Actually, I happen to think that this question was quite a reasonable one. I have no idea why some people lost their tempers. Why do people not born in Ireland want to spply for an Irish passport? Personally, I have thought about doing it several times, but have not yet actually pursued it. Why am I thinking of it? Well, first of all, because I'm entitled to it. I'm the child of two Irish born individuals, mother from Eyeries, father from County Longford. So, I am automatically an Irish citizen, as others have pointed out. And, since I have visited and stayed in Ireland so frequently over the years since I was a child, I feel Irish, especially when I am there, amonhg the people that I know. Second, as a matter of convenience. Since Ireland entered the European Union in the 1970s it would make entry into other European countries and Ireland itself much easier. No more standing in line for Irish or French or Italian Immigration, just breeze on through the EU citizens lines at the airports. Third, for protection. In a world where it can be dangerous to be identified as an American, it could be a good idea to hold a passport from a small neutral country. I well remember the difference in welcome that I received in France on a visit with my mother (who never became an American citizen). When I presented my American passport I received indifference (but at least not hostility). When my mother presented her Irish passport, the mood changed dramatically to one of warm welcome. However, as I said at the start of this response, although I've thought of doing it, I haven't actually done it yet. I still might though, especially once I retire and will have more time for traveling again. As for my opinion about people coming to the US and applying for citizenship and an American passport? The more the merrier. After all, that's how America grows. That's what my father did, after all. Margaret Duffy NY, NY -----Original Message----- >From: "el. McC." <ancestryhelp123@hotmail.com> >Sent: Oct 30, 2009 3:13 PM >To: beara@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [BEARA] Citizenship > > >I'll finally make this my last words on the subject. >This has to be the best reply Ive had all day......... Thank you for taking the time to give my daughter your comments. >Much appreciated. >Slán. > >> From: Shamrockri1@aol.com >> Date: Fri, 30 Oct 2009 15:09:09 -0400 >> To: beara@rootsweb.com >> Subject: [BEARA] Citizenship >> >> I think your granddaughters question is making many of us think hard about >> the reasons people >> want dual citizenship. >> >> My grandparents brought me up, when my mother died in childbirth and I was >> 1 1/2 years old. >> I listened to many tales of Ireland, that they had heard from their >> parents, grandparents, aunts >> and uncles. I heard about the Shea's visiting Knock right before coming >> to America, in 1881 >> and stories going back many more generations. >> >> My grandfather told me he had few regrets,but one was not having been able >> to visit Ireland, before he >> died.. What he gave up to bring my sister and I up, I have been able to >> do several times >> I would have liked the dual citizenship to honor my grandparents and for >> the connection they >> gave me to Ireland. >> >> I feel connected with the beauty of Ireland, the sense of humor and >> friendliness of the people. >> Yes, there is a definite feeling of Irishness, one carried by generations >> of my family. >> >> Would they have ever left if my great great grandfather hadn't died from >> lung disease in Allihies, >> leading his family of many daughters without the means to keep living in >> Ireland? Would they >> have come to Fall River without so many others from Kitcatherine and >> Allihies having made the >> same journey before to welcome them? Those answers I don't know and wish >> I had asked.. >> >> I do know that my great grandparents still spoke Gaelic to each other in >> America and that love >> for all things Irish is still passed down to my grandchildren, as well. >> >> Any convenience is attached to Irish citizenship or an Irish passport, >> haven't even entered >> into my desire for dual ctizenship. >> >> I also realize many may not understand my connectedness,and that's >> understandable, too. >> >> I understand "foreigners" coming to the USA, legally, to escape famine, >> wars, etc. or because they >> ended up having more of their family here, then in their original country. >> I would not have a problem >> with them gaining American citizenship. >> >> I'd also understand,if African Americans wanted dual citizenship or >> American Indian descendents whose >> family were transported to the Carribean many years ago. There were many >> historical occurances >> which left people connected to their ancestors countries. There journey >> to find their original connections >> with "home" are often much more difficult then ours to Ireland. >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BEARA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >_________________________________________________________________ >New Windows 7: Simplify what you do everyday. Find the right PC for you. >http://windows.microsoft.com/shop > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BEARA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Margeret, Thank you for a voice of common sense Bill ________________________________ From: Margaret M. Duffy <mmduffy@mindspring.com> To: beara@rootsweb.com; beara@rootsweb.com Sent: Fri, October 30, 2009 4:39:54 PM Subject: Re: [BEARA] Citizenship Actually, I happen to think that this question was quite a reasonable one.  I have no idea why some people lost their tempers.  Why do people not born in Ireland want to spply for an Irish passport?  Personally, I have thought about doing it several times, but have not yet actually pursued it.  Why am I thinking of it?  Well, first of all, because I'm entitled to it.  I'm the child of two Irish born individuals, mother from Eyeries, father from County Longford.  So, I am automatically an Irish citizen, as others have pointed out.  And, since I have visited and stayed in Ireland so frequently over the years since I was a child, I feel Irish, especially when I am there, amonhg the people that I know. Second, as a matter of convenience.  Since Ireland entered the European Union in the 1970s it would make entry into other European countries and Ireland itself much easier.  No more standing in line for Irish or French or Italian Immigration, just breeze on through the EU citizens lines at the airports. Third, for protection.  In a world where it can be dangerous to be identified as an American, it could be a good idea to hold a passport from a small neutral country.  I well remember the difference in welcome that I received in France on a visit with my mother (who never became an American citizen).  When I presented my American passport I received indifference (but at least not hostility).  When my mother presented her Irish passport, the mood changed dramatically to one of warm welcome.  However, as I said at the start of this response, although I've thought of doing it, I haven't actually done it yet.  I still might though, especially once I retire and will have more time for traveling again. As for my opinion about people coming to the US and applying for citizenship and an American passport?  The more the merrier.  After all, that's how America grows.  That's what my father did, after all.  Margaret Duffy NY, NY -----Original Message----- >From: "el. McC." <ancestryhelp123@hotmail.com> >Sent: Oct 30, 2009 3:13 PM >To: beara@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [BEARA] Citizenship > > >I'll finally make this my last words on the subject. >This has to be the best reply Ive had all day......... Thank you for taking the time to give my daughter your comments. >Much appreciated. >Slán. > >> From: Shamrockri1@aol.com >> Date: Fri, 30 Oct 2009 15:09:09 -0400 >> To: beara@rootsweb.com >> Subject: [BEARA] Citizenship >> >> I think your granddaughters question is making many of us think hard about  >> the reasons people >> want dual citizenship. >>  >> My grandparents brought me up, when my mother died in childbirth and I was  >> 1 1/2 years old. >> I listened to many tales of Ireland, that they had heard from their  >> parents, grandparents, aunts >> and uncles.  I heard about the Shea's visiting Knock right before  coming >> to America, in 1881 >> and stories going back many more generations. >>  >> My grandfather told me he had few regrets,but one was not having been  able >> to visit Ireland, before he >> died..  What he gave up to bring my sister and I up, I have been able  to >> do several times  >> I would have liked the dual citizenship to honor my grandparents and for  >> the connection they >> gave me to Ireland. >>  >> I feel connected with the beauty of Ireland, the sense of humor and  >> friendliness of the people. >> Yes, there is a definite feeling of Irishness, one carried by generations  >> of my family. >>  >> Would they have ever left if my great great grandfather hadn't died  from >> lung disease in Allihies, >> leading his family of many daughters without the means to keep living in  >> Ireland?  Would they >> have come to Fall River without so many others from Kitcatherine and  >> Allihies having made the >> same journey before to welcome them?  Those answers I don't know and  wish >> I had asked..  >>  >> I do know that my great grandparents still spoke Gaelic to each other in  >> America and that love >> for all things Irish is still passed down to my grandchildren, as  well. >>  >> Any convenience is attached to Irish citizenship or an Irish passport,  >> haven't even entered >> into my desire for dual ctizenship. >>  >> I also realize many may not understand my connectedness,and that's  >> understandable, too. >>  >> I understand "foreigners" coming to the USA, legally, to  escape famine, >> wars, etc. or because they >> ended up having more of their family here, then in their original  country. >>  I would not have a problem >> with them gaining American citizenship.  >>  >> I'd also understand,if African Americans wanted dual citizenship or  >> American Indian descendents whose >> family were transported to the Carribean  many years ago.  There were many >> historical occurances >> which left people connected to their ancestors countries.  There  journey >> to find their original connections >> with "home" are often much more difficult then ours to Ireland. >>  >>  >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BEARA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >                         >_________________________________________________________________ >New Windows 7: Simplify what you do everyday. Find the right PC for you. >http://windows.microsoft.com/shop > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BEARA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BEARA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Given the hostility of some of this debate, I'm reluctant to wade in, but I do feel the need to make a couple of points. 1. To some extent, citizenship is about making a choice. I don't know the current rules, but I believe that, in the 19th century, emigrants to the USA who sought citizenship there were obliged to renounce their allegiance to the British Crown. Clearly many of those emigrating from Ireland were more than happy to do so. Also emigration was - for many people at that time - a one way process and the choice was less of a issue. For us today, however, this poses a question as to who we are. I have considered obtaining an Irish passport, to which I would be entitled. Like most people contributing to this site, I am very aware of my Irishness. I am proud if Ireland's heritage and culture and have developed a love of the Irish language. In the end, however, I have to face the fact that I am a second-generation immigrant (to Britain) with a family here as well as an extended family, some of whom are still in Ireland, some in the US but mostly settled in Britain. Taking an Irish passport would, for me (and this is very personal) be a just a gesture. I will still be British and will not be emigrating to Ireland. 2. Don't assume that obtaining an Irish passport will provide protection abroad. Experience in troubled parts of the world, for example hostage-taking in Iraq, indicates that people will still see us as American, British or whatever, regardless of what passports we hold. 3. Citizenship can be a double-edged sword. The father of William Joyce fraudulently obtained British citizenship for himself and his family, incorrectly claiming that he had been born in Ireland (which was then part of the empire). When William Joyce's career as a propaganda broadcaster (known as Lord Haw Haw) for Germany came an abrupt end in 1945, he was tried and executed for treason. The basis of the prosecution was that, by holding a British passport, he had accepted the protection of the Crown and therefore was subject to its laws. This is a very extreme example but goes back to the point about choosing to whom we ultimately owe allegiance. Mise le meas. Pól Ó Súilleabháin -----Original Message----- From: beara-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:beara-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Margaret M. Duffy Sent: 30 October 2009 20:40 To: beara@rootsweb.com; beara@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [BEARA] Citizenship Actually, I happen to think that this question was quite a reasonable one. I have no idea why some people lost their tempers. Why do people not born in Ireland want to spply for an Irish passport? Personally, I have thought about doing it several times, but have not yet actually pursued it. Why am I thinking of it? Well, first of all, because I'm entitled to it. I'm the child of two Irish born individuals, mother from Eyeries, father from County Longford. So, I am automatically an Irish citizen, as others have pointed out. And, since I have visited and stayed in Ireland so frequently over the years since I was a child, I feel Irish, especially when I am there, amonhg the people that I know. Second, as a matter of convenience. Since Ireland entered the European Union in the 1970s it would make entry into other European countries and Ireland itself much easier. No more standing in line for Irish or French or Italian Immigration, just breeze on through the EU citizens lines at the airports. Third, for protection. In a world where it can be dangerous to be identified as an American, it could be a good idea to hold a passport from a small neutral country. I well remember the difference in welcome that I received in France on a visit with my mother (who never became an American citizen). When I presented my American passport I received indifference (but at least not hostility). When my mother presented her Irish passport, the mood changed dramatically to one of warm welcome. However, as I said at the start of this response, although I've thought of doing it, I haven't actually done it yet. I still might though, especially once I retire and will have more time for traveling again. As for my opinion about people coming to the US and applying for citizenship and an American passport? The more the merrier. After all, that's how America grows. That's what my father did, after all. Margaret Duffy NY, NY -----Original Message----- >From: "el. McC." <ancestryhelp123@hotmail.com> >Sent: Oct 30, 2009 3:13 PM >To: beara@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [BEARA] Citizenship > > >I'll finally make this my last words on the subject. >This has to be the best reply Ive had all day......... Thank you for taking the time to give my daughter your comments. >Much appreciated. >Slán. > >> From: Shamrockri1@aol.com >> Date: Fri, 30 Oct 2009 15:09:09 -0400 >> To: beara@rootsweb.com >> Subject: [BEARA] Citizenship >> >> I think your granddaughters question is making many of us think hard about >> the reasons people >> want dual citizenship. >> >> My grandparents brought me up, when my mother died in childbirth and I was >> 1 1/2 years old. >> I listened to many tales of Ireland, that they had heard from their >> parents, grandparents, aunts >> and uncles. I heard about the Shea's visiting Knock right before coming >> to America, in 1881 >> and stories going back many more generations. >> >> My grandfather told me he had few regrets,but one was not having been able >> to visit Ireland, before he >> died.. What he gave up to bring my sister and I up, I have been able to >> do several times >> I would have liked the dual citizenship to honor my grandparents and for >> the connection they >> gave me to Ireland. >> >> I feel connected with the beauty of Ireland, the sense of humor and >> friendliness of the people. >> Yes, there is a definite feeling of Irishness, one carried by generations >> of my family. >> >> Would they have ever left if my great great grandfather hadn't died from >> lung disease in Allihies, >> leading his family of many daughters without the means to keep living in >> Ireland? Would they >> have come to Fall River without so many others from Kitcatherine and >> Allihies having made the >> same journey before to welcome them? Those answers I don't know and wish >> I had asked.. >> >> I do know that my great grandparents still spoke Gaelic to each other in >> America and that love >> for all things Irish is still passed down to my grandchildren, as well. >> >> Any convenience is attached to Irish citizenship or an Irish passport, >> haven't even entered >> into my desire for dual ctizenship. >> >> I also realize many may not understand my connectedness,and that's >> understandable, too. >> >> I understand "foreigners" coming to the USA, legally, to escape famine, >> wars, etc. or because they >> ended up having more of their family here, then in their original country. >> I would not have a problem >> with them gaining American citizenship. >> >> I'd also understand,if African Americans wanted dual citizenship or >> American Indian descendents whose >> family were transported to the Carribean many years ago. There were many >> historical occurances >> which left people connected to their ancestors countries. There journey >> to find their original connections >> with "home" are often much more difficult then ours to Ireland. >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BEARA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >_________________________________________________________________ >New Windows 7: Simplify what you do everyday. Find the right PC for you. >http://windows.microsoft.com/shop > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BEARA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BEARA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message