Hello Dave and Louisa, Who has the Hungarian government's passport documentation at present? Our family does not have any of the passports so does an archives in Europe have them? Are the health examination records at the ports of departure still extant? Deborah ----- Original Message ----- From: "Louisa Livingston" <l-livingston@nyc.rr.com> To: "Dave Dreyer" <ddreyer@pacbell.net> Cc: "Banat List" <BANAT-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 4:49 PM Subject: Re: [BANAT-L] question about passport for nonBanaters & emigration > Thank you, Dave. I really appreciate your comprehensive and quick > response. Louisa > On Jan 4, 2010, at 2:55 PM, Dave Dreyer wrote: > > Louisa; > It is my understanding that passports were not required for departures > from Antwerp, Rotterdam or North Sea ports prior to World War I. This is > not to say that there were not other restrictions. In order to leave > legality from Hungary, especially for men of military age a passport was > required. Moreover, there were health checks for immigrants traveling > through Germany. The authorities did not want a lot of people piling up at > ports of departure who had gotten that far and then couldn't pass the > health examination just before boarding the ship. Many of these would > have been destitute without money to return home and then have become a > problem for the local authorities. This was certainly a complaint on the > part of the Hungarian government who had to deal with some of their > nationals who were destitute in Hamburg or Bremen. The health > examination was fairly strict at the port of departure by the shipping > lines since if immigrants were rejected at Ellis Island the shippi! > ng line had to return them to the port of departure at the expense of the > shipper. Of course, if you were Hungarian or Russian then you were on > your own when you were returned to Hamburg or Bremen and if without funds > a unwelcome problem for the respective governments. > Dave Dreyer > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Louisa Livingston" > <l-livingston@nyc.rr.com> > To: <ddreyer@pacbell.net> > Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 2:23 PM > Subject: question about passport for nonBanaters & emigration > > >> Hello David. I was interested in what you wrote in your extractions for >> the Banaters traveling in the early 1900's from Antwerp. My grandfather >> travelled on the Kroonland from Antwerp in 1903 to NYC. However, he was >> from Warsaw and came without papers or passport. Notwithstanding >> difficulties he probably had getting out of Warsaw (especially since he >> was Jewish and declared it at customs), my question is: At that time, >> could anyone who could pay for their passage from Antwerp then board the >> ship? Or was it only the Banaters and perhaps other more local people >> able to travel without papers? >> >> Thank you for any information. I'm very curious about the whole process >> and have not seen this particular part written up. >> >> Louisa R. Livingston >> >> > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > BANAT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message >

Deborah, All the official documentations older than 100 years are to be found in the archives of the individual province, state, etc. When dealing with Europe, please remember that during the WWI and WWII many archives have been bombed, burned or such and much of the history of the land and people was destroyed for ever. The main archives of Hungary are in Budapest. Each province has also its own archives. Rosina www.hrastovac.net > Hello Dave and Louisa, > > Who has the Hungarian government's passport documentation at present? Our > family does not have any of the passports so does an archives in Europe > have > them? Are the health examination records at the ports of departure still > extant? > > Deborah >

Deborah - I'm sorry but I don't know anything about that. I happened to know from a rumor in my family that my grandfather had no passport or papers. Louisa On Jan 10, 2010, at 11:08 AM, flaowens wrote: Hello Dave and Louisa, Who has the Hungarian government's passport documentation at present? Our family does not have any of the passports so does an archives in Europe have them? Are the health examination records at the ports of departure still extant? Deborah ----- Original Message ----- From: "Louisa Livingston" <l-livingston@nyc.rr.com > To: "Dave Dreyer" <ddreyer@pacbell.net> Cc: "Banat List" <BANAT-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 4:49 PM Subject: Re: [BANAT-L] question about passport for nonBanaters & emigration > Thank you, Dave. I really appreciate your comprehensive and quick > response. Louisa > On Jan 4, 2010, at 2:55 PM, Dave Dreyer wrote: > > Louisa; > It is my understanding that passports were not required for > departures from Antwerp, Rotterdam or North Sea ports prior to World > War I. This is not to say that there were not other restrictions. > In order to leave legality from Hungary, especially for men of > military age a passport was required. Moreover, there were health > checks for immigrants traveling through Germany. The authorities did > not want a lot of people piling up at ports of departure who had > gotten that far and then couldn't pass the health examination just > before boarding the ship. Many of these would have been destitute > without money to return home and then have become a problem for the > local authorities. This was certainly a complaint on the part of > the Hungarian government who had to deal with some of their > nationals who were destitute in Hamburg or Bremen. The health > examination was fairly strict at the port of departure by the > shipping lines since if immigrants were rejected at Ellis Island the > shippi! > ng line had to return them to the port of departure at the expense > of the shipper. Of course, if you were Hungarian or Russian then > you were on your own when you were returned to Hamburg or Bremen and > if without funds a unwelcome problem for the respective governments. > Dave Dreyer > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Louisa Livingston" <l-livingston@nyc.rr.com > > > To: <ddreyer@pacbell.net> > Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 2:23 PM > Subject: question about passport for nonBanaters & emigration > > >> Hello David. I was interested in what you wrote in your >> extractions for the Banaters traveling in the early 1900's from >> Antwerp. My grandfather travelled on the Kroonland from Antwerp >> in 1903 to NYC. However, he was from Warsaw and came without >> papers or passport. Notwithstanding difficulties he probably had >> getting out of Warsaw (especially since he was Jewish and declared >> it at customs), my question is: At that time, could anyone who >> could pay for their passage from Antwerp then board the ship? Or >> was it only the Banaters and perhaps other more local people able >> to travel without papers? >> >> Thank you for any information. I'm very curious about the whole >> process and have not seen this particular part written up. >> >> Louisa R. Livingston >> >> > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BANAT-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message