Thanks Sue. I am going to put on your wonderful tape today, be in the kitchen cooking for my out of town company from Texas, and try and get war off my mind. You can bet I won't be serving French wine though. I refuse to buy any product from France anymore. Let's hope the whole country will remain safe and protected, and war can be avoided, if not lets all protect our President and troops.. Bettye

Jeff you are so right. Many people are not aware of what goes on in other countries, or how close we were to war with Cuban during the Kennedy Adminstration.. During that time Russian fishing trawelers were out 10 or 15 miles from our Florida coast pretending to be fishing, but instead were loaded down with weapons and spying eqiuptment. The FL Air National Guard and other military men in the area knew what was going on and guarded this country everyday. Kennedy also a Democrat did a great job of informing the American people and it's military. Also during World War II we were close to war with Germany, they had submarines off this coast a few miles also. That's why we have the Kings Bay submarine Base in Georgia today, is to protect the United States. Wonder how many of us would like to see our children put on a truck and hauled off from their parents, never to see them again, and to be put in a concentration camp, especially young beautiful women for the use of the German soldiers. I have German descent, but for years didn't want to admit it, for the embrassment that was done to these dear people and their children, even though our ancestors even hid some of the wonderful people from Hilter, etc. I have many ancestors both German and some married into Jewish, families that hate war, and remember all the horrible details of it, but those people now American citizen's are supporting our President from another so called Hitler or an invasion to this country to destroy our leaders or freedom, that we enjoy today. Let's support our troops. Bettye No one wants war, but we need support of our troops and our President. Bettye

Jeff, I totally agree with you and I like that "NO U.N. How about " LETS ROLL" !!!! I don't see how anyone can forget that.

One thing that concerns me is, what is going on in his country, while he has our attention drawn to the destruction of those missiles (most likely outdated ones, compared to others that are being hauled around in those trucks). I have a feeling that this is a "stall tactic". Eleanor ----- Original Message ----- From: shadlock <shadlock@brightok.net> To: <BLACKSHEEP-CHAT-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 6:19 PM Subject: Re: [BSChat] more thoughts on hate > He is a genious at that , a master manipulator > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dave" <dave.tompsett@sympatico.ca> > To: <BLACKSHEEP-CHAT-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 5:22 PM > Subject: [BSChat] more thoughts on hate > > > > Saddam wants you to start name calling. > > It is part of the Al-quaeda plot to have the US pass special legislation > limiting your rights. > > It is part of his plot to have you a more divided nation. > > Should you want to call someone names, there are enough people > > like the complicitous FRENCH politicians, to insult without finding fault > with each other > > > >

Thanks Jeff, this is something real to do even if you don't agree with all the politics. Pamela Jeff wrote: > > Military Thank You Card > If you are so inclined, visit the Department of Defense web page below > and sign a brief message thanking the men and women of the U.S. military > services > for defending our freedom. The compiled list of names will be sent out > to our soldiers at the end of the month. So far, there are only about > 2,633,777 > names. What a shame. There should be hundreds of millions of thank > you's. Pass the word that we can honor and support the defenders of > freedom. >

I am glad you said that Bettye for this reason, it was pretty close to where I started in this whole situation. But I have shifted a lot in the last couple months. I was raised by two military service veterans, both who taught us to not question authority. My dad was a Korean POW who escaped unaided from behind enemy lines. Besides being a mosquito pilot{intelligence}, he served in many different capacities in the military. His parents and my mothers parents did not believe in questioning authority or so they claimed and that was the way I was raised. As I have pursued genealogy, I found out differently. I come from a long line of people ready to speak out if they felt that something was amiss. I have been aware for decades that we only have an illusion of free press in this county. I have learned that whenever someone does a very careful, thorough job of orchestrating what people hear as facts and learn about certain activities; your are only seeing the tip of a hugh iceberg that is meant to control you and deprive you of your constitutional freedoms, not to keep you safe. If the political agenda were as is stated, orchestration would not be necessary. The homeland security act is filled with little goodies that we will not realize until we hit the invisable wall that shouldn't be there. It authorizes invasions of ordinary, non-suspicious citizens privacy in many ways. Each one seems small, but together they seriously undermine the freedoms that your husband risked his life to preserve. The founding fathers wanted to make sure that if someone felt the need to reveal some governmental fallacy or outright error, they would have the freedom to do so. Not being able to call a spade a spade wipes out the difference between America and just about any other country. Although some countries have more cultural controls than others. Whenever I am not being told the truth, consistantly over time, I have to assume that someone is afraid of the truth for some reason. I don't even need to know exactly what the lie is to know that when facts don't match up with the stories or if lines of reasoning don't really follow or hang together under inspection; something is missing. Genealogy has taught me that when the facts don't line up with the family stories, there is something I don't know yet. I used to believe that it was wishful thinking. But every story I have pursued has turned out to have missing details which brought it into line when found. I have found a missing half sibling for my grandfather. By missing I mean that the coverup was so good that the whispered rumors only confused my grandfather and his brother and they thought the relatives meant that their mother was a loose woman and the older brother was illegitimate and it never crossed their minds that they had another brother. I wish they were alive so I could show them the truth. Then they knew that they had an aunt that they had never met but they didn't understand that there were actually twins that were born that they didn't even know about as well as that aunt. Our government is now engaging in calling the truth myth and calling fragments of truth the whole story and that leads to the same kind of hurt in a nation as it does in a family. I can't support that kind of unhealthy behavior in our national leaders any more than anyone else. But I don't have to call names to protest the lies. It's time to go to bed. Nite all, Pamela BETTYBOAT@aol.com wrote: > > No flaming from this girl. You may be right about some things Sue, but ask > someone who has been there, we have some former fighter pilots I think on > the list, and I'm sure they will tell you as my husband would, that we do > know the story. > > The military pilots and those troops that risk their life everyday protecting > our country know the facts, they see what is happening first handed, and > some things are not allowed to be talked about. When my husband was flying > off the coast of Fl during the Cuban crisis, it was top secret what he saw, > now we can talk about it, and you would be shocked at how close Russian > submarines, and aircraft were to the coast of FL nearby. They were even > putting guns, aircraft, any other kind of military weapons there or nearby, > but he flew those missions, and with live missles abroad his aircraft with > pride, and he was proud to be an American, not once did I ever hear him > critisize our leaders. He flew that aircraft with pride knowing that he > may be needed at any moment to shoot down another enemy plane, or that he > may not make it back, but he did whatever was needed to protect his family > and his country, and many of you on this list that are retired from the > military felt the same way. > > Things were so bad during that time, that he was going to pack up his wife > and 3 small children and send them away to a safer place in Georgia. > > My opinion, I think we need to support our country and our President in > whatever it takes to protect this country and the freedom that this country > was founded on. > > My ancestors came from Germany in 1734 to a new land because of religious > persecution, and also my family including my husband has served in the > military and some fought many wars. > > No one wants war either, and peace is most desireable, rather than war, but > war started Sept 11, I feel that some people are flaming our President, our > troops, and our country, just look at the postings on the internet. > > We all need to stand united and do whatever it takes to protect our country > and our President whether he be Democratic or Republican. It's a shame that > so many horrible statements are being made, and some people ask for > flaming, not your post Sue, but those that are criticizing the President, > at a time when he needs all the support he can get from his fellowman, is a > shame in my book. > > Saddam is a madman and kills his own kind, and I don't think he will stop at > anything. The President and the news team and Colin Powell are keeping the > American people pretty much abreast of things. No one wants war, but to > protect America it may have to come about. I truly think we will make all > efforts to avoid war, if Saddam quits hiding weapons, and complies with the > inspections necessary to ensure safety for our country, and the American > people. He sure has been busy moving them around and hiding them,, what > about the drone aircarft he has that is capable of chemical warfare that can > wipe out millions. > > Now I probably have created some flaming toward me to start, but so be it. I > haven't > really wanted to post any comments on war, but when I see the President of > our country being verbally attacked by some members of the list, I can help > but voice my opinion. > > No, I agree with you and Jeff we shouldn't have flaming, and I really think > Jeff had the right idea to begin with that the subject probably shouldn't > have been brought up to begin with, as we are almost sure some remarks being > made are going to irritate some people to the point of flaming. Whoever > sent that email to Rick was also wrong in my opinion, that's uncalled for., > but I also think that Rick allowed that to happen to him knowingly, by > attacking the President. If we dicuss war, then it should be the topic of > war, and whether or not a war will begin, etc, and what are our feelings, > etc, I don't think however, that this is time to attack our President, > etc, we should all continue to stand united. > > I don't personally think any of our President's ever wanted war. Let's all > continue to stand united and do what ever it takes to ensure ourselves,our > country, our children the freedom that this wonderful country was founded on > and has given us for many years. God Bless America!!! > > Bettye > > ==== BLACKSHEEP-CHAT Mailing List ==== > Unsubscribe from the list: > Mailto:Blacksheep-Chat-L-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe&body=unsubscribe > > ============================== > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237

Ok, heres my side I don't think noone said it better than Bettye, Noone wants war, we Amercians, HAVE the FREEDOM to do really want WE want to DO. We are even allowed to but the Boss of our Country down, and we still can go to sleep and not worry about getting put to death. I really don't think we should have stopped when we where their the first time. And my dad works at one of the base in Fla. you really wouldn't belive whats going on. He went to gamble so they got on a ship and went out 12 miles off shore, before they could start gambling. That means anyone can come right up to Fla, as long as their 12+ miles and do what ever they want. HELLO, I think the talk about war has gone on Long enough, I just wish if we are gonna do, do it. Oh did I mention that I'm the mother of a 18 year old son, He is going around talking to recurters, he said he wants good training, not the draft kind. I also have a neice, who is like my kid, who is in the Navy. she was working 1 mile from the pen. on 9/11, when the war REALLY started. I don't think we should have waited this long, So it just goes to show Bush has alot more patence than me. Heres a guestion to everyone, What would you do right now? Oh I forgot to say my dad was a Marine, full blooded. he didn't see me until I was 3, 2 tours of Vnam. as a grunt, intergator. and when I was 13, he got delayed stress sym. Do YOU know what its like to hold your dad crying, hearing about everything that happen, But what hurt him the most was when he came back ALIVE, he was branded a baby killer and etc. So no matter what you think of war, support OUR troops. And live each day like its your last, because MANY men who fought for you,And all the FREEDOMS you have, it was there last. Yoyo

BETTYBOAT@aol.com wrote.... > You may be right about some things Sue, but ask someone who has been there, we have some former fighter pilots I think on the list, and I'm sure they will tell you as my husband would, that we do know the story.< Ok, let me clarify here... in my previous post what I'm really talking about is the vast majority of us and what the news media is being *allowed* to pass along to us, NOT the proportionately small percentange of the population that is being commandeered to go deal with the situation in the mideast. I have nothing but the utmost respect for those who are or have served in any branch of our military. May our friends and family who are directly involved in this be kept safe from harm. Best, SueB

Yoyosjarjar@aol.com wrote.... > Do YOU know what its like to hold your dad crying, hearing about everything that happen, But what hurt him the most was when he came back ALIVE, .... < Please.... go to http://www.cdbaby.com/suegilmore and click on the "Private Demons" link (Pvt. Demons might've been a better title, in retrospect). It was written about a friend of mine back in MI and relates to what you're talking about. Best, SueB

No flaming from this girl. You may be right about some things Sue, but ask someone who has been there, we have some former fighter pilots I think on the list, and I'm sure they will tell you as my husband would, that we do know the story. The military pilots and those troops that risk their life everyday protecting our country know the facts, they see what is happening first handed, and some things are not allowed to be talked about. When my husband was flying off the coast of Fl during the Cuban crisis, it was top secret what he saw, now we can talk about it, and you would be shocked at how close Russian submarines, and aircraft were to the coast of FL nearby. They were even putting guns, aircraft, any other kind of military weapons there or nearby, but he flew those missions, and with live missles abroad his aircraft with pride, and he was proud to be an American, not once did I ever hear him critisize our leaders. He flew that aircraft with pride knowing that he may be needed at any moment to shoot down another enemy plane, or that he may not make it back, but he did whatever was needed to protect his family and his country, and many of you on this list that are retired from the military felt the same way. Things were so bad during that time, that he was going to pack up his wife and 3 small children and send them away to a safer place in Georgia. My opinion, I think we need to support our country and our President in whatever it takes to protect this country and the freedom that this country was founded on. My ancestors came from Germany in 1734 to a new land because of religious persecution, and also my family including my husband has served in the military and some fought many wars. No one wants war either, and peace is most desireable, rather than war, but war started Sept 11, I feel that some people are flaming our President, our troops, and our country, just look at the postings on the internet. We all need to stand united and do whatever it takes to protect our country and our President whether he be Democratic or Republican. It's a shame that so many horrible statements are being made, and some people ask for flaming, not your post Sue, but those that are criticizing the President, at a time when he needs all the support he can get from his fellowman, is a shame in my book. Saddam is a madman and kills his own kind, and I don't think he will stop at anything. The President and the news team and Colin Powell are keeping the American people pretty much abreast of things. No one wants war, but to protect America it may have to come about. I truly think we will make all efforts to avoid war, if Saddam quits hiding weapons, and complies with the inspections necessary to ensure safety for our country, and the American people. He sure has been busy moving them around and hiding them,, what about the drone aircarft he has that is capable of chemical warfare that can wipe out millions. Now I probably have created some flaming toward me to start, but so be it. I haven't really wanted to post any comments on war, but when I see the President of our country being verbally attacked by some members of the list, I can help but voice my opinion. No, I agree with you and Jeff we shouldn't have flaming, and I really think Jeff had the right idea to begin with that the subject probably shouldn't have been brought up to begin with, as we are almost sure some remarks being made are going to irritate some people to the point of flaming. Whoever sent that email to Rick was also wrong in my opinion, that's uncalled for., but I also think that Rick allowed that to happen to him knowingly, by attacking the President. If we dicuss war, then it should be the topic of war, and whether or not a war will begin, etc, and what are our feelings, etc, I don't think however, that this is time to attack our President, etc, we should all continue to stand united. I don't personally think any of our President's ever wanted war. Let's all continue to stand united and do what ever it takes to ensure ourselves,our country, our children the freedom that this wonderful country was founded on and has given us for many years. God Bless America!!! Bettye

NATIONAL GUARD AND RESERVE MOBILIZED AS OF MARCH 12, 2003 This week, the Army, Air Force, Navy and Marine Corps each announce an increase of reservists on active duty in support of the partial mobilization. The net collective result is 12,039 more reservists than last week. The total number of reserve personnel currently on active duty in support of the partial mobilization for the Army National Guard and Army Reserve is 130,142; Naval Reserve, 8,744; Air National Guard and Air Force Reserve, 27,737; Marine Corps Reserve, 18,770; and the Coast Guard Reserve, 3,199. This brings the total Reserve and National Guard on active duty to 188,592 including both units and individual augmentees. At any given time, services may mobilize some units and individuals while demobilizing others, making it possible for these figures to either increase or decrease. A cumulative roster of all National Guard and Reserve who are currently on active duty can be found at http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Mar2003/d20030312ngr.pdf. [Web version: http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Mar2003/b03122003_bt111-03.html] -- ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Damn the UN, Full speed ahead! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv Jeffery Scism, http://blacksheep.rootsweb.com/ International Blacksheep Society of Genealogists Links to my Homepages: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~scismfam/ Genealogy is the art of the living haunting the dead.... Heritage is the anchor in the sea of life, holding us steady, giving us a standard to live up to or beyond, a compass for our course, and a place to call home.

When the President is elected he STOPS being the Repubkican or Democratic candidate, he becomes ALL of our President. Sure hehas leanings in support of his party, and that is what stops this country from going extreme, the Give and take, politically, between two or more strng factions, BUT in the end he is still responsible to everyone. President Bush isn't following a Republican agenda in the war on terorism, nor on the trouble with Iraq's failure to comply with those 17 resolutions in the UN. Just remeber, there would be NO resolutions if Saddam hadn't invaded Kuwait. The last one, 1441, passed Unanamously in the UN security Council, and has been basically ignored by Saddam. The failure of teh UN to stand by its own unanimous resolution is indicative of what the UN, and it's member states really think. The UN has proved it is a paper Tiger, scary to listen to, threatening in it's voice, but lacking claws and the means to stand up and do what it says will happen. Saddam has defied the UN for over adecade, he thimbs his nose, and ust shuffleshis war machine around. He thinks it is a game, an so far he is right. The coalition in the Gulf war wasn't a UN function, it was independantlyformed and brought together by George Bush (#41) and The British Prime minister, Madame Thatcher. The conflicts in that coalition were just as fractuous as the current process, THEN the bone of contention was Israel,and if Israel joined in defending itself, the coalition would realign against Israel. Saddam knew this, and did everything he could to PROVOKE Israel. He started an undeclared war against Israel. Saddam was a Ba-ath Assassin before he was President, and for the last 25 Years has held on to power through fear, intimidation and MURDER. His political influences were Adolf Hitler, Benito Mussolini, and Joseph Stalin. He has studied and practiced what he has learned, the process of oppressive dictatorship. Fidel Castro doesn't hold a candle to Saddam. Not many do. Declaring Saddam an international outlaw would not be unreasonable, he has invaded two countries in the past twenty five years, Iran and Kuwait, killed hundreds of thousands of people through his wars, and through his internal genocide. His actions against his own people is why there is a northern no-fly zone imposed upon him. He is actively seeking to bring his weaponry to the FRONT of all his plans. He HAD the fourth largest army in the world before the first war. He has ad 12 Years to rebuild and upgrade his destroyed army, it's equipment and is ambitions. FRANCE has been his willing aprtner, France has through nderground channels broken every sanction imposed by the UN, including supplying weapons and a Nuclear Reactor. France TODAY is shipping Lynx Helecopyer and Mirage Jet parts to Iraq. ANYthing Iraq asks for they can get smuggled in from France. Iraq OWES France Billions in foriegn aid debts, and France would like to collect those debts. A war would put that debt repayment in jeopardy. France has alot to lose if Iraq goes to war. -- ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Damn the UN, Full speed ahead! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv Jeffery Scism, http://blacksheep.rootsweb.com/ International Blacksheep Society of Genealogists Links to my Homepages: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~scismfam/ Genealogy is the art of the living haunting the dead.... Heritage is the anchor in the sea of life, holding us steady, giving us a standard to live up to or beyond, a compass for our course, and a place to call home.

Thank you, Sue. Uncannily, you share most of the same thoughts on this subject as I do. I just couldn't get passed the umbrage to state it as you did. Again, thank you, Jeanne IBSSG-TLC

Military Thank You Card If you are so inclined, visit the Department of Defense web page below and sign a brief message thanking the men and women of the U.S. military services for defending our freedom. The compiled list of names will be sent out to our soldiers at the end of the month. So far, there are only about 2,633,777 names. What a shame. There should be hundreds of millions of thank you's. Pass the word that we can honor and support the defenders of freedom. National Military Appreciation Month GO TO: http://www.defendamerica.mil/nmam.html It takes 10 seconds...literally -- ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Damn the UN, Full speed ahead! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv Jeffery Scism, http://blacksheep.rootsweb.com/ International Blacksheep Society of Genealogists Links to my Homepages: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~scismfam/ Genealogy is the art of the living haunting the dead.... Heritage is the anchor in the sea of life, holding us steady, giving us a standard to live up to or beyond, a compass for our course, and a place to call home.

Saddam wants you to start name calling. It is part of the Al-quaeda plot to have the US pass special legislation limiting your rights. It is part of his plot to have you a more divided nation. Should you want to call someone names, there are enough people like the complicitous FRENCH politicians, to insult without finding fault with each other

Frozen Canuck here, again. You can all be certain that because Saddam has attacked Iran and Kuwait before, that all the other "moslem" countries regard Saddam with suspicion, and would love to get rid of him. The reason that they are sort-of, almost, maybe, nearly, behind this war is that they get rid of Saddam, and better still, the "great Satan" takes the blame. What could be better? (for them) None of them gets to bleed, but the dirty work gets done. That should be worth a few boatloads of oil.... And you can be sure that U.S. Democrat soldiers and Republican soldiers will get shot at with equal fervour by Saddam's boys.

That sounds like a "yes".<:-))).....E T..... ----- Original Message ----- From: <huggins@kans.com> To: <BLACKSHEEP-CHAT-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, March 14, 2003 11:25 PM Subject: Re: [BSChat] POLL > As former Emeritus of this list it is my feeling that the discussion should > be allowed as an interchange of information and socio-economic feelings. > The use of the list to further political name calling and party bashing is > not something that I would like to see proliferated on any list I am active > in. > > As long as it is for the spreading of information and a calm open debate > without vitrical and offending language or offending political tirade, I am > for an open discussion of any current event that might effect me, my family > and friends and nation. > > Del The Dragon > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jeff" <Scismgenie@adelphia.net> > To: <BLACKSHEEP-CHAT-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2003 10:22 PM > Subject: [BSChat] POLL > > > > As I srared, we should not allow the POLITICAL aspects to prevent good > > conversation. > > > > We have several times in the past "opened" normally tabu discussions, > > and had good success in keeping the emotional impact nuetral, there > > have also been a few times where it got completely out of hand. > > > > Two major instances were our first Halloween discussion of Witchcraft > > trials, and more recently, our former gatekeeper's arrest. > > > > There are times when a misdirected PRIVATE post gets to the list > > instead, or a comment is not recieved in the intended context, and > > feelings flare up. > > > > I don't (Nor does Sue) want to be in the position of censor and > > message passer. We arfe "moderators" and guides of the list subject. > > > > I suggest that we have a POLL on whether or not the members WANT to open > > the discussion. > > > > IF the discussion IS opened, I will reserve the right to call a halt, > > for the welfare of the list. > > The situation is about to get HOT in a physical sense, and since > > current events become the subject of future genealogy research, the > > FEELINGS would be a good insight to the period, However it is those > > feelings that cause the conflicts to disrupt the flow of civility. > > > > So a POLL is called, please respond in the next 24 hours. > > > > NOTICE: I, Sue, and the members of the Blacksheep WANT all to > > participate on our lists. Even those seldom heard from are a valuable > > part of our group. > > > > > > POLL > > > > QUESTION: Do you as a member feel that the current events regarding the > > pending war should be allowed on this mail list? > > -- > > > > Jeffery Scism, > > http://blacksheep.rootsweb.com/ > > International Blacksheep Society of Genealogists > > > > Links to my Homepages: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~scismfam/ > > > > Genealogy is the art of the living haunting the dead.... > > > > Heritage is the anchor in the sea of life, > > holding us steady, giving us a standard to live up to or beyond, > > a compass for our course, and a place to call home. > > > > > > ==== BLACKSHEEP-CHAT Mailing List ==== > > Creative use of your delete key is encouraged. If you disagree with the > subject, CHANGE the subject. > > > > ============================== > > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, > go to: > > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 > > > > > > > ==== BLACKSHEEP-CHAT Mailing List ==== > Unsubscribe from the list: > Mailto:Blacksheep-Chat-L-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe&body=unsub scribe > > ============================== > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 > >

He is a genious at that , a master manipulator ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave" <dave.tompsett@sympatico.ca> To: <BLACKSHEEP-CHAT-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 5:22 PM Subject: [BSChat] more thoughts on hate > Saddam wants you to start name calling. > It is part of the Al-quaeda plot to have the US pass special legislation limiting your rights. > It is part of his plot to have you a more divided nation. > Should you want to call someone names, there are enough people > like the complicitous FRENCH politicians, to insult without finding fault with each other > > > > ==== BLACKSHEEP-CHAT Mailing List ==== > Unsubscribe from the list: > Mailto:Blacksheep-Chat-L-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe&body=unsub scribe > > ============================== > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 > >

Please, if you "come across" hateful emails, do not forward them to the list, even as examples. The RULES of the list are there to avoid this type of problem. Continually flaunting the rules that were just posted 48 hours ago will result in removal from the list. State your opinions with civility, please. Please have some courtesy. -- ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Damn the UN, Full speed ahead! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv Jeffery Scism, http://blacksheep.rootsweb.com/ International Blacksheep Society of Genealogists Links to my Homepages: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~scismfam/ Genealogy is the art of the living haunting the dead.... Heritage is the anchor in the sea of life, holding us steady, giving us a standard to live up to or beyond, a compass for our course, and a place to call home.

I really wasn't going to inflict my thoughts on this subject here but, after reading some of the more inflammatory stuff that has (unfortunately) surface I think I'd like to add just a couple of cents worth--mine and Bobby's. I've lived long enough and been through enough in my life to know that situations are almost never cases of black and white; wrong or right. Very often, both sides of any circumstance are sporting positives and negatives and can be right about this and wrong about that. Sometimes, it's even happened when BOTH sides have been wrong. Further, and in my humble opinion, I really feel that there is a very fine line between politics and organized crime. It's just a matter of degree and that one of the two is 'legal'. But they are both a matter of calling in favors, you scratch me and I'll scratch you and who has who or what in their pocket AND both run on $$$. In essence, what I'm saying here is that our politicos are presenting us with whatever spin on the situation they feel that we should be hearing and I'm absolutely certain that the same is happening on the other side as well. We, as a country are not infallible and 'they' certainly aren't any better; indeed, I'm sure they are worse to one degree or another but the bottom line is *always* Us (good) vs. Them (bad). The truth is out there, certainly, but I'm of the opinion that it won't likely be available to the general public for years to come and only in hindsight and via research--assuming that the world can hold together that long. We are not getting the whole story of what's going on and there may be good and valid reasons for this... but we haven't heard them. There's only so much that we can trust in what we are being spoon-fed. Insofar as to war or not to war... well, I just don't know. I've never been one to paint myself into corners, if I can help it, and I sure hope that's not what this country and the Powers That Be are doing here. :-\ It seems to me that we, as a country, would have been further ahead to proceed with a 'mop-up' situation over there rather than to come out and officially make it a *declared war*. Guess we know why I'm not involved in politics now, eh? LOL Ok, let the flamings begin.... (not!) Best, SueB http://www.cdbaby.com/suegilmore