Greetings Barracloughs All.Here's a copy of a message I've sent Kim,off list.I'm posting it now to you all,in the hope that someone might have some bright ideas,to pin down my ancestor once and for all. Hi Kim, I'm getting even more convinced that my elusive John B.was a son of a Joseph B. If you look at the pattern for naming children in those days,the first son was named after his father's father. The second son was named after his mother's father. The third son was named after his father. John and Susannah's first 3 sons were--- 1.Joseph 2.Thomas.[Susannah's father WAS Thomas] 3.John.[correct--he WAS named after his father] So it's a pretty good bet that son No 1, Joseph ,was named after John's father. Joseph,who married Hannah Slicer,named HIS first son John,after his father,to maintain the custom. If John was of a similar age to Susannah,he would be born c.1788/89 ; but he could have been a bit older,of course ; or even younger. She was born in Ovenden,Halifax.It's entirely possible that the John we are seeking wasn't a Beck Hill,Buttershaw, man at all,but born in the Halifax area----Shelf,Northowram,Queensbury to name but a few. There,that's something for you to get your teeth into !!!! Cheers------Derek