Sallye: I agree that what is needed are facts, facts, facts, however, I think you and I have a fundamental philosophical difference as to what establishes a fact. IMHO a fact is established by either direct or circumstantial evidence, somewhat akin to the way a jury establishes the facts in a court of law. While it would be nice to have a direct piece of evidence to establish a particular fact, that is oftentimes not possible in genealogical research (or in a court of law for that matter), and so, of necessity, one must resort to all the circumstantial evidence, in addition to any direct evidence that may also be available. The subscribers to this list represent a jury of sorts, so if anyone is really out in left field with a particular theory, then they should hear about it. I have attempted to establish who the parents of the top 10 might be through a process of elimination. I believe the use of this circumstantial evidence, is entirely fair game. While, I am on shaky grounds as to whether David, Levi or Martin is the father of 1, 2, 3 or 9 below, I believe that it is highly likely that one (or more) of them is. If not them, who else is there? Regardless of whether we agree or disagree on this point, I think the dialogue on this topic is what is important, and encourage others on this list who have an opinion to participate. In any event, on my next web page update, I plan on posting disclaimers regarding any assumptions I have made, so that the unwary, will not be led astray. In addition, I hope that this will motivate others to do further research in the areas of contention. Now, my interpretation of your response: (1) We agree that Isaiah is the son of Benjamin, but is his mother Jane Ferguson or Eunice Fitzpatrick? Since he was born circa 1825, wouldn't it be more likely that Benjamin's second wife, Eunice, was his mother, since Benjamin and Eunice were married in 1824? (2) How is it that you know that Henry was married only two times. What's to say he wasn't married a third time, in between Elizabeth Meyers and Nancy Jane Statz? (3) I wasn't aware that Noah Matheny and Catherine were enumerated in the census for Fulton County. That is a welcome new piece of data for me. (4) I agree that more research needs to be done (census reports, etc.) as you indicated. That was one of the reasons I posted my theory, to motivate the discussion, and to point other people's research in the right direction. (5) I don't agree that John, III (who married Anna Henry) is not the son of John, Jr. If not him, then who else do you have in mind? He was certainly in OH in the right time frame, although only for a short period of time. I think she was also from the same VA Henry line as Rebecca Henry who married Michael France, the granddaugher of Abraham Beckelhymer, Sr. (6) Regarding Esther Behymer who married James John in Clermont County, OH: I have this as Esther France's third marriage, first to Levi, second to John Gray, and third to James John. Do you agree? (7) Your information on George Washington Behymer, son of Martin, is also new welcome information. Now, I will end my reply by pointing out a few inconsistencies in my original posting: (1) If Chapman were born circa 1811, then that may have been a little too early for him to have been a son of Levi and Esther, since they were married in 1812. Chapman's birth date is based on his age as recorded in the 1850 census for Fulton County, IL, which I have not seen. Comments? (2) Elizabeth (Briney) Behymer, wife of Andrew, shows up in the 1860 census for Fulton County, IL living with her son, Hezekiah. If she were married to Reuben Hurt, why was her surname enumerated as Behymer? Comments on this greatly encouraged... John Charles Tippet JohnDoeTippet@csi.com P.S. Why don't we hear from some of the other longtime researchers such as Rob Dupuy? ---------- > From: SalGundy@aol.com > To: BEHYMER-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: Fulton County Behymer Loose Ends > Date: Monday, May 03, 1999 7:19 PM > > In a message dated 5/2/99 4:17:16 PM Pacific Daylight Time, > johndoetippet@csi.com writes: > > John T. > Will answer what I can on these. > << > In preparation for the next update of my web page, I have been entering and > reviewing all the data I have on the descendants of the John Beckelshymer, > III who married Anna Henry, the progenitor of a large contingent of Fulton > County, IL Behymers. John Beckelshymer, III, you may recall is the likely > son of the John Beckelhymer who married Barbara Weddle and who died in > Clermont County, OH in 1812. Barbara Weddle may or may not be John, III's > mother, however, as it is possible that John, Jr may have married prior to > his marriage to Barbara. > > The following Behymers are those for whom parents have not been established > (this is my 10 most wanted list!): > > (1) Chapman Behymer, b. circa 1811 in OH > (2) Jesse Beckelhymer, b. circa 1818 in OH > (3) Aaron Behymer, b. 14 Oct 1813 in OH > (4) Isaiah Beckelhymer, b. circa 1825 in OH > Isaiah was son of Levi, who was a son of Benjamin & Jane > Ferguson - in Fountain, IN. > (5) John Beckelhymer, b. circa 1831 (age calculated from marriage to > Margaret E Holmes in Fulton County, IL on 15 Nov 1852) > (6) Latitia Beckelhymer, b. circa 1830 (age calculated from marriage to > William P Cass in Fulton County, IL on 1 Apr 1850) > (7) Henry Beckelshymer, b. circa 1832 (age calculated from marriage to > Sarah Allenbaugh in Fulton County, IL on 16 Feb 1854) > can't be Henry, son of John and Anna.... Henry, son of John and > Anna marr 2) Nancy Jane Statz, by JP, on Sep 23, 1858 and then > died shortly after that. Mary Johnson Behymer said they had a > two month son at the time of Henry's death. > (8) Elizabeth Becklehymer, b. circa 1829 (age calculated from marriage to > Reuben Hurt in Fulton County, IL on 1 Feb 1849) > (9) Martin Behymer, b. circa 1818 (age calculated from marriage to Caroline > Cummings in Lawrence County, IN on 22 Sep 1839) > (10) Catherine Behymer, b. circa 1819 (age calculated from marriage to Noah > M Matheney in Lawrence County, IN on 4 Jul 1839) > Hezekiah Beckelshymer was living with Catherine & Noah Matheny > in 1850 census of Fulton Co, IL ..... > Still doesn't tell us who Catherine belonged to. > >> > So, we have the following: > Chapman, c1811 OH > Jesse c1818 OH > Aaron - Oct 1813 - OH > Latitia b 1830 > Henry b. c1832 > Elizabeth c1829 > Martin c1818 > Catherine 1819 > > Chapman, Jesse, Aaron could be brothers--sons of ? > Martin, could be son of Martin > > I suggest we do more census reports on > 1. William P Cass - 1850 or 1860 > 2. Reuben Hurt - 1850 or 1860 > 3. Martin Behymer 1840-1850-1860 > 4. Catherine & Noah Matheny - 1860 > > I do not believe that John L Beckelshymer was a son of John and > Barbara. None of their children except Benjamin, follows John & > Barbara's family. As you know, I do not think we have enough to > even guess about. > > Don't forget, we have a few more to add to the above list. > 1. Esther Behymer, an heir of Barbara, marr James John in Clermont > Co., OH, and they went to Spencer IN. She named one of her children > after Martin. > 2. A Lucy Beckelhymer marr a William Williamson in Fountain > Co. IN. > 3. I believe there was a Thomas in Fountain Co, IN also. > > I have to remind you, I am of the old school...facts.facts.facts. is > what we need. The best breakthru was material you got on > Jonathon...and I really appreciated that. > > Martin and Lucy had a son: > 1. George Washington Behymer > b. Sep 8, 1817 > d. Sep 9, 1905 Macon, MO > lived in Gentry MO in 1850 and Knox, MO in 1860. > m. Cynthia Wait (probably in KY) > > This is new information I have found. George was named after > one the Beagles in Campbell Co, KY. The Wait/Waite was one of > the original member of 4th Brethren Church in the early 1800's. > > Campbell Co Gen. Soc. couldn't tell me very much, nothing that > would help me, so am going to try Kenton Library. They have > always been a good help. > > Sallye > ' > > > ==== BEHYMER Mailing List ==== > Behymer webpage: BillyBob's Genealogy Homepage > http://members.iglou.com/wbehymer/ > Thanks, BillyBob! >