Ann, This answer came back from the Switerland list. The Familiennamenbuch is a database mandated by the Swiss government. It requires every Swiss village to take each surname that exists in it today and say when it first appeared in that place by time periods such as before 1800. It's not perfect because a surname that existed in a village/town centuries ago may not still exist in that same village/town today and would therefore not be in the database. But it's a good place to start and often leads one to a good place to look. I'm guessing that Kienle is the Swiss equivalent of Kienlin. Li and le is the Swiss German dimunitive equivalent to "lein" in standard German. It could be that "lin" is the same thing in Swabian German. If you don't find the birth of Bartholomaeus Kienlin in Germany, you may want to consider looking in in Wilen bei Wil in the Canton of Thurgau. The FHL has the following microfilm: Title Kirchenbuch, 1632-1875 Authors Katholische Kirche Rickenbach b. Wil (Thurgau) Taufen 1632-1875 Heiraten 1683-1875 Tote 1682-1875 Konfirmationen (Jahre fehlen) 1718-1875 Familienbuch 1856 FHL INTL Film 958967 Rickenbach bei Wil is less than a mile from Wilen bei Wil and could very well be where the Wilen bei Wil villagers attended church. I'm copying Joe Wolfe to see if my assumptions about his answer to us are correct. By the way, thanks for your help, Joe. I think it's very interesting that both of the Endingens had Catholic parishes in the time frame you are asking about and that the Richenbach bei Wil (and presumably also Wilen bei Wil) was a Catholic area. Regards, Paul ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From: Joseph E Wolfe <joeedwolfe@juno.com> Reply-To: switzerland@rootsweb.com To: switzerland@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [SWITZERLAND] KIENLIN surname in Switzerland Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 21:12:58 -0700 Paul: closest I could find is Kienle mainly in Bern and coming also from Germany Oldest ones in Thgurgau in Wilen bei Wil before 1800 no Kinlin, or Kenlin Joe Wolfe