Hi Min Don't forget that with this index sometimes the women are listed under their married surnames. Regards Lesley Uebel mailto:ckennedy@bigpond.net.au CLAIM A CONVICT http://users.bigpond.net.au/convicts/index.html -----Original Message----- From: aus-pt-jackson-convicts-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:aus-pt-jackson-convicts-bounces@rootsweb.com]On Behalf Of Minuet Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2009 2:31 PM To: AUS-PT-JACKSON-CONVICTS@rootsweb.com Subject: [PJ] no Margaret KENNY I finally got a copy of the Parramatta Female Factory Index and .... No Margaret Kenny Several Margaret McKenna but the only one dated after Margaret's arrival in NSW, is 1843 which is after she arrived in VDL. So, now to order some Colonial secretary's letters. Does anyone know how I go about doing that? I can find info on ordering pre 1825 Col Sec but not the later stuff. Also, If I order several letters in one go, is it $25 each letter, or a lesser fee for the subsequent letters? cheers Min (S

Hi Michelle The last female convicts to PJ arrived in 1840. She may have arrived as a free settler by herself, with siblings or with parents and/or her mother or father may have been a convict regards Lesley Uebel mailto:ckennedy@bigpond.net.au CLAIM A CONVICT http://users.bigpond.net.au/convicts/index.html -----Original Message----- From: aus-pt-jackson-convicts-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:aus-pt-jackson-convicts-bounces@rootsweb.com]On Behalf Of Michelle Sent: Friday, February 13, 2009 5:28 PM To: aus-pt-jackson-convicts@rootsweb.com Subject: [PJ] Ellen Slattery Hello when did they stop sending female convicts to Sydney I am looking for a Ellen Slattery born about 1836 Galway I have no idea how or when she arrived but she married a Joseph Francis Ennis in 1856 in Sydney Michelle Herbert Bateau Bay NSW

Hello when did they stop sending female convicts to Sydney I am looking for a Ellen Slattery born about 1836 Galway I have no idea how or when she arrived but she married a Joseph Francis Ennis in 1856 in Sydney Michelle Herbert Bateau Bay NSW

I was looking for info on a William Bowman today (he submitted a deposition mentioning my ancestor Edward Ewer), and in doing so in the NSW "Index to Convict Pardon" I noticed a William Bowman, Prince George, 1837 receiving a pardon type 'RW' in 1873. I'd never seen an RW before, and hadn't realised that convict/ex-convict administration continued till this date and beyond. Can anyone point me to a page that describes this aspect of convict history? Were convicts officially relinquished at some stage from public administration? cheers matt -- Matthew D. Hall Washington, DC cell: +1 410 733 9444 home: +1 202 370 6431

Hi Min, I have Catherine Byrne I'd like checked (there were two on the Minerva - mine is the younger unmarried one) also Catherine Bradshaw who also came on the Minerva which arrived 1839 Thanks for the offer. Cheers Janine

Hi Jenny, Just an aside to your earlier email wondering how convicts were conveyed to the ships prior to departure I thought I would relate another instance which indicates the amazing distances travelled even on foot in that era. One of my convict rellies was formerly in the 95th Regiment of Foot and I have an extract from his payroll and muster book which states: 22.5.1805-24.6.1805 - days pay 34 - Days March 8 - Brabourne Lees then further down states days marched to Southhampton 11. So these soldiers actually marched from place to place. When they were transferred from one place to another they marched there. Another 5 day march to Bexhill and then 3 days to Hailsham. Amazing to us today but commonplace for them in 1805. Lyn

Min, I have a Martha Brooks Arr Syd 20/5/1822, on the Mary Ann 1 (2). The Syd Gazette for Friday 24/5/1822 reported that the females from this voyage went to factory on 23/5/1822. If your record only covers 1826 - 1848 do you know if there are records before these dates?? Thank you. Keith Durman (1st time "talker" -----Original Message----- From: aus-pt-jackson-convicts-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:aus-pt-jackson-convicts-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Minuet Sent: Thursday, 12 February 2009 3:56 PM To: aus-pt-jackson-convicts@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [PJ] no Margaret KENNY Not a problem - will be going back to the fiche reader on the w/e - anyone else need a name checked? 1826-1848 female factory Parramatta Min

Hi Minuet, Thankyou very much. Kind regards, Susan, in NSW. On Thu, Feb 12, 2009 at 3:56 PM, Minuet <minuet9@internode.on.net> wrote: > Not a problem - will be going back to the fiche reader on the w/e > - anyone else need a name checked? > 1826-1848 female factory Parramatta > Min > > > At 03:45 PM 12/02/2009, you wrote: > >Hi Min, > > > >Would you mind checking the Female Factory Index for me, for a > >few of my ancestors, please? > >Is there a listing for Sarah Fisher 1826 and Janet Turner 1847-50? > >(I'm not sure of the dates the Index covers). > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > AUS-PT-JACKSON-CONVICTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Not a problem - will be going back to the fiche reader on the w/e - anyone else need a name checked? 1826-1848 female factory Parramatta Min At 03:45 PM 12/02/2009, you wrote: >Hi Min, > >Would you mind checking the Female Factory Index for me, for a >few of my ancestors, please? >Is there a listing for Sarah Fisher 1826 and Janet Turner 1847-50? >(I'm not sure of the dates the Index covers).

Hi Min, Would you mind checking the Female Factory Index for me, for a few of my ancestors, please? Is there a listing for Sarah Fisher 1826 and Janet Turner 1847-50? (I'm not sure of the dates the Index covers). Kind regards, Susan, in NSW. On Thu, Feb 12, 2009 at 2:30 PM, Minuet <minuet9@internode.on.net> wrote: > I finally got a copy of the Parramatta Female Factory Index and .... > No Margaret Kenny > Several Margaret McKenna but the only one dated after Margaret's > arrival in NSW, is 1843 which is after she arrived in VDL. > > So, now to order some Colonial secretary's letters. Does anyone > know how I go about doing that? I can find info on ordering pre > 1825 Col Sec but not the later stuff. > Also, If I order several letters in one go, is it $25 each letter, > or a lesser fee for the subsequent letters? > > cheers > Min > (Searching for KENNY, Margaret (4'11" in VDL) & KENNY, Margaret (5'6" in > NSW)) > > > > ---------- > *Earth is the insane asylum for the universe* > > ---------- > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > AUS-PT-JACKSON-CONVICTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Jenny, My convicts were tried at Hereford not far from the Welsh border and transported from Woolwich which is on the Thames downstream from London also quite a distance in those days. I think they were transferred in horse drawn prison wagons. They probably had overnight arrangements at other prisons along the way or alternatively, collected fresh horses and another coachman en-route. Lyn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jenny T" <jennygirl@unwired.com.au> To: <AUS-PT-JACKSON-CONVICTS@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 1:33 PM Subject: [PJ] Newgate Prison to Sydney Town > Hello All > > I have just joined the list and I am hoping that there is a Sage out there > that can help me resolve my predicament. I have a convict Daniel CANVIN > who was caught stealing from a person and was tried at the Guildhall (one > word) Bristol 4 May 1820. From various paper reports he was in Newgate and > Lawson's Gate Gaol. He sailed for Sydney Town on The Elizabeth 18 Aug 1820 > from The Downs, Kent, England however that is about 200 miles from > Bristol. > > Can someone help me understand why he would have had to travel that > distance to board the ship and how would the authorities have organised > it. It has me bluffed. > > Many thanks > Jenny > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > AUS-PT-JACKSON-CONVICTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

At 01:44 PM 12/02/2009 +1100, you wrote: >Thank you for the below information John, it was most interesting. >I do not think I can really understand how dreadful it must have been >by those incarcerated within the walls, no matter what their crime. >Jill J Thanks Jill, I'm hoping anyone interested in sharing or looking for additional info might contact me off-list. On the web it is easy to find the comments of visitors to these places and get to know them even if not going there oneself. Re the Shire Hall court/prisons now called the "Galleries of Justice" in Nottingham, visitors' comments say that Nottingham is not the most interesting place to visit - overrun with factories and pollution, and overall a very dirty city with little of its Robin Hood reputation - but that "the real gem of Nottingham" is this courthouse/prison complex museum. It today employs a paid actor as Judge, before which "prisoners" (visitors) may pass for trial and sentence ... after which they can be put in stocks or cells, or stood on a "real gallows", as well as participate in prisoner duties. What they call "interactive" exhibits I suppose. One who has been there wrote "... hardly the sort of place you would choose for a holiday ..... justice of a kind we find barbaric today was administered, particularly to those who were poor and unable to properly provide for or defend themselves."  Another good thing I saw recently, and I'm sure others saw it too, is about convict hulks research in Bermuda by Chris Addams and Michael Davis: Viz. http://convicthulks.com It's topical at present for Sydney because I think some of their found artefacts have been sent here for display. Their writings include some interesting comparison between Australians and Americans which people here might or might not agree with: "Prisoners upon these hulks were expendable. Convicts were to be used as a resource to strengthen defences and aid powerful countries to grow. Britain and Bermuda benefited by utilizing slave labor both white and black. These prisoners included not only convicts, but reformists, unionists and general insurrectionists who were fed up with the Status Quo. In essence, a solid background for the people who had their own way of seeing and doing things (very stubborn, very opinionated and ready for a fight at any time, just to name a few of their qualities.) The Confederate Southern States people loosely termed 'red-necks' are from this base, very little other than their accents divides them from basic Australian stock." Cheers, John >-----Original Message----- >From: aus-pt-jackson-convicts-bounces@rootsweb.com >[mailto:aus-pt-jackson- >Hello, >I would like to hear from any others who have an interest in the >transportation of English people, especially females, from Nottingham >to >Australia. >I am descended from a girl or young woman who took such a path .. >somewhat >against her own will no doubt. >I've found out, via Nottingham newpaper court reporting of the times, >that >she was trialled at: >Nottingham Shire Hall, >High Pavement, The Lace Market >Nottingham, NG1 1HN > > > > > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to AUS-PT-JACKSON-CONVICTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

I finally got a copy of the Parramatta Female Factory Index and .... No Margaret Kenny Several Margaret McKenna but the only one dated after Margaret's arrival in NSW, is 1843 which is after she arrived in VDL. So, now to order some Colonial secretary's letters. Does anyone know how I go about doing that? I can find info on ordering pre 1825 Col Sec but not the later stuff. Also, If I order several letters in one go, is it $25 each letter, or a lesser fee for the subsequent letters? cheers Min (Searching for KENNY, Margaret (4'11" in VDL) & KENNY, Margaret (5'6" in NSW)) ---------- *Earth is the insane asylum for the universe* ----------

Thank you for the below information John, it was most interesting. I do not think I can really understand how dreadful it must have been by those incarcerated within the walls, no matter what their crime. Jill J -----Original Message----- From: aus-pt-jackson-convicts-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:aus-pt-jackson- Hello, I would like to hear from any others who have an interest in the transportation of English people, especially females, from Nottingham to Australia. I am descended from a girl or young woman who took such a path .. somewhat against her own will no doubt. I've found out, via Nottingham newpaper court reporting of the times, that she was trialled at: Nottingham Shire Hall, High Pavement, The Lace Market Nottingham, NG1 1HN

Hello, I would like to hear from any others who have an interest in the transportation of English people, especially females, from Nottingham to Australia. I am descended from a girl or young woman who took such a path .. somewhat against her own will no doubt. I've found out, via Nottingham newpaper court reporting of the times, that she was trialled at: Nottingham Shire Hall, High Pavement, The Lace Market Nottingham, NG1 1HN This place remained in the English justice system until fairly recently, in the 1980s, after which it has been turned into a museum and also, I think, is headquarters of various ?volunteer/?NGO programs to hopefully salvage or modify the thinking of young offenders. The museum at the complex today is called the "Galleries of Justice". Nottingham became global headquarters of advances in the lace industry and underwent massive industrialisation .. with very considerable attendant poverty and pollution too. It is said that Nottingham’s Shire Hall was the only place in the UK where you could be tried, incarcerated and hanged on the front steps - all in the name of justice. Over the centuries, thousands of people have entered the building with a sense of dread for their future – as many would have been Imprisoned, and sometimes, even publicly executed on the front steps. It also apparently had a hanging room for persons not deemed worthy of public execution. The court, where the Nottingham Assizes was held, was on the ground level but underground there were several levels of underground dug-out cells or 'caves', This building's site has considerable antiquity with its older cave cells (known as the pits) lying deeper underground. It was announced in 2007 that it was intended to open up these to the public and the PR at the time ran as "Robin Hood's Prison - Sheriff's Dungeon Found At Nottingham" (Article by Caroline Lewis, 17/10/2007). The museum head, Tim Desmond, said "This is the first time visitors to the Galleries of Justice will be able to see the dungeon where Robin Hood would have been imprisoned in medieval times and already we have received a lot of interest from the public, from as far away as Japan." There is of course very little evidence to show that Robin really even existed, let alone where he was imprisioned. However, evidence regarding medieval excavations below the site does confirm the likely use of the place by the Sheriff of Nottingham. The dark dungeon cells would have been in use when the Sheriff himself resided at Shire Hall. One 'cave' cell had always been known of as the ‘Sheriff’s Dungeon’. The museum administration had not given this much thought until it came to do an exhibition dealing with the Sheriff of Nottingham. Staff who then began reviewing the evidence came to think that the Sheriff indeed did imprison felons in the lower level caves under the building. Nottingham itself was first known as Tiggua Cobaucc in Anglo-Saxon times or ‘Place of Caves’, and that there's said to be a 'labyrinth' of sandstone caves under the central area of the city where the Shire Hall and the modern Broadmarsh Shopping Center are. My ancestor was Ann Reffin. How many other females were sent from Nottingham to Sydney I do not yet know, but hope to find out. Best Regards John in wonderfully wet Sydney (The heat has ended!)

Hello All I have just joined the list and I am hoping that there is a Sage out there that can help me resolve my predicament. I have a convict Daniel CANVIN who was caught stealing from a person and was tried at the Guildhall (one word) Bristol 4 May 1820. From various paper reports he was in Newgate and Lawson's Gate Gaol. He sailed for Sydney Town on The Elizabeth 18 Aug 1820 from The Downs, Kent, England however that is about 200 miles from Bristol. Can someone help me understand why he would have had to travel that distance to board the ship and how would the authorities have organised it. It has me bluffed. Many thanks Jenny

Hi all Before we all spend more time on this. Ron lives in Canberra. The National Library of Australia is in.... Canberra. The National Library of Australia holds these particular microfilm. regards Lesley Uebel mailto:ckennedy@bigpond.net.au

Many thanks Lesley, I will try finding him at my library tomorrow. Regards, Sarah Davies

Ron You can get the Freeman's Journal on microfilm in through your local library on interlibrary loan, last time I did it cost $13 & you have to find a reader. I have used such microfilms at the State library in Sydney, much cheaper than a trip to Ireland, or Canberra for me at least Robyn Hardie ps have you exhausted the info on the Irish transportation database? On Sunday, February 8, 2009, at 12:56 PM, Ron Norton wrote: > Hi Lesley and List, > > Has any PJ Lister had any success researching Dublin convict trial > records? I'm trying to find an 1829 record for one of my PJ convict > ancestors. Any help would be greatly appreciated. > > Ron Norton > ronn007@optusnet.com.au > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > AUS-PT-JACKSON-CONVICTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the > message >

Thank you Lesley. I will follow up on these. Ron N ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lesley Uebel" <ckennedy@bigpond.net.au> To: <aus-pt-jackson-convicts@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 5:43 PM Subject: Re: [PJ] Dublin Trial Records > Hi Ron > > These records are available on microfilm. > > Regards > Lesley Uebel > mailto:ckennedy@bigpond.net.au > CLAIM A CONVICT