Jack, sorry about that, I just could not resist, Ok so I have a dirt track mind, I admit that quite freely! >Too bad the mama didn't leave years ago before Kade got to know her.< My kids dad has crawled from under his rock, after 6 years, and boy does the sun shine right out of his Ass, to my kids, well it did for a week or so, and to my daughter he is the DB's, sometimes it really can be better for the kids f the parent never comes back after leaving from the childs life from an early age, but chances are when Kade grows up she will either not have a bar of "mama" or she will want to know her, want to know why she left "her", much as you have mom and dad to Kade as I have been to mine, the "real" thing can often have an appeal we just can't understand, All you can do, is like I am doing gritting my teeth and bearing it! for the sake of my kids, as I know in my heart that when they have kids of their own, they will see things very differently, and they will know that a parent is not someone wo turns up now and again with pressies and stupid excuses! hang in there buddy Mellie IBSSG How Come My Coat Of Arms has Ties At The Back? List Admin: AUS-NSW-SURNAMES-L@rootsweb.com BAGNALL-L@rootsweb.com BATE-L@rootsweb.com BENTON-ENG-L@rootsweb.com BLACKHAM-L@rootsweb.com FEREDAY-L@rootsweb.com HOLLOWOOD-L@rootsweb.com HOWDLE-L@rootsweb.com --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Attachments are not enclosed unless previously notified My AVG is updated every 24 hours Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.351 / Virus Database: 197 - Release Date: 19/04/02