will be inserted between the current section 8 and > the former subsection 9 (newly renumbered to section 10) and will be > numbered as subsection 9: > > The consequences for breaking the confidentiality of the grievance process > will be: > > . If the grievance team determines one of the parties to the grievance has > broken the confidentiality, that party automatically and immediately loses > the grievance with no option to re-file. > > . A general statement such as "I've filed a grievance and cannot discuss it" > in answer to a question is not considered a breach. > > . If the confidentiality is breached by someone outside of the parties > involved, the parties involved should not be penalized, unless it is evident > that a party to the grievance is intentionally feeding information, after > the grievance process began, to the one that broke the confidentiality. > > . If the confidentiality is broken by the mediator, an arbitrator or the GC > representative in the mediation/arbitration portion of the grievance, the > grievance gets reassigned to give the parties involved another chance to get > the issue resolved. Consequences for the GC representative are referenced > in Section V of the Standard Rules, Subsection A, under the “Qualifications” > item. (Link to the section above.) > b. Consequences for breaching the confidentiality of the grievance process > by someone outside of the grievance will be determined on a case-by-case > basis by the Advisory Board that may include a disciplinary hearing and > penalties applied based on the results of the findings. > > . Consequences for breaching the confidentiality of the grievance process by > someone outside of the grievance will be determined on a case-by-case basis > by the Advisory Board that may include a disciplinary hearing and penalties > applied based on the results of the findings. > > Discussion is now open. If you have no discussion, please indicate by > stating "No Discussion". > > > Sherri Bradley > National Coordinator > USGenWeb Project > Information about the USGenWeb Project at http://usgenweb.org > Advisory Board Agenda http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.php > > > > > > > > USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

I don't think two days is sufficient time to allow for discussion. I disagree. Dale Grimm -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Sherri Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2010 6:02 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Call the Question The question has been called on Motion 2009/10-23 by Tina Vickery and seconded by Jeff Kemp. As stated below by Tina, a 2/3 majority is required to pass, which would call for an immediate vote on the motion being discussed. Please signify your response to the Calling of the Question by either "agree" (which would indicate that your choice is that a vote on Motion 2009/10-23 would be taken immediately) or "disagree" (which would indicate that discussion should continue on Motion 2009/10-23). Sherri Bradley National Coordinator USGenWeb Project Information about the USGenWeb Project at http://usgenweb.org Advisory Board Agenda http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.php -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Tina S. Vickery Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2010 12:32 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Call the Question Sherri, I believe the phrase in Parlimentary Procedure is "Calling the question". "The motion to call the previous question requires a second, may not be debated, and requires a two-thirds majority to pass. If it passes, a vote on the pending motion is taken immediately. If it fails, discussion continues on the pending motion." I call the question on MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of the Grievance Procedures. Tina Vickery Representive at Large USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I am getting a little tired of the foolishness going on within this project. I don't know about other AB members, but I do not wake up each morning plotting out ways to screw other USGenWeb members. I have no intent to deny anyone anything. Nor have I consulted with other AB members on ways that we, as a body, or I, as an individual, can harm other members. My only intention is to be fair to all members. A grievance is, in essence, a hearing. It is an independent committee deciding if one member has caused harm to another member. And those making the decision must look at the evidence submitted, rather than listening to public opinion. There are those within the project who apparently desire to have grievances settled in the arena of public opinion. They would rather grievances be decided by "he said, she said." This is not in the best interests of the parties involved, the project or the members. And it could not be considered a fair hearing. Section XIV of the bylaws gives the Grievance Committee sole responsibility to hear grievances and to act upon them. It does give them authority to exact punishment. And the bylaws give the AB the authority to set the Grievance Policies and Procedures. This authority was not seized by the AB or by the GC, but rather given to them by the membership. There are also members within USGenWeb who appear to delight in throwing wild accusations with little or no evidence to back up their claims. And in the few occasions when evidence is presented it is flawed or so illogical as to be laughable. These wild accusations, whose only intent seems to be to belittle another member, are entirely out of line. If you believe that an AB member has caused you harm, the proper procedure is to file a grievance against that person. David Samuelson has offered an objection to the motion before the AB. I have read through the motion, the bylaws and his objection several times and I cannot find any logical basis for his objections. The AB is not seizing any authority to exact punishment. The GC is not seizing any authority. We are merely clarifying how the authority granted to us by the membership is to be executed. I pay attention to reasonable, well-thought-out objections. I will not take any emotional outbursts seriously. The attached message is another one of those emotional outbursts that are lacking of any logic or reasonable thought. The motion before the board does not deprive members of any rights. If you will notice, it states that the GC has to determine that confidentiality has been breached. And that would be done according to GC rules and regulations. The motion does not deprive any member of any rights to a fair hearing. A grievant must have enough respect for the grievance process to keep his mouth shut. If he doesn't, he should expect no cooperation from the committee or the membership. The last paragraph is very troubling and bordering on libel. If you believe that I am corrupt and that I have wronged you, then the proper avenue is through the grievance process. Dale Grimm _____ From: Mary White [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2010 12:11 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [GenWebStalkers.com Blog] AB Corruption It's bad enough that some members of the Advisory Board mock each other on their Sekrit Sandbox list (Board-Exec), but a real lack of maturity is displayed when they make fun of one AB member who respects the USGenWeb Bylaws and Rights of Members to have fair hearings. We are speaking of W. David Samuelsen, who today posted a message on the Board list protesting the illegality of a proposed motion under discussion. The motion wants to try and hide corruption within the USGenWeb, by making the entire grievance process confidential. The motion seeks to amend the Grievance Committee Procedures, by adding confidentiality rules. In two places the motion calls for the parties involved in a grievance to "automatically and immediately lose the grievance," if they talk about the grievance with anyone outside of the Grievance Committee. Hence the motion is illegal, because both Sturgis and the Bylaws give members the right to a fair hearing. And Sturgis, the USGenWeb parliamentary authority (the AB rule book), states that the rights of members can only be limited in the bylaws. The reason for this is to prevent the AB from what they are currently attempting to do, subvert the authority of the membership who votes into place bylaws and bylaw amendments. Some members of the AB believe the USGenWeb can be made a better place for the membership, more honorable and more honest, via hiding the corruption of leadership by sweeping it under the rug. Out of sight, out of mind, by making it illegal to talk about and expose crime in the USGenWeb. To say this is anti-American is putting it politely. So who said what? In reply to David, AB member Dale Grimm wrote, "And water will stop running downhill and giant asteroids will destroy our planet," to which Jeff Kemp added, "I heard Kellogg's is looking for a new mascot for their 'Fruit Loop' cereal box!" We will have more to say as to why Dale Grimm and Jeff Kemp (aka Mutt & Jeff) are two of the corrupt members of the Advisory Board, later. Meanwhile we suggest both resign from the AB, and join a project more suitable for their maturity, The USGenWeb Kidz Project. Mary White -- Posted By Mary White to GenWebStalkers.com <http://genwenstalkers.blogspot.com/2010/04/ab-corruption.html> Blog at 4/21/2010 09:07:00 PM

The question has been called on Motion 2009/10-23 by Tina Vickery and seconded by Jeff Kemp. As stated below by Tina, a 2/3 majority is required to pass, which would call for an immediate vote on the motion being discussed. Please signify your response to the Calling of the Question by either "agree" (which would indicate that your choice is that a vote on Motion 2009/10-23 would be taken immediately) or "disagree" (which would indicate that discussion should continue on Motion 2009/10-23). Sherri Bradley National Coordinator USGenWeb Project Information about the USGenWeb Project at http://usgenweb.org Advisory Board Agenda http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.php -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Tina S. Vickery Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2010 12:32 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Call the Question Sherri, I believe the phrase in Parlimentary Procedure is "Calling the question". "The motion to call the previous question requires a second, may not be debated, and requires a two-thirds majority to pass. If it passes, a vote on the pending motion is taken immediately. If it fails, discussion continues on the pending motion." I call the question on MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of the Grievance Procedures. Tina Vickery Representive at Large USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Jeff, your post, below, is out of line. Personal insults are inappropriate on any public mail list. An apology is an order. Sherri Bradley National Coordinator USGenWeb Project -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Jeff Kemp/Kemp Family Chronicles Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 10:09 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of theGrievanceProcedures I heard Kellogg's is looking for a new mascot for their "Fruit Loop" cereal box! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dale Grimm" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 8:39 PM Subject: Re: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of theGrievanceProcedures > And water will stop running downhill and giant asteroids will destroy our > planet. > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf Of W David Samuelsen > Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 3:05 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of the > GrievanceProcedures > > Adamant opposition > > The day the motion become official, is the day the states lose their > sovereignty, and all and everything are subjected to the AB which at that > point is no longer a AB but a dictatorship junta. > > The motion is 100 percent contrary to Sturgis and bylaws. > > Neither the GC or AB has the authority to impose any penalties WITHOUT > consent or approval of the general membership at all. > > Only the general membership has the authority to decide the penalties. > > Currently the bylaws restrict the GC to mediation and arbitration. It does > NOT give the AB any authority to impose any penalties at all. > > W. David Samuelsen > USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in > the subject and the body of the message > > USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

David, I thought very hard before I called the question. I would have hoped that over the two months of discussion that you would have participated and contributed on this issue as others have, constructively. Sadly, you did not and have just continued each time it has come to a vote to yell (with this note, to new volumes). I am very sorry that you couldn't articulate constructively on this issue. As I said earlier, This grand standing is not helpful nor is it becoming and quite frankly is getting tedious. Tina ___ Sherri, I believe the phrase in Parlimentary Procedure is "Calling the question". " The motion to call the previous question requires a second, may not be debated, and requires a two-thirds majority to pass. If it passes, a vote on the pending motion is taken immediately. If it fails, discussion continues on the pending motion." I call the question on MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of the Grievance Procedures. Tina Vickery Representive at Large __ ----- Original Message ----- From: "W David Samuelsen" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]>; "Tina Vickery" <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 11:01 PM Subject: Re: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of the GrievanceProcedures > Tina, > > YES, I AM YELLING AT YOU AND OTHERS WHO ARE PUSHINBG TO TAKE AWAY THE > RIGHT OF THE MEMBERS. You are willing to risk the breakup of the Project. > > The right rest with the general membership to decide the penalties. > > Neither the AB or the GC has any right to do so without specified in the > bylaws itself. > > Sturgis is very clear on this point. Sturgis is NOT alone. All other > Parliamentary Procedures said same thing. > > TRASHBIN this illegal motion. > > David > > > > On 4/21/2010 6:40 PM, Tina S. Vickery wrote: >> David, >> >> The Advisory Board has been discussing this motion for a long time. All >> I >> hear is your stating, adamantly, in fact, your dissatisfaction. I am >> sure >> they are your very strenuous convictions as to what you *feel* is wrong >> with >> the motion and I respect that, *but* I have yet to see you contribute >> anything constructive to word this motion to allow it to fall within your >> convictions and, I hope, those convictions of the Project members that >> you >> represent. >> >> You have not suggested any changes, all you have done is "yell" at the >> rest >> of us and in turn at the very members that we each represented while we >> have >> thoughtfully constructed this motion over the last few months with input >> from them. >> >> I repeat, if you have nothing but rhetoric to contribute to this motion >> than >> quietly state "no further discussion" and allow it to come to a vote. >> You >> do have a vote. This grand standing is not helpful nor is it becoming >> and >> quite frankly is getting tedious. >> >> Do you have anything constructive to add to this discussion? >> >> Tina >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "W David Samuelsen"<[email protected]> >> To:<[email protected]> >> Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 3:04 PM >> Subject: Re: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of the >> GrievanceProcedures >> >> >>> Adamant opposition >>> >>> The day the motion become official, is the day the states lose their >>> sovereignty, and all and everything are subjected to the AB which at >>> that point is no longer a AB but a dictatorship junta. >>> >>> The motion is 100 percent contrary to Sturgis and bylaws. >>> >>> Neither the GC or AB has the authority to impose any penalties WITHOUT >>> consent or approval of the general membership at all. >>> >>> Only the general membership has the authority to decide the penalties. >>> >>> Currently the bylaws restrict the GC to mediation and arbitration. It >>> does NOT give the AB any authority to impose any penalties at all. >>> >>> W. David Samuelsen >>> USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes >>> in the subject and the body of the message >> >> USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes >> in the subject and the body of the message >> >>

Sherri, I believe the phrase in Parlimentary Procedure is "Calling the question". "The motion to call the previous question requires a second, may not be debated, and requires a two-thirds majority to pass. If it passes, a vote on the pending motion is taken immediately. If it fails, discussion continues on the pending motion." I call the question on MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of the Grievance Procedures. Tina Vickery Representive at Large

Second Jeff ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tina S. Vickery" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 11:31 PM Subject: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Call the Question > Sherri, I believe the phrase in Parlimentary Procedure is "Calling the > question". > > "The motion to call the previous question requires a second, may not be > debated, and requires a two-thirds majority to pass. If it passes, a vote > on > the pending motion is taken immediately. If it fails, discussion continues > on the pending motion." > > I call the question on MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of the Grievance > Procedures. > > Tina Vickery > Representive at Large > > USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message >

Well, don't we look professional here! Alice NENC CC Rep *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 4/21/2010 at 9:09 PM [email protected] wrote: >I heard Kellogg's is looking for a new mascot for their "Fruit Loop" >cereal >box! > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Dale Grimm" <[email protected]> >To: <[email protected]> >Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 8:39 PM >Subject: Re: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of >theGrievanceProcedures > > >> And water will stop running downhill and giant asteroids will destroy our >> planet. >> >>

And water will stop running downhill and giant asteroids will destroy our planet. -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of W David Samuelsen Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 3:05 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of the GrievanceProcedures Adamant opposition The day the motion become official, is the day the states lose their sovereignty, and all and everything are subjected to the AB which at that point is no longer a AB but a dictatorship junta. The motion is 100 percent contrary to Sturgis and bylaws. Neither the GC or AB has the authority to impose any penalties WITHOUT consent or approval of the general membership at all. Only the general membership has the authority to decide the penalties. Currently the bylaws restrict the GC to mediation and arbitration. It does NOT give the AB any authority to impose any penalties at all. W. David Samuelsen USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I heard Kellogg's is looking for a new mascot for their "Fruit Loop" cereal box! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dale Grimm" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 8:39 PM Subject: Re: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of theGrievanceProcedures > And water will stop running downhill and giant asteroids will destroy our > planet. > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf Of W David Samuelsen > Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 3:05 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of the > GrievanceProcedures > > Adamant opposition > > The day the motion become official, is the day the states lose their > sovereignty, and all and everything are subjected to the AB which at that > point is no longer a AB but a dictatorship junta. > > The motion is 100 percent contrary to Sturgis and bylaws. > > Neither the GC or AB has the authority to impose any penalties WITHOUT > consent or approval of the general membership at all. > > Only the general membership has the authority to decide the penalties. > > Currently the bylaws restrict the GC to mediation and arbitration. It does > NOT give the AB any authority to impose any penalties at all. > > W. David Samuelsen > USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in > the subject and the body of the message > > USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

That will be the death of the Project if the AB continue to try to take away the right of the members of the Project. I am considering writing an open letter to many, including one who has the authority to expel the Project from the Association. This Project is only one that is going in opposite direction of the membership. David On 4/21/2010 7:39 PM, Dale Grimm wrote: > And water will stop running downhill and giant asteroids will destroy our > planet. > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf Of W David Samuelsen > Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 3:05 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of the > GrievanceProcedures > > Adamant opposition > > The day the motion become official, is the day the states lose their > sovereignty, and all and everything are subjected to the AB which at that > point is no longer a AB but a dictatorship junta. > > The motion is 100 percent contrary to Sturgis and bylaws. > > Neither the GC or AB has the authority to impose any penalties WITHOUT > consent or approval of the general membership at all. > > Only the general membership has the authority to decide the penalties. > > Currently the bylaws restrict the GC to mediation and arbitration. It does > NOT give the AB any authority to impose any penalties at all. > > W. David Samuelsen > USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in > the subject and the body of the message > > USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

David, The Advisory Board has been discussing this motion for a long time. All I hear is your stating, adamantly, in fact, your dissatisfaction. I am sure they are your very strenuous convictions as to what you *feel* is wrong with the motion and I respect that, *but* I have yet to see you contribute anything constructive to word this motion to allow it to fall within your convictions and, I hope, those convictions of the Project members that you represent. You have not suggested any changes, all you have done is "yell" at the rest of us and in turn at the very members that we each represented while we have thoughtfully constructed this motion over the last few months with input from them. I repeat, if you have nothing but rhetoric to contribute to this motion than quietly state "no further discussion" and allow it to come to a vote. You do have a vote. This grand standing is not helpful nor is it becoming and quite frankly is getting tedious. Do you have anything constructive to add to this discussion? Tina ----- Original Message ----- From: "W David Samuelsen" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 3:04 PM Subject: Re: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of the GrievanceProcedures > Adamant opposition > > The day the motion become official, is the day the states lose their > sovereignty, and all and everything are subjected to the AB which at > that point is no longer a AB but a dictatorship junta. > > The motion is 100 percent contrary to Sturgis and bylaws. > > Neither the GC or AB has the authority to impose any penalties WITHOUT > consent or approval of the general membership at all. > > Only the general membership has the authority to decide the penalties. > > Currently the bylaws restrict the GC to mediation and arbitration. It > does NOT give the AB any authority to impose any penalties at all. > > W. David Samuelsen > USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

No Discussion. Cyndie SP Rep. -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Sherri Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2010 6:18 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [BOARD] MOTION 2009/10-23 - Augmentation of the Grievance Procedures Presented by Larry Flesher and seconded by Ann Allen Geoghegan and dated 19 April 2010, the motion reads: The grievance process begins when the grievance is filed with the Grievance Committee.  Once received by the Grievance Committee Chair, a notice will be submitted to the Advisory Board and posted on the EXEC list that includes the names of all parties involved and a short (5-10 words max) description of the violation.  This will serve as the Advisory Board's cue to cease and desist any involvement until and unless the grievance resolution is appealed.   The grievance confidentiality begins when the grievance is filed with the Grievance Committee.  The party filing the grievance must acknowledge AT THE TIME OF FILING that they understand and agree to abide by the confidentiality of the grievance process.  All other parties must acknowledge AT THE TIME OF NOTIFICATION that a grievance has been filed that they understand and agree to abide by the confidentiality of the grievance process.   Grievance confidentiality extends to all parties (including the mediators, arbitrators and GC members) from the time the grievance process begins. Failure by one of the parties to agree to abide by the confidentiality of the grievance process is grounds to automatically and immediately lose the grievance.   The consequences for breaking the confidentiality of the grievance process will be:   . If the grievance team determines one of the parties to the grievance has broken confidentiality, that party automatically and immediately loses the grievance with no option to re-file.   . A general statement such as "I've filed a grievance and cannot discuss it" in answer to a question is not considered a breach.   . If the confidentiality is breached by someone outside of the parties involved, the parties involved should not be penalized.   . If the confidentiality is broken by the mediator, an arbitrator or the GC representative to the mediation/arbitration portion of the grievance, the grievance gets reassigned to give the parties involved another chance to get the issue resolved.   . Consequences for breaching the confidentiality of the grievance process by someone outside of the grievance will be determined on a case-by-case basis by the Advisory Board that may include a disciplinary hearing and penalties applied based on the results of the findings.     Specifically, the following modifications to the Standing Rules will be made:   Section V of the Standing Rules, item E, number 1 will be modified to read: The grievance process begins when a complaint is made by any of the following:  (Items a-c remain unchanged.)  In addition, the following will be added as a separate item after the last paragraph of number 1.  "The grievance confidentiality begins when the grievance is filed with the Grievance Committee and extends to all parties (including the mediators, arbitrators and GC members) from the time the grievance process begins.   Item E, number 2 will be modified to read: The initial complaint should be brought to the Grievance Coordinator, and must include the following information: (Items a-f remain unchanged.)  Item g will be added, which will state "An acknowledgement that the member understands that the confidentiality of the grievance process begins when the complaint is filed and that they agree to abide by the confidentiality of the grievance process."   Item E, the first paragraph of subsection number 4 will be modified to read: "Upon receiving the initial complaint, the Grievance Coordinator will assign it a number, and appoint one of the permanent committee members to review the complaint to determine whether it meets the requirements outlined in subsection C of this Section.  At the same time, the Grievance Committee Chair will send a notice to the Advisory Board and to be posted on the BOARD-EXEC mail list that includes the names of all parties involved and a short (5-10 word max) description of the violation.  This will serve as the Advisory Board's cue to cease and desist any involvement until and unless the grievance resolution is appealed."   The second paragraph of subsection 4 will be modified to read:  "The review of the complaint will result in an "accept" or "reject" determination from the Committee Member assigned. The review at this level should assume that the facts stated in the complaint are true, and the determination of the viability of the grievance made based upon a review of the by-laws, policies, or procedures alleged to have been violated.  The recommendation and the reasons therefore, shall be provided to the Grievance Committee as a whole, and voted upon."   The fourth paragraph of subsection 4 will be modified to read: "If accepted as a viable grievance, the parties shall be so informed.  The parties must acknowledge at the time of notification that a grievance has been filed and that they understand and agree to abide by the confidentiality of the grievance process. Failure to agree to abide by the confidentiality of the grievance process is grounds to automatically and immediately lose the grievance. A Committee Member, volunteer mediator and two volunteer arbitrators will be assigned. The parties to the grievance, the Committee Member, mediator, and arbitrators will then be subscribed to a private email list.”   The first paragraph of subsection 6 will be modified to read: " When the team is seated, the parties shall be so advised by the Mediator. Everyone will be reminded that the grievance confidentiality extends to all parties (including the mediators, arbitrators and GC members) from the time the grievance process begins and that failure to abide by the confidentiality of the grievance process is grounds to automatically and immediately lose the grievance.  The parties shall have seventy-two (72) hours to submit to the Mediator a written statement of their position on the issues of the dispute. The mediator shall provide the position statements to the team members for their review."   The current subsection 9 will be renumbered to subsection 10.   The following subsection will be inserted between the current section 8 and the former subsection 9 (newly renumbered to section 10) and will be numbered as subsection 9:   The consequences for breaking the confidentiality of the grievance process will be:   . If the grievance team determines one of the parties to the grievance has broken the confidentiality, that party automatically and immediately loses the grievance with no option to re-file.   . A general statement such as "I've filed a grievance and cannot discuss it" in answer to a question is not considered a breach.   . If the confidentiality is breached by someone outside of the parties involved, the parties involved should not be penalized, unless it is evident that a party to the grievance is intentionally feeding information, after the grievance process began, to the one that broke the confidentiality.   . If the confidentiality is broken by the mediator, an arbitrator or the GC representative in the mediation/arbitration portion of the grievance, the grievance gets reassigned to give the parties involved another chance to get the issue resolved. Consequences for the GC representative are referenced in Section V of the Standard Rules, Subsection A, under the “Qualifications” item. (Link to the section above.) b. Consequences for breaching the confidentiality of the grievance process by someone outside of the grievance will be determined on a case-by-case basis by the Advisory Board that may include a disciplinary hearing and penalties applied based on the results of the findings. . Consequences for breaching the confidentiality of the grievance process by someone outside of the grievance will be determined on a case-by-case basis by the Advisory Board that may include a disciplinary hearing and penalties applied based on the results of the findings. Discussion is now open. If you have no discussion, please indicate by stating "No Discussion". Sherri Bradley National Coordinator USGenWeb Project Information about the USGenWeb Project at http://usgenweb.org Advisory Board Agenda http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.php USGenWeb Advisory Board Agenda: http://usgenweb.org/agenda2.shtml ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Adamant opposition The day the motion become official, is the day the states lose their sovereignty, and all and everything are subjected to the AB which at that point is no longer a AB but a dictatorship junta. The motion is 100 percent contrary to Sturgis and bylaws. Neither the GC or AB has the authority to impose any penalties WITHOUT consent or approval of the general membership at all. Only the general membership has the authority to decide the penalties. Currently the bylaws restrict the GC to mediation and arbitration. It does NOT give the AB any authority to impose any penalties at all. W. David Samuelsen