my goodness maybe the stress of the season is getting to this person. everyone on this list has been most helpful and wonderful lots of information don't leave because of one stressed out person. happy holidays to everyone. linda -----Original Message----- From: Doedie10@aol.com [mailto:Doedie10@aol.com] Sent: Monday, December 20, 1999 8:57 PM To: BAVARIA-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Fwd: [BAVARIA] How Rude! Hello Mary: All I can say is that I am "dumbfounded"! I could not believe what I was reading! I can't imagine what that person was thinking of when he (or she) wrote that rude, horrid mail to you. Mary, I have been on this list now for almost two years and it really is a good list. Everyone is so helpful and nice, but every once in a while we pick up a sarcastic, rude, know- it- all. What they should do is take a pill and get a life. Don't quit on their account. Try to hang in there a while longer and hopefully they will get the message and fade away. Happy Holidays Mrs. Dee from NJ --part1_0.b16e94a6.25904678_boundary-- ______________________________

Hi, I am new to the list and thought I would pose a question about an ancester I believe came from Bavaria. Her name was Anna Barbara LEUIN (b.1747 d.1812) and she was supposedly from Schrobenhausen, Bavaria. she married my ancestor George SCHOTT (family came from Switzerland), and their daughter Elizabeth married my direct line ancester Valentine Greder HUNSICKER. (Most or all of this happened in Montg. Co., PA) Anyone out there to help me with this situation. Are there LEUIN's in Schrobenhausen? What can I do to find out? Susan shunsicker@bfree.on.ca

I would like to thank all of the lovely people on the list for the messages of support and encouragement and the list owner for his quick response following the 'rude' message I received. It appears I was not the only one who suffered GV's barbs. Many, many thanks to you all Mary

Dear Mary, Don't let old Scrooge ruin your dream! I'm a 68 yr. old Gramma who never held an office job, nor went to "higher education" and don't understand much of computer jargon, let alone map reading but I wouldn't quit the site for the world!!! I've learned so much from all the kind people here and you will, too! Forget the "know-it-all", "high and mighty" and hang in there with the rest of us. 99% of the people who are interested in genealogy are congenial! You just met up with someone in that 1%!!! Forget him/her and move on to better days and new friends on the list. Re-post your problem and I'm sure you'll find many helpful responses. Merry Christmas and Joyous New Year to you and yours. Mary Lou Carr

At 22:42 20.12.99 -0700, David wrote: ------------------------- > GV is off the list. The lady is back on. Thanks! I didn't dare to suggest..... :-) Welcome back, Mary! Stefan

I talked with the staff responsible for the familysearch.org website. They fixed the password problem this morning. It was caused by new hardware that was added to the servers. And BEST NEWS! They also fixed the truncation problem affecting much of Bavaria in the Catalog portion of the website. You can now search for any town in Bavaria and Pfalz. This afternoon there was a major problem affecting the delivery of information from the site and the staff is contacting IBM staff about it while they were doing some checking to find why we get the obnoxious messages "connection reset by peer" much of time we try to search the website. W. David Samuelsen

GV is off the list. The lady is back on. That kind of attitude GV put out toward other subscribers is NOT acceptable. There are many subscribers who do NOT have access to various resources, much less afford such resources. GV could have simply referred the lady to a site (www.expediamaps.com) instead of harranguing her. Internet is forever improving in resources. W. David Samuelsen, listowner

Hi Mary, just to put the records about the style of this list straight: I for myself am not the kind of guy who only likes alsway velvet smooth coffe talk ;-), but what you got is definetly beyond the limit. I don't know how many other answers you got already (you know about the "reply only to sender" of this list...), but here is what I found: My GOV2 database says there is a Hachenbach, but in Rheinlandpfalz (66887 Glanbrücken). I am no expert in the former Bavarian areas in the Palatine. Therefore I cannot confirm, whether this was formerly Baravia. Maybe somebody else on the list can help you on this. I checked my Telephone Directory and.... In Glanbrücken, there is one "Geib", and one "Woll" (!!!) There is furthermore a Hackenbach in Bavaria (old ZIP code: 8941, what was mine(!), new ZIP code: 87758). It turns out that this is a small hamlet of the village of Kronburg. The closest what I found what would fit your names, are one "Wolf", and two "Geiger"s, both of them in Kronburg, not in Hackenbach. Hope this helps a bit... Kind Regards, BTW: I would like to see posts of you _inside_ the list.... :-)) Stefan At 12:54 21.12.99 +1100, you wrote: ------------------------- > > I have unsubscribed from your list. I think the following should explain why. > > Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 19:51:33 -0800 > X-MSMail-Priority: Normal > X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 > X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 > > LADY it is the SCALE oof ATLAS which makes all the difference - maybe you > could get someone to EXPLAIN this to you -- > > HACHENBACH IS listed in a good German atlas which was the whole point of my > trying to help you -obviously a waste of time; attempting genealogy needs > MUCH MORE than a Reader's Digest Atlas of the world, believe me ! > > > The material available on BAVARIA is ENDLESS !!!!!! It will not fly into > your mouth without any effort whatsoever on your part ! > Maybe you would be happier baking cookies for Church socials. > > > GV > -----Original Message----- > From: Mary Rogers <marybob@ansonic.com.au> > To: George Vladar <gvladar@sprint.ca> > Date: December 20, 1999 3:42 AM > Subject: Re: [BAVARIA] Hachenbach > > > >At 01:12 AM 12/20/1999 -0800, you wrote: > >>PLEASE invest in a good atlas IF YOU ARE SERIOUS about your genealogical > >>research ! > > > >I dislike being shouted at and I object to the tone of your message, > >however you have been good enough to reply and therefore I will assume that > >you meant to help. > >I am serious. I have one of the best atlases you can get! Obviously not a > >German atlas as apparently the one you suggest is, as I was not aware my > >husband had Bavarian ancestors until the day before I posted my query. > >However, even on Internet sites there appears to be little information > >about Bavaria and even less (none) about Hachenbach. The small library in > >the country town where I live also had nothing to offer. The GEO website > >suggested by the list showed the area marked with a star but even by > >zooming in to 500 metres there was no sign of a town. > >(However I do now know the general area) I asked the mailing list as a last > >resort as I had assumed that, like English lists, members were willing to > >help. Most were! > > > >Mary

I have unsubscribed from your list. I think the following should explain why. Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 19:51:33 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 LADY it is the SCALE oof ATLAS which makes all the difference - maybe you could get someone to EXPLAIN this to you -- HACHENBACH IS listed in a good German atlas which was the whole point of my trying to help you -obviously a waste of time; attempting genealogy needs MUCH MORE than a Reader's Digest Atlas of the world, believe me ! The material available on BAVARIA is ENDLESS !!!!!! It will not fly into your mouth without any effort whatsoever on your part ! Maybe you would be happier baking cookies for Church socials. GV -----Original Message----- From: Mary Rogers <marybob@ansonic.com.au> To: George Vladar <gvladar@sprint.ca> Date: December 20, 1999 3:42 AM Subject: Re: [BAVARIA] Hachenbach >At 01:12 AM 12/20/1999 -0800, you wrote: >>PLEASE invest in a good atlas IF YOU ARE SERIOUS about your genealogical >>research ! > >I dislike being shouted at and I object to the tone of your message, >however you have been good enough to reply and therefore I will assume that >you meant to help. >I am serious. I have one of the best atlases you can get! Obviously not a >German atlas as apparently the one you suggest is, as I was not aware my >husband had Bavarian ancestors until the day before I posted my query. >However, even on Internet sites there appears to be little information >about Bavaria and even less (none) about Hachenbach. The small library in >the country town where I live also had nothing to offer. The GEO website >suggested by the list showed the area marked with a star but even by >zooming in to 500 metres there was no sign of a town. >(However I do now know the general area) I asked the mailing list as a last >resort as I had assumed that, like English lists, members were willing to >help. Most were! > >Mary > > > > > >

Help, have my husband's Widener family back to 1802 Washington Co., Md.but no connection as to his parents. Does anyone have any Widener, Weidner, who came to the US prior to 1800? We have Jacob Widener, sons were Samuel, William, John, Jacob, Phillip. Everything points to being of German, possibly Bavarian background.Thanking you in advance, Mary Widener

Merry Christmas to all and I agree with Mrs. Dee from New Jersey.... Dont leave because of one bad apple!!!!

--part1_0.b16e94a6.25904678_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --part1_0.b16e94a6.25904678_boundary Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-path: Doedie10@aol.com From: Doedie10@aol.com Full-name: Doedie10 Message-ID: <0.cf15c524.259045f4@aol.com> Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 21:54:44 EST Subject: Re: [BAVARIA] How Rude! To: marybob@ansonic.com.au MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 9 Hello Mary: All I can say is that I am "dumbfounded"! I could not believe what I was reading! I can't imagine what that person was thinking of when he (or she) wrote that rude, horrid mail to you. Mary, I have been on this list now for almost two years and it really is a good list. Everyone is so helpful and nice, but every once in a while we pick up a sarcastic, rude, know- it- all. What they should do is take a pill and get a life. Don't quit on their account. Try to hang in there a while longer and hopefully they will get the message and fade away. Happy Holidays Mrs. Dee from NJ --part1_0.b16e94a6.25904678_boundary--

Hi, I am new to this list so am posting the name I need information on who was from Bavaria. Joseph Zierer was born 10 Feb. 1820 in Bavaria. He arrived at the port of New York in the United States 21 Nov. 1854. After arriving in the United States he moved to Pennsylvania, then to Lauderdale County, Alabama. He became a naturalized citizen 7 Oct. 1861. I do not know who his parents were or what part of Bavaria he was from. I think his wife's name was Magabeth and she was born 6 Jan. 1838. I do not know if he married before arriving in the U.S. or after. I would appreciate any help in determining where in Bavaria Joseph lived and who his ancestors were. Also, how I could find the church he attended. Thank you. Tammy Killen

Cort Sims wrote: >Does any one have access to the "Passenger and Immigration Lists: Germans to America, 1875-1888 (#356)"? An index shows that Joseph Hirschvogel is listed on the CD. I do not understand this as he came to America in 1869. You can go to: http://genweb.net/~gen-cds/cdlist.html and request a lookup from one of the volunteers for CD #356 Mary Ellen Walz

-------- Original Message -------- Date: Sun, 19 Dec 1999 16:32:41 -0800 (PST) From: LFHalter@aol.com Looking for information or clues to this Heuring family. Francine Conn Halter === Descendants of Balthazar Heuring 1 Balthazar Heuring b: Bet. 1826 - 1827 in Bavaria d: 1871 +Barbara Heisserer b: March 18, 1843 in Alsace, Schirrhein, France d: July 12, 1891 in St. Clair Co., Smithton, IL ..... 2 Catherine Heuring b: 1849 in Ohio ..... 2 Joseph Heuring b: 1852 in Ohio ..... 2 Agnes Heuring b: 1855 in Missouri ..... 2 Charles Benjamin Heuring b: 1866 d: 1957 ...... +Catherine Messmer b: 1872 d: 1960 ..... 2 Vincent Heuring b: 1863 d: 1863 ..... 2 John Phillip Heuring b: 1864 ...... +Eugenia Willman ..... 2 Maria Heuring b: 1868 d: 1870 ..... 2 Annie C. Heuring b: 1871 *2nd Wife of Balthazar Heuring: . +Christina Eck

Stefan wrote: I am afraid, our Pancake discussion is getting off-topic :-( It isn't as long as it's about our German roots in general. W. David Samuelsen

forwarded -------- Original Message -------- Date: Sun, 19 Dec 1999 18:08:53 -0800 (PST) From: Stefan Probst <stefan.probst@opticom.v-nam.net> At 16:04 19.12.99 -0700, you wrote: ------------------------- > Forwarded > > -------- Original Message -------- > Date: Sun, 19 Dec 1999 11:15:42 -0800 (PST) > From: Arthur H Laube <zurlauben@mindspring.com> > > > ~~~~~~ > > Marcella Dawson reports My ancestors from Bavaria took leftover > Pfannkuchen(pancakes), > > cut them into slices and served them in soup at lunch. > Stefan replies > In my area ("Unterallgäu" - in Regierungsbezirk Schwaben) we call > this soup "Flädlesupp' " (it tastes marvellous! - actually you > pour the hot broth over the slices with some spices - if the > slices are too long in the liquid they get mashy and don't taste > that good anymore). > The name indicates Suebian origin, but could also be from Allgäu > (mountains). > Try it! > Stefan > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Stefan - were the Pfannkuchen(pancakes) sour - that is made with a > setback starter that made them more sour each day? > Any Neimans/Neumans in your area I thought they might have brought > the sour tasting buckwheat with them to the American Colonies. > But I am beginning to think that possibly there were no sour > Pfannkuchen(pancakes) in Europe? Your comment on the "Flädlesupp'" > was most interesting. Regards Hal Sorry, Hal, but the thought about your sour pancakes makes me shivering :-)) We used to fill the pancakes with "Mus" (fruit puree), "Kompott" (stewed fruit), Marmelade or sweetened "Quark" (curd cheese) (i.e. usually mixed with marmelade). Means: Spread the filling, roll the pancake and cut the roll into slices to eat. The other version would be called "Kaiserschmarrn", i.e. cut or tear the pancake into small pieces of a few cm, then pour sugar over it and eat it. Besides the "Flädlesupp' " which was usually made from the left-overs, all other dishes were sweet! Rather impossible with sour pancakes. I am afraid, our Pancake discussion is getting off-topic :-( To bring it to an end: Maybe you should do some empirical research: Prepare the different versions of pancake dishes, invite friends of different known German origin and look who likes which dish the most. Maybe you know then in which area of Germany to look for :=)) You could invent the new science of "Culinary Genealogy" :=)) I would volunteer for the "Unterallgäu" area. Just send me the invitation for the first test-eating, together with the ticket.... Dig in! Stefan ;-)

Forwarded -------- Original Message -------- Date: Sun, 19 Dec 1999 14:35:36 -0800 (PST) From: LFHalter@aol.com Looking for information about these early Kinsers/Kinzers in Bavaria. Happy New Years Francine Conn Halter ---- Descendants of Joseph Kinser 1 [2] Joseph Kinser b: March 21, 1795 in Manheim, Rheinphatz, Bavaria, Germany d: October 31, 1877 in Independence, Ohio .. +unknown wife .. 2 Margarethe Kinser b: June 10, 1818 in Germany ...... +John Werle/Worley m: in Germany .. 2 [1] Marie Kinser b: 1820 in Germany ...... +George Schafer m: in Germany .. *2nd Husband of [1] Marie Kinser: ...... +Casper Vogel *2nd Wife of [2] Joseph Kinser: .. +Katharina Wenz b: December 24, 1801 in Germany m: Abt. 1827 in Germany d: April 01, 1868 in Independence, Cuyahoga Co., OH Father: George Wenz .. 2 [3] Barbara Kuenzer b: December 1829 in Mannheim, Bavaria, Germany d: March 12, 1907 in Onekama, Manistee Co., MI ...... +George Wise m: 1848 .. *2nd Husband of [3] Barbara Kuenzer: ...... +Phillip Gabel/Goebel b: November 13, 1828 in Oggersheim, Bavaria, Germany m: April 06, 1861 d: 1882 in Manistee Co., MI Father: Mathias Goebel Mother: Barbara Harsch .. 2 Rosina Kuenzer b: December 18, 1831 in Manheim/Oggersheim, Bavaria, Germany d: January 10, 1910 in Cleveland, Cuyahoga Co., OH ...... +Martin Mehringer b: Abt. 1817 in Austria m: 1850 d: January 27, 1882 in Cleveland, Cuyahoga Co., OH .. 2 Charles S. Kuenzer b: January 31, 1833 in Manheim, Bavaria, Germany d: November 07, 1896 in Cleveland, Cuyahoga, OH ...... +Caroline Kohl b: 1840 in Germany m: 1857 d: in Ohio Father: Johann Konrad Kohl Mother: Elizabetha Ellenberger .. 2 Agnes Kuenzer b: February 09, 1835 in Manheim, Bavaria, Germany d: November 05, 1896 in Cleveland, Cuyahoga, OH ...... +John Kohl b: February 12, 1830 in Dackenheim, Germany m: Bet. 1852 - 1853 in Independence, OH d: April 19, 1890 in Cleveland, OH Father: Johann Konrad Kohl Mother: Elizabetha Ellenberger .. 2 Elizabeth Kuenzer b: December 01, 1838 in Manheim, Bavaria, Germany d: December 24, 1922 in Cleveland, Cuyahoga, OH ...... +Stephen Commery .. 2 Joseph/JuliusKuenzer b: May 29, 1843 in Manheim, Bavaria, Germany d: January 19, 1907 in Independence, Cuyahoga Co., OH ...... +Helen Dexheimer b: Abt. 1850 in Barvaria, Germany .. 2 John Kuenzer b: December 10, 1847 in Cleveland, Cuyahoga Co., OH d: August 25, 1928 in Arcadia, Aradia Twp., Manistee Co., MI ...... +Barbara Schafer b: February 14, 1850 in Germany m: July 17, 1869 in Cleveland, Cuyahoga Co., OH d: October 14, 1922 in Bear Lake, Manistee Co., MI Father: George Schafer Mother: Marie Kinser

Forwarded -------- Original Message -------- Date: Sun, 19 Dec 1999 10:50:52 -0800 (PST) From: "Cort Sims" <cortsims@email.msn.com> Does any one have access to the "Passenger and Immigration Lists: Germans to America, 1875-1888 (#356)"? An index shows that Joseph Hirschvogel is listed on the CD. I do not understand this as he came to America in 1869. I do not want to fork over $60 to find out that this is the wrong Joseph. Can anyone help? Cort Sims, cortsims@msn.com

Forwarded -------- Original Message -------- Date: Sun, 19 Dec 1999 11:15:42 -0800 (PST) From: Arthur H Laube <zurlauben@mindspring.com> > ~~~~~~ > Marcella Dawson reports My ancestors from Bavaria took leftover Pfannkuchen(pancakes), > cut them into slices and served them in soup at lunch. Stefan replies In my area ("Unterallgäu" - in Regierungsbezirk Schwaben) we call this soup "Flädlesupp' " (it tastes marvellous! - actually you pour the hot broth over the slices with some spices - if the slices are too long in the liquid they get mashy and don't tast that good anymore). The name indicates Suebian origin, but could also be from Allgäu (mountains). Try it! Stefan ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Stefan - were the Pfannkuchen(pancakes) sour - that is made with a setback starter that made them more sour each day? Any Neimans/Neumans in your area I thought they might have brought the sour tasting buckwheat with them to the American Colonies. But I am beginning to think that possibly there were no sour Pfannkuchen(pancakes) in Europe? Your comment on the "Flädlesupp'" was most interesting. Regards Hal