Hi Kerry, Many thanks, but I have had this data for some time, Yes , correct, Josephus and the two surviving children came to New Zealand, to go on to the Otago goldfields. They remained in NZ. But here lies yet another enigma.The two surviving children arrived, aged 6 and 4 respectively, unaccompanied by a parent on 15th March 1865, aboard the ship Hero to Otago.Why was there no parent with them? Despite the fact that I have ready access to passenger lists from Melbourne for this time period, Josephus cannot be definitely identified on any, as initials only are employed. Numerous J Murphy's!! Which one is mine??!! No Mrs M's aboard any ship that "fit" the time period. No death record for Catherine in NZ exists. Scenarios galore arise, Wendy. Something happened to Catherine in Aus I believe, this is why I have searched so long and persistently for her death. Locating it would partly answer the "riddle". As you mention this is the proverbial "needle" story, and one that I will never unravel satisfactorily. I really need to locate something/anything of Josephus between 1863 and 1865. The youngest child died 1863, in Beechworth, leaving this two year unknown gap. Did they go somewhere else? We will never know I'm afraid. Extremely grateful for your assistance Kerry. Thanks so much. Regards, Marina ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kerry" <kerryb@austarnet.com.au> To: <AUS-VIC-HIGH-COUNTRY-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 5:46 PM Subject: Re: [HC] Josephus Murphy and Catherine Arnold > Hi Marina > I did a search covering the > Pioneer Index > Federation Index > Edwardian Index > Tasmanian Pioneers Index > NSW BDM > > I can't find anything after 1863, thought I maybe able to follow their > children John Malcolm and Rubert but nothing also nothing on their father > under Josephus and Joseph. And because there are so many Catherines with > parents unknown, i'ts a bit like a needle in a haystack, I have a feeling > that because there are no more children recorded after 1863 nor Josephus > they may have left the State. This is about the time of the N.Zealand > rush. > But also many went to Queensland. And much later Western Australia chasing > the elusive gold. I had a look also through the Harrietville and Crooked > River miners couldn't find him there. > > Included some info you probably already have > > Kerry > > MURPHY John Malcolm Born Spouse Surname/Father: Josephus Spouse Gvn > Names/Mother: Cath ARNOLD Birth Place: WOOLSHED Year: 1857 > > MURPHY Harriet Born Spouse Surname/Father: Josephus Spouse Gvn > Names/Mother: > Elizabeth Catherine ARNOLD Birth Place: BUCKLAND Year: 1859 > > MURPHY Harriet Died Spouse Surname/Father: Josephus Spouse Gvn > Names/Mother: > Catherine Age: 1 Birth Place: BUC Year: 1860 > > MURPHY Rubert Born Spouse Surname/Father: Josephus Spouse Gvn > Names/Mother: > Cath ARNOLD Birth Place: MORSES CK Year: 1861 > > MURPHY Josephus Born Spouse Surname/Father: Josephus Spouse Gvn > Names/Mother: Catherine WESTLY Birth Place: OVEN Year: 1863 > > MURPHY Joseph Cephas Died Spouse Surname/Father: Joseph Cepha Spouse Gvn > Names/Mother: Catherine ARNOLD Age: 7M Birth Place: BEEC Year: 1863 > > > > > > > > MURPHY Catherine Died Spouse Surname/Father: Unknown Spouse Gvn > Names/Mother: Age: 28 Birth Place: GLOU Year: 1863 > > MURPHY Catherine Died Spouse Surname/Father: U Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: > Age: > 71 Year: 1867 > > MURPHY Catherine D Spouse Surname/Father: Unknown Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: > Age: 30 Birth Place: DUBL Year: 1869 > > MURPHY Catherine D Spouse Surname/Father: Unknown Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: > Age: 58 Death Place: MELB S Year: 1882 > > MURPHY Catherine D spouse Surname/Father: Wm Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Age: > 60 Death Place: GEELONG Year: 1883 > > > > MURPHY Joseph D Spouse Surname/Father: James Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: > Elizabeth BROWN Age: 58 Birth Place: U Year: 1880 > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Marina & Bruce Borland" <matilda@snap.net.nz> > To: <AUS-VIC-HIGH-COUNTRY-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 10:34 AM > Subject: [HC] Josephus Murphy and Catherine Arnold > > > Hello Everyone, > > Thank you to Joan, Wendy and Zola and Ronda for their responses to my > initial message. > The enigma of Catherine Murphy continues. > Having purchased a death certificate from Prov for a Catherine Murphy, am, > "none the wiser". The cited Catherine died in Prahran, (a suburb of > Melbourne!), in a hotel, in 1863, aged 28. All other data unknown to the > informant, thus of no use. > > So, it's back to the elusive Josephus Murphy for information on, in the > Beechworth region. He is not cited in the Ovens and Murray Biographical > Dictionary so I have been informed via an inquiry. > > As yet no one has been able to inform me about mining registers held at > the > Burke Museum. This is of much interest to me. Does anyone have access to > these please, who could do a look up for me. > > Most grateful for anything on this person. > > Regards, > Marina in New Zealand > > > > > > >

Sounds like unless Josephus is a J, they have been sent to a relative. I did a search of Inquest for Victoria, Josephus may have been imprisoned and the children sent away. There was also Typhoid fever in Beechworth District 1864-1865 Inquests into Catherine Murphys MURPHY Catherine Place: Prahran Year: 1863 Reference: 279 Cause: Rupture Blood Vessel MURPHY Catherine Place: Kangaroo Flat Year: 1866 Reference: 384 Cause: MURPHY Catherine C Place: Scarsdale Year: 1885 Reference: 1217 Cause: Kicked By Horse MURPHY Catherine Age: 58 Place: Milawa Year: 1886 Reference: 160 Cause: Natural Causes Beechworth 1863-1865 (lots of suicides over these years) UNKNOWN Place: Beechworth Year: 1864 Reference: 579 Sex: M Cause: Suicide hanged Occupation: Labourer Kerry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marina & Bruce Borland" <matilda@snap.net.nz> To: <AUS-VIC-HIGH-COUNTRY-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 4:59 PM Subject: Re: [HC] Josephus Murphy and Catherine Arnold Hi Kerry, Many thanks, but I have had this data for some time, Yes , correct, Josephus and the two surviving children came to New Zealand, to go on to the Otago goldfields. They remained in NZ. But here lies yet another enigma.The two surviving children arrived, aged 6 and 4 respectively, unaccompanied by a parent on 15th March 1865, aboard the ship Hero to Otago.Why was there no parent with them? Despite the fact that I have ready access to passenger lists from Melbourne for this time period, Josephus cannot be definitely identified on any, as initials only are employed. Numerous J Murphy's!! Which one is mine??!! No Mrs M's aboard any ship that "fit" the time period. No death record for Catherine in NZ exists. Scenarios galore arise, Wendy. Something happened to Catherine in Aus I believe, this is why I have searched so long and persistently for her death. Locating it would partly answer the "riddle". As you mention this is the proverbial "needle" story, and one that I will never unravel satisfactorily. I really need to locate something/anything of Josephus between 1863 and 1865. The youngest child died 1863, in Beechworth, leaving this two year unknown gap. Did they go somewhere else? We will never know I'm afraid. Extremely grateful for your assistance Kerry. Thanks so much. Regards, Marina ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kerry" <kerryb@austarnet.com.au> To: <AUS-VIC-HIGH-COUNTRY-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 5:46 PM Subject: Re: [HC] Josephus Murphy and Catherine Arnold > Hi Marina > I did a search covering the > Pioneer Index > Federation Index > Edwardian Index > Tasmanian Pioneers Index > NSW BDM > > I can't find anything after 1863, thought I maybe able to follow their > children John Malcolm and Rubert but nothing also nothing on their father > under Josephus and Joseph. And because there are so many Catherines with > parents unknown, i'ts a bit like a needle in a haystack, I have a feeling > that because there are no more children recorded after 1863 nor Josephus > they may have left the State. This is about the time of the N.Zealand > rush. > But also many went to Queensland. And much later Western Australia chasing > the elusive gold. I had a look also through the Harrietville and Crooked > River miners couldn't find him there. > > Included some info you probably already have > > Kerry > > MURPHY John Malcolm Born Spouse Surname/Father: Josephus Spouse Gvn > Names/Mother: Cath ARNOLD Birth Place: WOOLSHED Year: 1857 > > MURPHY Harriet Born Spouse Surname/Father: Josephus Spouse Gvn > Names/Mother: > Elizabeth Catherine ARNOLD Birth Place: BUCKLAND Year: 1859 > > MURPHY Harriet Died Spouse Surname/Father: Josephus Spouse Gvn > Names/Mother: > Catherine Age: 1 Birth Place: BUC Year: 1860 > > MURPHY Rubert Born Spouse Surname/Father: Josephus Spouse Gvn > Names/Mother: > Cath ARNOLD Birth Place: MORSES CK Year: 1861 > > MURPHY Josephus Born Spouse Surname/Father: Josephus Spouse Gvn > Names/Mother: Catherine WESTLY Birth Place: OVEN Year: 1863 > > MURPHY Joseph Cephas Died Spouse Surname/Father: Joseph Cepha Spouse Gvn > Names/Mother: Catherine ARNOLD Age: 7M Birth Place: BEEC Year: 1863 > > > > > > > > MURPHY Catherine Died Spouse Surname/Father: Unknown Spouse Gvn > Names/Mother: Age: 28 Birth Place: GLOU Year: 1863 > > MURPHY Catherine Died Spouse Surname/Father: U Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: > Age: > 71 Year: 1867 > > MURPHY Catherine D Spouse Surname/Father: Unknown Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: > Age: 30 Birth Place: DUBL Year: 1869 > > MURPHY Catherine D Spouse Surname/Father: Unknown Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: > Age: 58 Death Place: MELB S Year: 1882 > > MURPHY Catherine D spouse Surname/Father: Wm Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Age: > 60 Death Place: GEELONG Year: 1883 > > > > MURPHY Joseph D Spouse Surname/Father: James Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: > Elizabeth BROWN Age: 58 Birth Place: U Year: 1880 > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Marina & Bruce Borland" <matilda@snap.net.nz> > To: <AUS-VIC-HIGH-COUNTRY-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 10:34 AM > Subject: [HC] Josephus Murphy and Catherine Arnold > > > Hello Everyone, > > Thank you to Joan, Wendy and Zola and Ronda for their responses to my > initial message. > The enigma of Catherine Murphy continues. > Having purchased a death certificate from Prov for a Catherine Murphy, am, > "none the wiser". The cited Catherine died in Prahran, (a suburb of > Melbourne!), in a hotel, in 1863, aged 28. All other data unknown to the > informant, thus of no use. > > So, it's back to the elusive Josephus Murphy for information on, in the > Beechworth region. He is not cited in the Ovens and Murray Biographical > Dictionary so I have been informed via an inquiry. > > As yet no one has been able to inform me about mining registers held at > the > Burke Museum. This is of much interest to me. Does anyone have access to > these please, who could do a look up for me. > > Most grateful for anything on this person. > > Regards, > Marina in New Zealand > > > > > > >

Hi Kerry, Typhoid fever etc are options I had often wondered about, due to the prevailing conditions of the epoch in which these people lived. Life had to be horribly "rough" and tough. You have just answered this question for me. Suicide - never considered that, but, had even thought of murder!!! Was getting really desperate with this one!!! The Catherine Murphy death cited, of a ruptured blood vessel has interested me as well. Have an inquest report coming for one Catherine's death, so shall wait and see what arises from that. Cheers, Marina ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kerry" <kerryb@austarnet.com.au> To: <AUS-VIC-HIGH-COUNTRY-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [HC] Josephus Murphy and Catherine Arnold > Sounds like unless Josephus is a J, they have been sent to a relative. I > did > a search of Inquest for Victoria, Josephus may have been imprisoned and > the > children sent away. > There was also Typhoid fever in Beechworth District 1864-1865 > > Inquests into Catherine Murphys > > MURPHY Catherine Place: Prahran Year: 1863 Reference: 279 Cause: Rupture > Blood Vessel > > MURPHY Catherine Place: Kangaroo Flat Year: 1866 Reference: 384 Cause: > > MURPHY Catherine C Place: Scarsdale Year: 1885 Reference: 1217 Cause: > Kicked > By Horse > > MURPHY Catherine Age: 58 Place: Milawa Year: 1886 Reference: 160 Cause: > Natural Causes > > Beechworth 1863-1865 (lots of suicides over these years) > > UNKNOWN Place: Beechworth Year: 1864 Reference: 579 Sex: M Cause: Suicide > hanged Occupation: Labourer > > > Kerry > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Marina & Bruce Borland" <matilda@snap.net.nz> > To: <AUS-VIC-HIGH-COUNTRY-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 4:59 PM > Subject: Re: [HC] Josephus Murphy and Catherine Arnold > > > Hi Kerry, > Many thanks, but I have had this data for some time, Yes , correct, > Josephus > and the two surviving children came to New Zealand, to go on to the Otago > goldfields. They remained in NZ. But here lies yet another enigma.The two > surviving children arrived, aged 6 and 4 respectively, unaccompanied by a > parent on 15th March 1865, aboard the ship Hero to Otago.Why was there no > parent with them? Despite the fact that I have ready access to passenger > lists from Melbourne for this time period, Josephus cannot be definitely > identified on any, as initials only are employed. Numerous J Murphy's!! > Which one is mine??!! No Mrs M's aboard any ship that "fit" the time > period. > No death record for Catherine in NZ exists. > Scenarios galore arise, Wendy. Something happened to Catherine in Aus I > believe, this is why I have searched so long and persistently for her > death. Locating it would partly answer the "riddle". As you mention this > is > the proverbial "needle" story, and one that I will never unravel > satisfactorily. > I really need to locate something/anything of Josephus between 1863 and > 1865. The youngest child died 1863, in Beechworth, leaving this two year > unknown gap. Did they go somewhere else? We will never know I'm afraid. > Extremely grateful for your assistance Kerry. Thanks so much. > Regards, > Marina > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kerry" <kerryb@austarnet.com.au> > To: <AUS-VIC-HIGH-COUNTRY-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 5:46 PM > Subject: Re: [HC] Josephus Murphy and Catherine Arnold > > >> Hi Marina >> I did a search covering the >> Pioneer Index >> Federation Index >> Edwardian Index >> Tasmanian Pioneers Index >> NSW BDM >> >> I can't find anything after 1863, thought I maybe able to follow their >> children John Malcolm and Rubert but nothing also nothing on their father >> under Josephus and Joseph. And because there are so many Catherines with >> parents unknown, i'ts a bit like a needle in a haystack, I have a feeling >> that because there are no more children recorded after 1863 nor Josephus >> they may have left the State. This is about the time of the N.Zealand >> rush. >> But also many went to Queensland. And much later Western Australia >> chasing >> the elusive gold. I had a look also through the Harrietville and Crooked >> River miners couldn't find him there. >> >> Included some info you probably already have >> >> Kerry >> >> MURPHY John Malcolm Born Spouse Surname/Father: Josephus Spouse Gvn >> Names/Mother: Cath ARNOLD Birth Place: WOOLSHED Year: 1857 >> >> MURPHY Harriet Born Spouse Surname/Father: Josephus Spouse Gvn >> Names/Mother: >> Elizabeth Catherine ARNOLD Birth Place: BUCKLAND Year: 1859 >> >> MURPHY Harriet Died Spouse Surname/Father: Josephus Spouse Gvn >> Names/Mother: >> Catherine Age: 1 Birth Place: BUC Year: 1860 >> >> MURPHY Rubert Born Spouse Surname/Father: Josephus Spouse Gvn >> Names/Mother: >> Cath ARNOLD Birth Place: MORSES CK Year: 1861 >> >> MURPHY Josephus Born Spouse Surname/Father: Josephus Spouse Gvn >> Names/Mother: Catherine WESTLY Birth Place: OVEN Year: 1863 >> >> MURPHY Joseph Cephas Died Spouse Surname/Father: Joseph Cepha Spouse Gvn >> Names/Mother: Catherine ARNOLD Age: 7M Birth Place: BEEC Year: 1863 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> MURPHY Catherine Died Spouse Surname/Father: Unknown Spouse Gvn >> Names/Mother: Age: 28 Birth Place: GLOU Year: 1863 >> >> MURPHY Catherine Died Spouse Surname/Father: U Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: >> Age: >> 71 Year: 1867 >> >> MURPHY Catherine D Spouse Surname/Father: Unknown Spouse Gvn >> Names/Mother: >> Age: 30 Birth Place: DUBL Year: 1869 >> >> MURPHY Catherine D Spouse Surname/Father: Unknown Spouse Gvn >> Names/Mother: >> Age: 58 Death Place: MELB S Year: 1882 >> >> MURPHY Catherine D spouse Surname/Father: Wm Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: >> Age: >> 60 Death Place: GEELONG Year: 1883 >> >> >> >> MURPHY Joseph D Spouse Surname/Father: James Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: >> Elizabeth BROWN Age: 58 Birth Place: U Year: 1880 >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Marina & Bruce Borland" <matilda@snap.net.nz> >> To: <AUS-VIC-HIGH-COUNTRY-L@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 10:34 AM >> Subject: [HC] Josephus Murphy and Catherine Arnold >> >> >> Hello Everyone, >> >> Thank you to Joan, Wendy and Zola and Ronda for their responses to my >> initial message. >> The enigma of Catherine Murphy continues. >> Having purchased a death certificate from Prov for a Catherine Murphy, >> am, >> "none the wiser". The cited Catherine died in Prahran, (a suburb of >> Melbourne!), in a hotel, in 1863, aged 28. All other data unknown to the >> informant, thus of no use. >> >> So, it's back to the elusive Josephus Murphy for information on, in the >> Beechworth region. He is not cited in the Ovens and Murray Biographical >> Dictionary so I have been informed via an inquiry. >> >> As yet no one has been able to inform me about mining registers held at >> the >> Burke Museum. This is of much interest to me. Does anyone have access to >> these please, who could do a look up for me. >> >> Most grateful for anything on this person. >> >> Regards, >> Marina in New Zealand >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > >