Tim, TY, just the encouragement I was hoping for :-) While I know it's much too soon to actually label this segment as coming from the immigrant ancestor, I think I have enough to red flag it. Of course, it could be from a female who married a Carrico........ I can only to hope to someday stumble across a will where grandpa is leaving something to his Carrico grandchildren!!! On chromosome 14, there doesn't appear to be any matches in common with any of the 3 individuals involved. There are other segments to study, but this particular one caught my interest. Will work on the others next. Uh oh, I just typed the surname in question w/o thinking, but don't think I'm really sharing anything here about living people who have tested by doing so. There is a Y-DNA group for this surname who Diana Matthiesen administers (a brick walled Carrico descendant herself). I believe (at last count) 23 have tested that match each other and there are no matches with other surnames (or didn't undergo a surname change in their linage) even at 12 markers. Roughly, only 25% of those tested can trace their roots back to the immigrant Peter Carricoe. Diana has others tested with the same or similar surname from Portugal, Turkey and Greece, none who have yet to match with our immigrants descendants. Will Family Finder testing help us to figure out where our immigrant ancestor came from? I don't know, perhaps in time. I'm more interested in trying to break down some of these brick walls here in the US and figure out how we all conect back to Peter. I'm hoping with a story about at least loosening a brick in the wall, even if it didn't topple the wall, might encourage others to test, esp. some of those who have already had the Y-DNA test done. I do have 3 pending tests from my own family, both of my mom's brothers and now mom's first cousin. I'm thinking I need to go back a generation or 2 & find some more distant cousins to test? Again Tim, TY Linda ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim Janzen" <tjanzen@comcast.net> To: <autosomal-dna@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, October 05, 2013 2:31 AM Subject: Re: [AUTOSOMAL-DNA] Matches with a common surname > Dear Linda, > It seems to me that you are doing everything that you can do with > the data you have at this time. If you are trying to bridge a gap of 3 to 4 > generations from the 1670s to the 1770s using autosomal DNA, I think you > will have trouble doing that with absolute certainty from a scientific > standpoint. In any case, this doesn't prevent you from making the logical > assumption at this point in time that your great aunt and these other two > matches share a segment that was originally carried by the immigrant > ancestor in the 1670s or his wife. Another angle you can work on is to > aggressively research the genealogies of any matches on this particularly > segment of chromosome 14 in Family Finder, 23andMe and GEDmatch. You may > find additional genealogical connections that link the 3 matches back to > each other or to others who also share this HIR. > Sincerely, > Tim Janzen > > -----Original Message----- > From: autosomal-dna-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:autosomal-dna-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Linda Boorom > Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2013 1:42 AM > To: autosomal-dna@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [AUTOSOMAL-DNA] Matches with a common surname > > Tim, > > But, back to the match in question. The most distant ancestor for each of > the 3 Project Members was > born in MD 1775-1785. One line migrated from MD to AL by 1810, the other 2 > to KY in the same time > frame. Of the 2 to KY, they lived in different counties and only my line > stayed in KY. The son of > the 3rd mda migrated to CA. It's remote that any of the 3 share a common > ancestor previous to 1775 > or there abt. > > Back to chromosone 14 and the segment in qiestion. Only the 1 great aunt > matches both gentlemen. > Neither great aunt match each other on 14 until after this segment. > > The 2nd great aunt has 2 matches in this area. One with a cousin through her > fathers mother, the > other through her mother's mother. Since the 2 sisters don't match each > other here, I am presuming > that the first great aunt's DNA is from either of her 2 grandfather's & not > her 2 grandmother's > > My mother & I match the first great aunt overlapping this segment, but even > through we both match > the AL gentleman on other segments, we don't match him on this segment and > neither of us match the > CA gentleman at all. > > At this time, there aren't any other matches to compare and determine for > certainty which > grandfather. It's certainly possible it c/b the maternal grandfather, as he > too is a brick wall of > mine going back to the same time period in MD. However, because of the > common surname shared by all > 3, it seems more likely that my great aunts DNA on this segment came from > her father's father. > > HELP! > > Linda > > > > ______________________________ > For answers to Frequently Asked Questions about mailing lists, please see: > http://dgmweb.net/MailingListFAQs.html > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to AUTOSOMAL-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the > word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Dear Linda, Another suggestion I have is that you test a child of your great aunt if you haven't already done so. This would allows you to separate your great aunt's matches into those who match her on one autosomal chromosome and those who match her on the opposite autosomal chromosome. This is most helpful for Family Finder, but the recent changes in Family Finder as discussed at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/GENEALOGY-DNA/2013-10/13807471 83 make the results from children somewhat less helpful than they had been previously. It is definitely helpful to test 2nd and 3rd cousins. I particularly appreciate the results from 2nd cousins since each 2nd cousin allows you to map up to 3% to 4% of your genome. I would rather have results from 4 2nd cousins than one first cousin even though the amount of shared DNA would be roughly the same since the data from 2nd cousins allows you to eliminate 3/4 of your pedigree chart from consideration when you are reviewing data from matches who share a segment with you as well as with one of your 2nd cousins. In terms of the immigrant ancestor, I would like to encourage all of us to feel freer to mention publicly the ancestors we are researching. These people are historical figures and there is nothing wrong with mentioning them publicly. If people want to withhold the names of the descendents who were tested that is fine, but there was certainly nothing wrong with you stating that you are researching a Carrico ancestor. Ultimately where we need to go as a genetic genealogy community is to have a public database of phased autosomal haplotypes linked to specific ancestors. In terms of using autosomal DNA to help you determine where the ancestor was from, this is a challenging problem. The best you can do at this point is to review the origin of any haplotypes that 23andMe has linked to a specific region in Ancestry Composition or that the admixture utilities in GEDmatch have linked to a specific region. Earlier this morning I posted a message on the R-U106 list that addresses this topic. I am copying that message below: "I would like to build on Charles' response. Autosomal SNPs (and short or long phased autosomal haplotypes) must be carefully tracked back through time to a specific region. That can sometimes be done fairly easily, particularly in situations where the SNPs have medical implications (such as the SNPs that cause lactase persistence, Factor V Leiden deficiency, hemochromatosis, etc). However, in most cases it is a laborious process to trace phased autosomal haplotypes back through time. I think that it is particularly hard to trace phased autosomal haplotypes to a specific location in Europe due to the fact that people have been moving all over Europe a huge amount over the past 7000 years or so. What would be ideal would be to have frequency maps by country for many relatively short phased autosomal haplotypes (haplotypes between .1 cM and 1 cM). I believe that 23andMe and Ancestry.com could generate those if they were willing to, but I suspect that both companies will keep this information locked up in proprietary databases for a long time. I think that the best that any one person can do this is to map their own chromosomes as best as they possibly can using techniques such may be found in the basic guide that Emily Aulicino and I wrote at https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/21841126/Basics%20of%20Chromosome%20Mapp ing.docx. Establishing the precise time when any one autosomal SNP occurred is more challenging. Looking at the regional distribution of that SNP can be helpful in this regard, but for "private" autosomal SNPs we simply don't have large enough databases we can use to check for things such as this. The autosomal SNPs that are included on the larger SNP chips such as the Omni Express chip and Geno 2.0 are likely to be at least 2000 or more years old." Sincerely, Tim Janzen -----Original Message----- From: autosomal-dna-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:autosomal-dna-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Linda Boorom Sent: Saturday, October 05, 2013 11:59 AM To: autosomal-dna@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [AUTOSOMAL-DNA] Matches with a common surname Tim, Uh oh, I just typed the surname in question w/o thinking, but don't think I'm really sharing anything here about living people who have tested by doing so. Will Family Finder testing help us to figure out where our immigrant ancestor came from? I don't know, perhaps in time. I'm more interested in trying to break down some of these brick walls here in the US and figure out how we all conect back to Peter. I do have 3 pending tests from my own family, both of my mom's brothers and now mom's first cousin. I'm thinking I need to go back a generation or 2 & find some more distant cousins to test? Linda