Pamela what myths are you speaking off.? Our govenment is not covering up anything. Did you happen to see the Sept 11 attacks on our World Trade Center? Since that time the government has stepped up more Federal Adminstration efforts also in this country to assure that Air Traffic controllers can't miss undected radar planes with another attack etc. and believe me they are out there somewhere. My husband was also a Federal Adminstrator for Aviation as well as a pilot like your father and others that were enlisted men on this list. Enlisted men gave just as much or even more to this country than just enlisted officers. I support them all. My cousins also fought in the Korean war as an enlisted Army Sgt, he came back with frozen feet, and a mulitude of medical problems, but would glady do it all over again for the life we American's enjoy today. No Pamela, no myths are abound, just the truth. I can't believe that our goverment is in any way calling facts a fragment of truth. The facts or there Pamela in black and white. Just because families maybe in geneaolgy don't tell the truth, that has been going on for years, I have 9 half brothers and sisters (thru divorce) sxy father I guess, needed to add that little sense of humor, ha!, I have never seen, but then again it has nothing to do with freedom of press and the truth, or myths that may seem to be abound. No our government has no myths only the countries like N. Korea and communist nations, and those like Iraq. My doctor is also from that country and he is proud to be an American and supports this country in hopes for freedom of all people not just America, he would and I too would like to see all people of the world have equal opportunity for a better life, and freedom like the American people enjoy today, but our country doesn't plan to sit by idle and do nothing about terroist such as Saddam or others that may join him in pursuit to destroy or take over our country or other countries for that matter.. Some of my freinds are from Viet Nam and they too have found a better life. These beautiful people own nail shops, etc today in America, and if you ask them if they want to return to their country they all say quickly no, as they have freedom in this country to work, and make a better life for themselves. These poor people saw war also, and were rufuges of the war, but would tell you today they don't want to live in a communist country or where freedom is not allowed, and that America is wonderful, a land of freedom and opportunity for those that are willing to work for it, and so are our leaders and troops. Yes, geneaology is great also, but has nothing to do with myths of war, etc. Our goverment and troops need the support to protect our human rights, as we now know them. Bettye

Bettye, I am just as proud of my father's and mother's military service, my grandfather's service in both WWI and WWII (he lied about his age for the first one) and my uncle's over 20 years of service as military police, serving in both Libya and Viet Nam; as I am proud on the ancestors who served in colonial times, the Revolutionary War, the War of 1812, the Civil War, etc. I am proud of those people who sacrificed and volunteered and served. Most of my direct ancestors volunteered, they were not drafted. I am another person on this list who has a 17 year old son and who wants to volunteer. I will support him all the way when he wanted to defend our freedoms. I will support him all the way to go in and dismantle a dictatorship that threatens the whole world. (Saddam should have been gone the first time.) If that is what he's doing. If he truly has the support of his government. Is that true? No. Maybe I am wrong but I believe it was Jeff that posted the info on what is happening with the Gulf War vets. Sure, not many where killed there in combat. But what has happened since then? Is our government stepping in, taking responsibility, helping these precious vets to survive? No, as more and more are dying early deaths from myterious diseases our government is denying that it has anything to do with their service in th Gulf War and I can't remember how many hundreds have died since they came back. They are having much difficulty obtaining medical and disability benefits. Go back in the archives and read that post and the links. Maybe it was on a different list but I don't think so. If it wasn't on this list it may have been Military.com. I get that through the Military brats organization. I am one. I've lived on Air Force bases and gone to their schools. There have been any number of articles published about the cutbacks in veterans medical services benefits by all administrations. I could give you a long list of personal horror stories from my immediate family. I tended to not believe it was really going on until my grandfather lived with me for a year and a half. I watched him die a slow, unnecessary death because in the previous state he had been living in, at the VA, he was given a very toxic heart drug that is supposed to be monitored closely for levels in the blood. I still don't know how long it went on, but when they first saw him here and took blood tests they called us in a panic because his blood levels were over twice as high as the poison level. Our government does not take care of it's soldiers by not telling them that they have even been exposed to harm so them can take care of and protect their families to some extent from economic harm. By denying the origins of the problem, the families are also cut off from the benefits veteran's families should have. Yes I saw the Sept. 11 attacks on our World Trade Center? And I've seen pictures taken from a college high rise dorm room less than a mile away of the second plane rising to hit the second tower. It is more chilling than most of what you saw on the news. Are you aware of just how much of the truth about the damage and the deaths and the body parts and small pieces of people that were sprayed all over the whole area by the collapse of the towers was surpressed? The little that we have after they put the area off limits to news people which was right after the second tower to be hit fell first was taken by freelancers already traped in the area. It was still weeks before they admitted what they knew in the first 24 hours. That there were poison gases killing those trapped and even some who tried to rescue them including some of the early arriving rescue dogs. It has only gradually come out the extent of what they learned early about the extent of cells of radicals prepared to die in this country. Most Americans don't realize that they have been infiltrating and settling in and becoming part of our communities for at least 20 years. Many have been educated in our best schools and hold vital positions of trust in key areas of our scientific/defense communities and throughout our economic infrastructures. They also are throughout our local, state and federal governments. Yes, I have firsthand knowledge and examples of all of these. And yes I know that the coverup is flying the patriotic flag of 'we don't want the country to panic'. You asked if I knew that they had installed additional radar detection devises. Do you know that the most vital of those devices were not installed until well after a year after Sept 11? Do you know that they have the technology and the devices for years before Sept 11? Do you know the person who directed the placement of said devices and oversaw the successful testing of said devices for the DC area? I do. He cannot talk about most of what he does, but he tells me what he can and sends me military and defense industry newsletters that are supposed to be public info. Unfortunately they get poorly reported because the government doesn't really want the country to know about the political infighting that is slowing the defensive buildup in vital areas. This fellow also is outfitting jeeps and tanks with the technology that is supposed to help avoid the 'friendly fire' incidents that have been happening and at the same time better pinpoint enemy locations. I don't want to put on this list info I know from various reliable sources about weaknesses in the system and what hasn't been done. The myths include that we have a free press and that the public is being protected as much as possible and that the governmental agendas are what we have been told they are. This has been going on for over 50 years. Eisenhower warned about it,and others have exposed bits and pieces and hugh chunks and the American public doesn't want to be disturbed from enjoying their freedoms. They don't want to see that Oliver North is taking the rap to coverup the involvement that Superiors right up to the senior Bush had in that affair. They don't that there is a contractor from a suburb within 5 miles of where I live who attended at least one of the top level meetings in the middle east and testified at some of the hearings in DC on that affair that the senior Bush was in attendance as vice-president and actively participating in those meetings and decisions. That came briefly on the news when he testified and then was never heard of again. The American people don't know that this man was threatened because of his testimony and he and his family have had to go into hidding because of threats to their lives. The American public doesn't seem to know that Olver North's superior Poindexter was also there. I don't remember if North was at that meeting or not. But Poindexter was also Bush Sr's superior when Bush was in the CIA and one of the responsiblities of this man was overseeing the return of US POW's. There were 80,000+ left behind in WWII that had been 'liberated' by the soviets and then marched to trains and then railroaded to Siberia. Did you know that? Most Americans don't because the government didn't anounce it and the press somehow wasn't interested or maybe just didn't discover it. Then there are the thousands that the Chinese marched to China from Korea. Then there were thousands who are MIA from Vietman that were seen be those who did get out, but I guess that all those released prisoners were just hallucinating, even though they ranged from officers to privates. Do you know what even one day is like for a family that receives a MIA notice? I do. I still remember the terror and fear that all the adults tried to hid. I know one of my sisters who was too younger to even know what was wrong still gets depression every April, the month my dad disappeared. I know my grandmother, my dad's mother, was never the same again, even after he escaped and made it out to our lines. I would not change what my dad did for anything, I am so proud of him, but he was never the same either and he had to fight for years for medical benefits that should have been freely his. I know he was afraid of the VA and afraid of telling the truth. I worked for years at trying to tell him that they couldn't possibly be really trying to get rid of him until his file was briefly declared to be open and no longer classified. He then told me some things that he had been hidding. I was horrified. No cover ups? Dream on. Then they interviewed him again, actually a full debriefing and when they found that he still remembered his experience point by point, they reclassified his file. There is more then a small question about some of his treatments. I know medics who served in Vietnam and the stories they carry. I have friends and relatives who served on land, were helicoptor pilots and served on Navy air craft carriers. It makes me sick to my stomach to think of what is being done to this country in the name of greed. Did you see the articles on who would be the big economic winners in this war? British and American Oil Companies. Do you know that that includes both the Bushes and the Queen of England? Do you know that France stands to lose big time economically because of outstanding loans? Do you know that the US is one of two suppliers of the strains of germs that Iraq has used to develop it's biological weapons? The government is not calling facts fragments of the truth. They are saying that they are telling us everything we need to know and that the picture they are giving us is the truth. It is such a small part of the truth as to be totally misleading. There are many facts in black and white that we can read. There are many in black and white that we can't see and some of that is very material to our survival. But who is behind Tom Ridge in charge of the actual carrying out of the homeland Security Act? The info that I have is that it is Poindexter, although I don't no how he's even alive or working at what age he'd be. That is not making me feel safe. And as I hear details of the broad comprimising of our basic freedoms in that act, I feel less securing. Everytime I think,'but they couldn't do that'. It is amazing to me take they can't find a way to keep porn shops out of residential neighborhoods and away from schools without compromising free speech, but they can gut the whole bill of rights in the guise of security issues and then still admit in public to the fact that they aren't even going to bother to try to protect the public from anthrax and other biological terrors but we should patriotically turn over our freedoms so they can 'protect us'. From what? What now protects us from them? Nothing, because it is now considered unpatriotic to question anything they do. Funny, but the reason we have the Constitution we do and the Bill of Rights we do and the resulting great country we do, is because the founding fathers didn't trust anyone with power to keep the game clean or fair or honest so they wrote those safeguards in for the vary purpose of protecting us from the government. And the very people who champaigned on the holiness of small government and the tyranny of big government and the immorality of big governments price tag have just turned our government into the biggest government yet and yet are still trying to convince us that it's going to cost us less not more! And there's no myths or coverups? Genealogy is only useful if we realize that the patterns of the lies are the same. Family legends and myths grow and are propetuated because we want to believe what the lies say and because it isn't polite or patriotic or loyal to question them. But do they really do good things to families? Do they make families more secure or less secure? Do they really make nations more secure? I think not. Yes, people from other countries want to be here because of the freedoms and opportunities. But are those freedoms and opportunities still going to be there after our fathers, husbands and sons and daughters go out and breed and die for them? We have already let our fears give those freedoms and rights away. Do you know how our elective process is altered by that act? Do you know that the pentagon is going to be keeping track of your debt for you? What books you purchase? Do you think that they will be willing to stop doing those and the thousands of other things that that bill authorized even if we take over the whole world and root out every last al queda cell? Believe it or not, I think they should go in and take out Saddam Hussein. He is not a safe world citizen. So why are we offering him exile? He won't be without resources in exile. I think this war is equivalance of the Roman circuses. They were promoted by the government to keep the minds of the citizens off their true situation. They were the drugs of their time. They were like tranquillizers to lull the populace into thinking that things were fine and that their government was taking care of them. They were myths. If you can make it all the way through this e-mail, congratulations! At least you still have you curiosity. I sure do hope that all of us can continue to enjoy living in this country. I just also know aren't as good as they used to be. Pamela BETTYBOAT@aol.com wrote: > > Pamela what myths are you speaking off.? Our govenment is not covering up > anything. > > Did you happen to see the Sept 11 attacks on our World Trade Center? Since > that time the government has stepped up more Federal Adminstration efforts > also in this country to assure that Air Traffic controllers can't miss > undected radar planes with another attack etc. and believe me they are out > there somewhere. > > My husband was also a Federal Adminstrator for Aviation as well as a pilot > like your father and others that were enlisted men on this list. Enlisted > men gave just as much or even more to this country than just enlisted > officers. I support them all. My cousins also fought in the Korean war as > an enlisted Army Sgt, he came back with frozen feet, and a mulitude of > medical problems, but would glady do it all over again for the life we > American's enjoy today. No Pamela, no myths are abound, just the truth. > > I can't believe that our goverment is in any way calling facts a fragment of > truth. The facts or there Pamela in black and white. > > Just because families maybe in geneaolgy don't tell the truth, that has been > going on for years, I have 9 half brothers and sisters (thru divorce) sxy > father I guess, needed to add that little sense of humor, ha!, I have > never seen, but then again it has nothing to do with freedom of press and > the truth, or myths that may seem to be abound. No our government has no > myths only the countries like N. Korea and communist nations, and those > like Iraq. > > My doctor is also from that country and he is proud to be an American and > supports this country in hopes for freedom of all people not just America, > he would and I too would like to see all people of the world have equal > opportunity for a better life, and freedom like the American people enjoy > today, but our country doesn't plan to sit by idle and do nothing about > terroist such as Saddam or others that may join him in pursuit to destroy or > take over our country or other countries for that matter.. > > Some of my freinds are from Viet Nam and they too have found a better life. > These beautiful people own nail shops, etc today in America, and if you ask > them if they want to return to their country they all say quickly no, as > they have freedom in this country to work, and make a better life for > themselves. These poor people saw war also, and were rufuges of the war, > but would tell you today they don't want to live in a communist country or > where freedom is not allowed, and that America is wonderful, a land of > freedom and opportunity for those that are willing to work for it, and so are > our leaders and troops. > > Yes, geneaology is great also, but has nothing to do with myths of war, > etc. Our goverment and troops need the support to protect our human rights, > as we now know them. > > Bettye > > ==== BLACKSHEEP-CHAT Mailing List ==== > Unsubscribe from the list: > Mailto:Blacksheep-Chat-L-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe&body=unsubscribe > > ============================== > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237