"GREY FOX" <anyta@alltel.net> wrote on 7 Sep 2000 in BIRD-D Digest V00 #111 in regard to some of the descendants of John and Susanne (Wintrow) Bird > > Subject: [BIRD-L] The Bird Family > Date: Thu, 7 Sep 2000 14:52:17 -0700 > From: "GREY FOX" <anyta@alltel.net> > To: BIRD-L@rootsweb.com > > > The Birds were essentially from Germany. They settled in great numbers in > the same area of Virginia as the English Byrds. This is the actual meaning > of the different spelling, contrary to the popular belief that the spelling > changed with the Civil War. However, the Birds and Byrds intermarried to > the point that they spelled their name either way. > The Birds are from Mill Gap and Monterey of Highland County, Virginia. > Highland County was created from a portion of Bath County in 1870. ---- > Dear "Grey Fox", In all due respect, my late father-in-law, David W. BIRD (1901-1996) who was only four generations removed from his g-g-grandparents, John and Susanna Margaretha Winterode, is probably rolling over in his grave at the statement that "the Birds were essentially from Germany". In spite of my oft repeated and persistant insistence that he was German, he informed me several times during the 50 plus years that I knew him that he was told by his father, who had been told by his father before him, that his BIRDs of Bath and Highland County, VA were of Scotch Irish and English heritage; but that his great grandfather, David Bird (1781-1864), and his g-g-grandfather, John Bird (1729-1819) had taken German brides. I knew then, just from his stubbornness, that he had to be "German"; but now after 50 years of marriage to my BIRD wife, 45 years of which have been spent trying to ferret out her BIRD ancestors, this "meat head" of a son-in-law has come around to accept old Dave's claim to English ancestry for the Birds. Some of the confusion regarding a possible German heritage for John Bird might have originated from the oft repeated interpretation of Morton's History of Highland Co., VA first published in Monterey, VA in 1811, wherein Morton states on page 264 "Bird, John, D. at 90 while plowing - m. Susanna Wintrow of Germany" This simple statement says nothing about the heritage of our John Bird, but only addresses the nationality of his wife, Susanna Margaretha Wintrow, daughter of Johannes Caspar and Anna Margareta (STREP)WINTERODE of Bammantal, Germany and Frederick Co., MD, who was indeed German. It also is true that John's son, David BIRD married Elizabeth HULL, of German and English heritage; but none of this proves (or disproves) that John BIRD was German. More recently, circumstantial evidence, suggests that our John Bird (listed as John BIRT, a neighbor of Mounce BIRD on the 1784 tax list) was probably a brother to Mounce BIRD and a son of Lt. Andrew BIRD of Chester Co., PA and Shenandoah Co., VA, who is believed to have been born of English (and possibly Dutch) heritage in Somerset Co., NJ before migrating to Bucks Co and Chester Co., PA near Philadelphia where he (Andrew Bird) met and married his wife, Magdalena JONES or JONASSON, daughter of Mounce JONASSON and Ingaborg LYCON. Mounce JONASSON was a son of Jonas NILLSON a Swedish merchant at the Swedish Colony on Tinicum Island near Philadelphia. So, I suppose that we could say that the BIRDs were "Swedes" with as much confidence as saying that they were "German". Some sources also claim that the BIRDS were of French Huegenot origin and migrated first to Scotland and then to America. Take your pick! All that we really can say for certain is that the descendants of John BIRD are a mixture of several nationalities (English, German, Swede, Dutch, Scotch, Irish, and more.) all contributing various characteristics. On this much we can agree. I like the combination though. All that I can say is that I love the little BIRD who I married 50 years ago in November; regardless of her ancestral origin, whatever it may have been. My wife' BIRD lineage is as follows: 1) Andrew BIRD m. Magdalena JONES 2) John BIRD m. Susanna Margaretta WINTERODE 3) David H. BIRD m. Elizabeth HULL 4) David W. BIRD m. Martha RYDER / RIDER 5) Henry Francis BIRD m. Verona GILBERT 6) David William BIRD m. Treva HAYNES 7) Mertle Joyce BIRD m. 1950 William L. DECOURSEY Bill DeCoursey decoursey@earthlink.net

>Bill DeCoursey wrote: > > In all due respect, my late father-in-law, David W. BIRD (1901-1996) >who was only four generations removed from his g-g-grandparents, John >and Susanna Margaretha Winterode, is probably rolling over in his grave >at the statement that "the Birds were essentially from Germany". > > In spite of my oft repeated and persistant insistence that he was >German, he informed me several times during the 50 plus years that I >knew him that he was told by his father, who had been told by his father >before him, that his BIRDs of Bath and Highland County, VA were of >Scotch Irish and English heritage; but that his great grandfather, David >Bird (1781-1864), and his g-g-grandfather, John Bird (1729-1819) had >taken German brides. May I suggest another possible interpretation. My original BIRD ancestor, Henry BIRD of Rye, NY came from a line of BIRDs who according to family tradition were of English origin but had settled in Holland (or possibly Germany) for a time before immigrating to America. It's all rather vague because Henry's parents died on the trip over, leaving him and one or two brothers orphans circa 1740-1750. (The fate of the brother or brothers is unknown.) If your BIRD family followed the same path on their way to America, that could explain the confusion. -- Jeff Hecht, jhecht@world.std.com