Hi Peter Thanks for doing this checking. Yes, confirmation is good. Checking backwards from Noah Naden + Martha Blomfield was easy with IGI. Know a good deal about Edward Scard's family - from Hampshire (and they were wealthy) Edward did well for himself - became Household Surgeon to Duke of Cambridge in Kew. Ann Humphreys had been married previously to Evan Humphreys (in 1819 in Monmouth) and had wealth herself. Edward died 1849 (wife Ann died 1848) leaving 17yr old Eliza and 15 yr old Thomas (Thomas at boarding school in Hampshire and Eliza living with Edward's oldest brother Rev Thomas Scard in Hampshire) According to Edward's will, Thomas Scard should have been well off, but in 1859 he was insolvent (same year he got MRCS). Interestingly in Sydney, Thomas insolvent in 1869 and again in 1871 (not well apparently and could not work much - surgeon in Balmain - so didn't have a chance to recover from earlier insolvency) - insolvent when he died. The voyages for ThomasI knew about were 1865 Oceania, 1866 Peerless. Have looked at the Peerless 1866 record at State Records - no mention of Ellen, but I know she was here in 1867 from Insolvency papers. Madeline was born probably between July 1854 and June 1855 as in 1874 when she arrived on "Jerusalem" she was 19. In the Insolvency papers, Thomas talks about sending money back to England to his daughter, but does not say where in England she was. Madeline Scard apparently married Henry Baxter in Sydney 2nd or 3rd March 1876 (children's birth certs) They were married by Rev Dr James Fullerton, a Presbyterian minister apparently notorious for performing many marriages, but being slack about paperwork! After Henry Baxter died (don't know when - another mystery!) Madeline Baxter married Richard Nash in 1917 and it is from this marriage certificate that I first had Ellen's maiden name Naden (actually appears as Neden, but Ellen's death cert has father Noah Maden) - deduced Ellen Naden! The problem with death for Julia Jordan in Marylebone in March Qtr 1851 is that she would have been before the 1851 census, wouldn't she? Just noticed your further message. Yes I have seen this and probably all ultimately related but....when I first found this I emailed Max Scard but old email. After progressing quite a way with the Scards in Hampshire (and the Benness family) - many yeomen and gentlemen there too - lots of wills available - great stuff, I was recently contacted by Judy Adams who lives in NSW (mother a Scard). Judy is developing a website for the Scards and she has been in contact with Max Scard. Judy and I have been able to exchange info/copies of wills - helping us both. I think I've rambled on enough! Lyn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Booth" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 1:18 PM Subject: Re: [BDF] Ellen NADEN dau of Noah NADEN > Lyn, > > That explains a lot. Looks like you have done a great deal of work. I > love trying to help people but turn off when I have to look up things that > they already know. > > I found the marriage of Noah Naden to Martha Blofield on 7/9/1814 at > Eaton Socon. A parent search on IGI revealed seven children baptised in a > number of different churches and some many years after their birth. By > 1841, > four including Ellen were still at home in St Pauls, Bedford but three had > left home. I can send the names if you don't have them but they're all on > IGI and census. > > I also found the marriage of Edward Scard and Ann Humphries on > 31/7/1830 > at All Souls, Marylebone, London. I didn't look further for children or > later census. By 1841, son Edward was away at school, so no benefit from > census data. However, it would be worthwhile to find his parents in 1841 > and > later. If Edward became a surgeon, I'd suggest parents were well off. > > I found the marriage of Ellen Nadin to Lewis Jordan in Dec 1849 at > Bedford. I was on another computer and didn't have the reader for original > census images. Do you know Lewis' birthplace and occupation from 1851 > census? It looks like they moved to London area shortly after 1849 > marriage. > > There is a Julia Jordan born Sept 1850 in Marylebone and dies in March > 1851 in Marylebone. I'd suggest this is the daughter who is with them in > 1851 census. I couldn't find any death of Lewis. If 1851 shows a military > occupation, I wonder if he died at sea or overseas? > > If so, Ellen is a widow by around 1852. Like you I couldn't find a > marriage to Thomas Scard or the birth of Madeline around 1854. I wonder if > Ellen accompanied him on a voyage and they were married at sea and > Madeline > was born aboard ship? > > Have you traced all of his voyages? Perhaps you should look at > Australian passenger and crew lists to see if his family are listed. It > might show Madeline born on voyage. I see from Google a number of > references > to "Thomas Scard" including your own posts. I see he brought some child > immigrants in 1865 on the Peerless. It would seem logical that a woman's > touch might be useful on such a journey. > > I found Madeline's arrival in Sydney in 1874 via "Jerusalem". But then > I > couldn't find her marriage or subsequent BDM events. Were they in NSW ?? > > To sum up, I don't know whether I've done anything other than to > confirm > what you already know. But sometimes that reinforcement helps. > > Peter > > > > > > > The List Guidelines > > http://bedfordrootsweb.blogspot.com/ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Lyn, Looks like a fascinating family. All those in insolvencies must have cut into your inheritance. But they certainly left plenty of records for you to follow the trail. In regard to Julia Jordan, technically you are right. If the census was taken on 30th - 31st March 1851, she would have to die almost on census night and the death be registered immediately for her to appear in both census and quarterly registrations. But who knows what happened. I feel it has to be her. But what happened to Lewis Jordan??? Hopefully when you obtain the March 1852 marriage certificate Ellen will be shown as widow. I stand to be corrected, but I think it would be usual for the bride's maiden name to be shown or at least Ellen Jordan (nee Naden). Either that or you would see her father's name which certainly has to be Noah Naden. Peter

Hi There were 2 deaths for a Lewis Jordan, 1852 and 1860 both in Wangford District Sufffolk. No ages given at that time unfortunately . If 1852 then you might have difficulty identifying Madeline's father. If 1860 then you might assume he was the father. A possibility is that Lewis disappeared about 1854/5 and Ellen had to wait 7years (I think) before declaring him deceased and then married Thomas. What surname did Madeline have in 1861? Cheers Marlene Lyn Mealey wrote: > Hi Peter > > Thanks for doing this checking. Yes, confirmation is good. Checking > backwards from Noah Naden + Martha Blomfield was easy with IGI. Know a good > deal about Edward Scard's family - from Hampshire (and they were wealthy) > Edward did well for himself - became Household Surgeon to Duke of Cambridge > in Kew. Ann Humphreys had been married previously to Evan Humphreys (in > 1819 in Monmouth) and had wealth herself. Edward died 1849 (wife Ann died > 1848) leaving 17yr old Eliza and 15 yr old Thomas (Thomas at boarding school > in Hampshire and Eliza living with Edward's oldest brother Rev Thomas Scard > in Hampshire) According to Edward's will, Thomas Scard should have been > well off, but in 1859 he was insolvent (same year he got MRCS). > Interestingly in Sydney, Thomas insolvent in 1869 and again in 1871 (not > well apparently and could not work much - surgeon in Balmain - so didn't > have a chance to recover from earlier insolvency) - insolvent when he died. > > The voyages for ThomasI knew about were 1865 Oceania, 1866 Peerless. Have > looked at the Peerless 1866 record at State Records - no mention of Ellen, > but I know she was here in 1867 from Insolvency papers. Madeline was born > probably between July 1854 and June 1855 as in 1874 when she arrived on > "Jerusalem" she was 19. In the Insolvency papers, Thomas talks about > sending money back to England to his daughter, but does not say where in > England she was. > > Madeline Scard apparently married Henry Baxter in Sydney 2nd or 3rd March > 1876 (children's birth certs) They were married by Rev Dr James Fullerton, a > Presbyterian minister apparently notorious for performing many marriages, > but being slack about paperwork! > > After Henry Baxter died (don't know when - another mystery!) Madeline Baxter > married Richard Nash in 1917 and it is from this marriage certificate that I > first had Ellen's maiden name Naden (actually appears as Neden, but Ellen's > death cert has father Noah Maden) - deduced Ellen Naden! > > The problem with death for Julia Jordan in Marylebone in March Qtr 1851 is > that she would have been before the 1851 census, wouldn't she? > > Just noticed your further message. Yes I have seen this and probably all > ultimately related but....when I first found this I emailed Max Scard but > old email. After progressing quite a way with the Scards in Hampshire (and > the Benness family) - many yeomen and gentlemen there too - lots of wills > available - great stuff, I was recently contacted by Judy Adams who lives in > NSW (mother a Scard). Judy is developing a website for the Scards and she > has been in contact with Max Scard. Judy and I have been able to exchange > info/copies of wills - helping us both. > > I think I've rambled on enough! > > Lyn > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Peter Booth" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 1:18 PM > Subject: Re: [BDF] Ellen NADEN dau of Noah NADEN > > > >> Lyn, >> >> That explains a lot. Looks like you have done a great deal of work. I >> love trying to help people but turn off when I have to look up things that >> they already know. >> >> I found the marriage of Noah Naden to Martha Blofield on 7/9/1814 at >> Eaton Socon. A parent search on IGI revealed seven children baptised in a >> number of different churches and some many years after their birth. By >> 1841, >> four including Ellen were still at home in St Pauls, Bedford but three had >> left home. I can send the names if you don't have them but they're all on >> IGI and census. >> >> I also found the marriage of Edward Scard and Ann Humphries on >> 31/7/1830 >> at All Souls, Marylebone, London. I didn't look further for children or >> later census. By 1841, son Edward was away at school, so no benefit from >> census data. However, it would be worthwhile to find his parents in 1841 >> and >> later. If Edward became a surgeon, I'd suggest parents were well off. >> >> I found the marriage of Ellen Nadin to Lewis Jordan in Dec 1849 at >> Bedford. I was on another computer and didn't have the reader for original >> census images. Do you know Lewis' birthplace and occupation from 1851 >> census? It looks like they moved to London area shortly after 1849 >> marriage. >> >> There is a Julia Jordan born Sept 1850 in Marylebone and dies in March >> 1851 in Marylebone. I'd suggest this is the daughter who is with them in >> 1851 census. I couldn't find any death of Lewis. If 1851 shows a military >> occupation, I wonder if he died at sea or overseas? >> >> If so, Ellen is a widow by around 1852. Like you I couldn't find a >> marriage to Thomas Scard or the birth of Madeline around 1854. I wonder if >> Ellen accompanied him on a voyage and they were married at sea and >> Madeline >> was born aboard ship? >> >> Have you traced all of his voyages? Perhaps you should look at >> Australian passenger and crew lists to see if his family are listed. It >> might show Madeline born on voyage. I see from Google a number of >> references >> to "Thomas Scard" including your own posts. I see he brought some child >> immigrants in 1865 on the Peerless. It would seem logical that a woman's >> touch might be useful on such a journey. >> >> I found Madeline's arrival in Sydney in 1874 via "Jerusalem". But then >> I >> couldn't find her marriage or subsequent BDM events. Were they in NSW ?? >> >> To sum up, I don't know whether I've done anything other than to >> confirm >> what you already know. But sometimes that reinforcement helps. >> >> Peter >> >> >> >> >> >> >> The List Guidelines >> >> http://bedfordrootsweb.blogspot.com/ >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> > > > > > > The List Guidelines > > http://bedfordrootsweb.blogspot.com/ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

Hi Marlene I think I worked out (from IGI births I think) that there was another Lewis Jordan (possibly with father Lewis) in Wangford which would account for those deaths. Madeline was Madeline Scard in 1861 Census. It just looked a straightforward family with Thomas S head, wife Ellen S and daughter Madeline S (6) + 1 servant. I had no reason to think anything other than just not being able to find a marriage about 1853/4. I had of course looked years on either side as well and should have persevered with any Thomas Scard that was mentioned as I knew there were not too many around England. As Peter said - well done Marlene! A fresh look at something I've been going around in circles for ages and look what happens! Best wishes Lyn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marlene Shipman" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 7:21 PM Subject: Re: [BDF] Ellen NADEN dau of Noah NADEN > Hi > There were 2 deaths for a Lewis Jordan, 1852 and 1860 both in Wangford > District Sufffolk. No ages given at that time unfortunately . > If 1852 then you might have difficulty identifying Madeline's father. If > 1860 then you might assume he was the father. > A possibility is that Lewis disappeared about 1854/5 and Ellen had to > wait 7years (I think) before declaring him deceased and then married > Thomas. > What surname did Madeline have in 1861? > Cheers > Marlene > > Lyn Mealey wrote: >> Hi Peter >> >> Thanks for doing this checking. Yes, confirmation is good. Checking >> backwards from Noah Naden + Martha Blomfield was easy with IGI. Know a >> good >> deal about Edward Scard's family - from Hampshire (and they were wealthy) >> Edward did well for himself - became Household Surgeon to Duke of >> Cambridge >> in Kew. Ann Humphreys had been married previously to Evan Humphreys (in >> 1819 in Monmouth) and had wealth herself. Edward died 1849 (wife Ann >> died >> 1848) leaving 17yr old Eliza and 15 yr old Thomas (Thomas at boarding >> school >> in Hampshire and Eliza living with Edward's oldest brother Rev Thomas >> Scard >> in Hampshire) According to Edward's will, Thomas Scard should have been >> well off, but in 1859 he was insolvent (same year he got MRCS). >> Interestingly in Sydney, Thomas insolvent in 1869 and again in 1871 (not >> well apparently and could not work much - surgeon in Balmain - so didn't >> have a chance to recover from earlier insolvency) - insolvent when he >> died. >> >> The voyages for ThomasI knew about were 1865 Oceania, 1866 Peerless. >> Have >> looked at the Peerless 1866 record at State Records - no mention of >> Ellen, >> but I know she was here in 1867 from Insolvency papers. Madeline was >> born >> probably between July 1854 and June 1855 as in 1874 when she arrived on >> "Jerusalem" she was 19. In the Insolvency papers, Thomas talks about >> sending money back to England to his daughter, but does not say where in >> England she was. >> >> Madeline Scard apparently married Henry Baxter in Sydney 2nd or 3rd March >> 1876 (children's birth certs) They were married by Rev Dr James >> Fullerton, a >> Presbyterian minister apparently notorious for performing many marriages, >> but being slack about paperwork! >> >> After Henry Baxter died (don't know when - another mystery!) Madeline >> Baxter >> married Richard Nash in 1917 and it is from this marriage certificate >> that I >> first had Ellen's maiden name Naden (actually appears as Neden, but >> Ellen's >> death cert has father Noah Maden) - deduced Ellen Naden! >> >> The problem with death for Julia Jordan in Marylebone in March Qtr 1851 >> is >> that she would have been before the 1851 census, wouldn't she? >> >> Just noticed your further message. Yes I have seen this and probably all >> ultimately related but....when I first found this I emailed Max Scard but >> old email. After progressing quite a way with the Scards in Hampshire >> (and >> the Benness family) - many yeomen and gentlemen there too - lots of wills >> available - great stuff, I was recently contacted by Judy Adams who lives >> in >> NSW (mother a Scard). Judy is developing a website for the Scards and >> she >> has been in contact with Max Scard. Judy and I have been able to >> exchange >> info/copies of wills - helping us both. >> >> I think I've rambled on enough! >> >> Lyn >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Peter Booth" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 1:18 PM >> Subject: Re: [BDF] Ellen NADEN dau of Noah NADEN >> >> >> >>> Lyn, >>> >>> That explains a lot. Looks like you have done a great deal of work. I >>> love trying to help people but turn off when I have to look up things >>> that >>> they already know. >>> >>> I found the marriage of Noah Naden to Martha Blofield on 7/9/1814 at >>> Eaton Socon. A parent search on IGI revealed seven children baptised in >>> a >>> number of different churches and some many years after their birth. By >>> 1841, >>> four including Ellen were still at home in St Pauls, Bedford but three >>> had >>> left home. I can send the names if you don't have them but they're all >>> on >>> IGI and census. >>> >>> I also found the marriage of Edward Scard and Ann Humphries on >>> 31/7/1830 >>> at All Souls, Marylebone, London. I didn't look further for children or >>> later census. By 1841, son Edward was away at school, so no benefit from >>> census data. However, it would be worthwhile to find his parents in 1841 >>> and >>> later. If Edward became a surgeon, I'd suggest parents were well off. >>> >>> I found the marriage of Ellen Nadin to Lewis Jordan in Dec 1849 at >>> Bedford. I was on another computer and didn't have the reader for >>> original >>> census images. Do you know Lewis' birthplace and occupation from 1851 >>> census? It looks like they moved to London area shortly after 1849 >>> marriage. >>> >>> There is a Julia Jordan born Sept 1850 in Marylebone and dies in >>> March >>> 1851 in Marylebone. I'd suggest this is the daughter who is with them in >>> 1851 census. I couldn't find any death of Lewis. If 1851 shows a >>> military >>> occupation, I wonder if he died at sea or overseas? >>> >>> If so, Ellen is a widow by around 1852. Like you I couldn't find a >>> marriage to Thomas Scard or the birth of Madeline around 1854. I wonder >>> if >>> Ellen accompanied him on a voyage and they were married at sea and >>> Madeline >>> was born aboard ship? >>> >>> Have you traced all of his voyages? Perhaps you should look at >>> Australian passenger and crew lists to see if his family are listed. It >>> might show Madeline born on voyage. I see from Google a number of >>> references >>> to "Thomas Scard" including your own posts. I see he brought some child >>> immigrants in 1865 on the Peerless. It would seem logical that a woman's >>> touch might be useful on such a journey. >>> >>> I found Madeline's arrival in Sydney in 1874 via "Jerusalem". But >>> then >>> I >>> couldn't find her marriage or subsequent BDM events. Were they in NSW ?? >>> >>> To sum up, I don't know whether I've done anything other than to >>> confirm >>> what you already know. But sometimes that reinforcement helps. >>> >>> Peter >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> The List Guidelines >>> >>> http://bedfordrootsweb.blogspot.com/ >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> The List Guidelines >> >> http://bedfordrootsweb.blogspot.com/ >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> > > > > The List Guidelines > > http://bedfordrootsweb.blogspot.com/ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message