It seems to be the quickest way to have you identity stolen so I for one wont be doing it. Max Bancroft -------Original Message------- From: [email protected] Date: 10/08/2011 5:07:25 PM To: [email protected] Subject: AUS-PT-JACKSON-CONVICTS Digest, Vol 6, Issue 153 The Port Jackson Convicts Mailing List. Please don't hit Reply to respond to a digest message, but cut & paste the Specific message into a new email and change the subject heading Today's Topics: 1. Census special announcement for family historians (Richard Morgan) 2. Re: Census special announcement for family historians (Lesley Uebel) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2011 00:56:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Richard Morgan <[email protected]> Subject: [PJ] Census special announcement for family historians To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> Message-ID: <[email protected]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Hello fellow Convicts I've just thought of this today but have created a free website for any Australian - today or for the month of August - to submit a photo taken of themselves today or by the end of August to the following website. ?Just submit your photo by uploading or email, together with first name and suburb on census night. http://www.flickr.com/people/ozphoto2011 Or Ozphoto2011 AT yahoo.com It will become a photographic census record of Australians, first of its kind in the world. ?The idea is every 5 years the census is taken people can re-submit another photo. ?Hopefully 100s of thousands will contribute to this permanent photographic record of Australians. ?The website only requires a first name and suburb. Please let as many of your fellow Australian family and friends know about this. Thanks cobbers Richard Morgan NSW PS The website is legit. ?Sorry it's all I could come up with at such short notice. ?Happy censusing. ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2011 18:32:03 +1000 From: Lesley Uebel <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [PJ] Census special announcement for family historians To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> Message-ID: <[email protected]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed This has absolutely nothing to do with convicts and is off topic. I ask that no one responds Regards Lesley List Admin http://www.claimaconvict.net/index.html CLAIM A CONVICT Email: [email protected] On 9/08/2011 5:56 PM, Richard Morgan wrote: > Hello fellow Convicts > > > > I've just thought of this today but have created a free website for any Australian - today or for the month of August - to submit a photo taken of themselves today or by the end of ------------------------------ To contact the AUS-PT-JACKSON-CONVICTS list administrator, send an email to [email protected] To post a message to the AUS-PT-JACKSON-CONVICTS mailing list, send an email to [email protected] __________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] With the word "unsubscribe" without the quotes in the subject and the body of the Email with no additional text. End of AUS-PT-JACKSON-CONVICTS Digest, Vol 6, Issue 153 *******************************************************

This has absolutely nothing to do with convicts and is off topic. I ask that no one responds Regards Lesley List Admin http://www.claimaconvict.net/index.html CLAIM A CONVICT email: [email protected] On 9/08/2011 5:56 PM, Richard Morgan wrote: > Hello fellow Convicts > > > > I've just thought of this today but have created a free website for any Australian - today or for the month of August - to submit a photo taken of themself today or by the end of

Hi Everyone I've just realise I've made a little mistake with the last posting. Michael Byrne actually died in 1827 his son William is the one who died in 1838. Many thanks Dianna

Hi I'm trying to find information on a Susan ROBERTS who was living with Michael BYRNE on the 1806 Census. I've been trying to find the mother of my 3xGreat Grandfather William BYRNE who was born in West Bargo on the 4th of October 1807. So I'm hoping to find out more on Susan Roberts to see if she maybe Williams mother. Any information on her would be very much appreicated. I've just had a quick look on the BDM but couldn't find her death under Roberts or Byrne. Apparently Michaels wife is mentioned in his will but no name is given this was in 1838 I think. Kind regards Dianna

Hello fellow Convicts I've just thought of this today but have created a free website for any Australian - today or for the month of August - to submit a photo taken of themself today or by the end of August to the following website.  Just submit your photo by uploading or email, together with first name and suburb on census night. http://www.flickr.com/people/ozphoto2011 or ozphoto2011 AT yahoo.com It will become a photographic census record of Australians, first of its kind in the world.  The idea is every 5 years the census is taken people can re-submit another photo.  Hopefully 100s of thousands will contribute to this permanent photographic record of Australians.  The website only requires a first name and suburb. Please let as many of your fellow Australian family and friends know about this. Thanks cobbers Richard Morgan NSW PS The website is legit.  Sorry it's all I could come up with at such short notice.  Happy censusing.

Lesley this is a good information site - Wills of Ireland. http://www.scribd.com/doc/55986663/Will-Abstracts-in-the-Genealogical-Office-Dublin

Hi Gerry If John was on Norfolk Island in 1841 then he would not be listed by name as he was a convict. He would just be one of the number listed as residing at the Convict Establisment on Norfolk Island and the only ones listed by name are perhaps those in charge of that establisment. Regards Lesley Uebel http://www.claimaconvict.net/index.html CLAIM A CONVICT email: [email protected] On 4/08/2011 10:34 PM, Irelandcrokepark wrote: > I have looked for my ancestor John Keough Parmelia 2 on the census online > > I did not find him, were convicts on Norfolk not identified by Name > > Gerry Kennedy on a visit to New York > > Sent from phone > > O

Hi Lesley That must be the reason. Thanks Brian ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lesley Uebel" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2011 9:10 PM Subject: Re: [PJ] Henry Greentree > > Hi Brian > > Perhaps that is because Henry and Jane had a son named Henry who died in > 1877 > > > Regards > > Lesley Uebel > http://www.claimaconvict.net/index.html > CLAIM A CONVICT > > > email: [email protected] > > On 4/08/2011 8:52 PM, Brian & Beverley wrote: >> Hi Lyn >> >> Many thanks for your reply. It is confusing that Henry's in the 1841 >> census. >> I'll have to do some more research. >> >> Regards >> Brian Smith >> >> ----- > > ---------------------- > To send a message to the Port Jackson Convicts List, send an email to > [email protected] > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Brian Perhaps that is because Henry and Jane had a son named Henry who died in 1877 Regards Lesley Uebel http://www.claimaconvict.net/index.html CLAIM A CONVICT email: [email protected] On 4/08/2011 8:52 PM, Brian & Beverley wrote: > Hi Lyn > > Many thanks for your reply. It is confusing that Henry's in the 1841 census. > I'll have to do some more research. > > Regards > Brian Smith > > -----

Hi Lyn Many thanks for your reply. It is confusing that Henry's in the 1841 census. I'll have to do some more research. Regards Brian Smith ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stan Elgood" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2011 4:13 PM Subject: Re: [PJ] Henry Greentree > Hi Brian, > > Have you tried the Colonial Secretaries Correspondence on-line on the NSW > State Records website? There was a Henry Greentree listed per Marquis of > Wellington 1815 in the Wilberforce District of Windsor in the 1841 > census - > which is a little confusing if you have record that he died in 1818. > > It would appear that Henry Greentree arrived with a relative on the same > ship. Henry Greentree and William Greentree were both tried at > Southampton > Assizes on 7-3-1814 - they departed Aug.1814 according to British > Transportation Registers on the Qld State Library's British Transportation > register. > > Lyn > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Brian & Beverley" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2011 3:06 PM > Subject: [PJ] Henry Greentree > > >> Hi >> >> This is my first posting with the group so I hope I get it right. >> >> My wife's maiden name is Greentree. She's a descendant of a convict named >> Henry Greentree. I know that he arrived in Sydney on the "Marquis of >> Wellington" in January 1815 and that his wife and children followed him >> some time later that same year. They had apparently settled in the >> Wilberforce district when he died in 1818. >> >> I wondered if anyone could let me know what his movements were in those >> three years. >> >> Regards >> Brian Smith >> >> ---------------------- >> To send a message to the Port Jackson Convicts List, send an email to >> [email protected] >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > > ---------------------- > To send a message to the Port Jackson Convicts List, send an email to > [email protected] > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I have looked for my ancestor John Keough Parmelia 2 on the census online I did not find him, were convicts on Norfolk not identified by Name Gerry Kennedy on a visit to New York Sent from phone On 4 Aug 2011, at 07:10, Lesley Uebel <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hi Brian > > Perhaps that is because Henry and Jane had a son named Henry who died in > 1877 > > > Regards > > Lesley Uebel > http://www.claimaconvict.net/index.html > CLAIM A CONVICT > > > email: [email protected] > > On 4/08/2011 8:52 PM, Brian & Beverley wrote: >> Hi Lyn >> >> Many thanks for your reply. It is confusing that Henry's in the 1841 census. >> I'll have to do some more research. >> >> Regards >> Brian Smith >> >> ----- > > ---------------------- > To send a message to the Port Jackson Convicts List, send an email to > [email protected] > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Brian, Have you tried the Colonial Secretaries Correspondence on-line on the NSW State Records website? There was a Henry Greentree listed per Marquis of Wellington 1815 in the Wilberforce District of Windsor in the 1841 census - which is a little confusing if you have record that he died in 1818. It would appear that Henry Greentree arrived with a relative on the same ship. Henry Greentree and William Greentree were both tried at Southampton Assizes on 7-3-1814 - they departed Aug.1814 according to British Transportation Registers on the Qld State Library's British Transportation register. Lyn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian & Beverley" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2011 3:06 PM Subject: [PJ] Henry Greentree > Hi > > This is my first posting with the group so I hope I get it right. > > My wife's maiden name is Greentree. She's a descendant of a convict named > Henry Greentree. I know that he arrived in Sydney on the "Marquis of > Wellington" in January 1815 and that his wife and children followed him > some time later that same year. They had apparently settled in the > Wilberforce district when he died in 1818. > > I wondered if anyone could let me know what his movements were in those > three years. > > Regards > Brian Smith > > ---------------------- > To send a message to the Port Jackson Convicts List, send an email to > [email protected] > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi This is my first posting with the group so I hope I get it right. My wife's maiden name is Greentree. She's a descendant of a convict named Henry Greentree. I know that he arrived in Sydney on the "Marquis of Wellington" in January 1815 and that his wife and children followed him some time later that same year. They had apparently settled in the Wilberforce district when he died in 1818. I wondered if anyone could let me know what his movements were in those three years. Regards Brian Smith

Hello Jordan Thanks for the helpful information. It explains why the alias was continued through the convict records. My first thought was simply that on being arrested Charles gave a false name and, as is common in that situation, he chose a very common surname. Thanks to listers I now know that the alias wasn't just a false name, but had real significance. So we learn, little by little ! Cheers Ken From: Jordan <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [PJ] Alias Hi Ken Perhaps you have read a modern understanding of an alias backwards onto the historical use? I have posted on this topic on this list before and will quote from that: The Oxford Dictionary of Local and Family History says that: "Aliases were used in cases of illegitimacy, upon the remarriage of a parent, upon inheriting property from a female relative, etc. In some cases the alias form was inherited for several generations and was thus similar to a double-barrelled surname." In legal documents such as pardons there was a concern that if all the known names were not listed then the document might be defective. That is, if the document named a person as William Lucas but the conviction was in another name such as William Wake or William Lucas alias Wake, then the person referred to was another person. In the 18th and 19th centuries the law was obsessed by formula and generally speaking documents could not be amended. The form alias is a hangover from the use of medieval Latin in legal proceedings. It is short for 'alias dictus' or 'elsewhere called' usually translated as 'otherwise called' (also known as). I would have thought it was more liikely that a person with a common surname such as Smith would have an alias in the sense of another name used to distinguish this Smith from that Smith. Regards

From: Lesley Uebel <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [PJ] Alias Ken, Charles Smith alias Kimley arrived in PJ and was given a Conditional Pardon in 1835. Regards Lesley Uebel Terrific Lesley. You are a Wiz. Thanks. I am glad he survived ! Thanks also to Jenny W and Lyn who provided helpful information off line. Regards Ken

Hi Ken Perhaps you have read a modern understanding of an alias backwards onto the historical use? I have posted on this topic on this list before and will quote from that: The Oxford Dictionary of Local and Family History says that: "Aliases were used in cases of illegitimacy, upon the remarriage of a parent, upon inheriting property from a female relative, etc. In some cases the alias form was inherited for several generations and was thus similar to a double-barrelled surname." and In legal documents such as pardons there was a concern that if all the known names were not listed then the document might be defective. That is, if the document named a person as William Lucas but the conviction was in another name such as William Wake or William Lucas alias Wake, then the person referred to was another person. In the 18th and 19th centuries the law was obsessed by formula and generally speaking documents could not be amended. The form alias is a hangover from the use of medieval Latin in legal proceedings. It is short for 'alias dictus' or 'elsewhere called' usually translated as 'otherwise called' (also known as). I would have thought it was more liikely that a person with a common surname such as Smith would have an alias in the sense of another name used to distinguish this Smith from that Smith. Regards On 31 July 2011 20:59, Ken Thompson <[email protected]> wrote: > It seems strange that anyone named Smith would choose an alias, and an uncommon surname at that. I wonder if he was actually Kemley and the alias was Smith, but the court reporter had it back to front ?

Hi Joan, You will find lot of information about Kable, Lord and Underwood from Liz Parkinson's book "The Underwoods: Lock, Stock & Barrel" 1989. At one point, all three men were partners in business... I've found lot of interesting info in the book and even my ancestors families were involve. Her website: http://www.lazylizard.com.au/underwoods.htm Cheers, Darlene > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Sat, 30 Jul 2011 22:53:22 +1000 > From: "L Nichols" <[email protected]> > Subject: [PJ] Henry Kable > To: <[email protected]> > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > My apologies for this late reply, but I have been overseas. > > There is a short piece about the Kables on Page 58 of Sydney's "Daily Telegraph" for Thursday, 30th June, 2011. It also has a picture of my 3xgreat grandfather, Simeon Lord, who - at some stage in his career - was working with at least one of the Kable's. I'm not sure in what connection, but no doubt something to do with either importing and/or exporting. > > Joan Nichols >

Ken, Charles Smith alias Kimley arrived in PJ and was given a Conditional Pardon in 1835. Regards Lesley Uebel http://www.claimaconvict.net/index.html CLAIM A CONVICT email: [email protected] On 31/07/2011 8:59 PM, Ken Thompson wrote: > Hello Lesley& Listers > Charles Smith alias Kemley was tried for burglary at the Old Bailey 17.9.1817. > It seems strange that anyone named Smith would choose an alias, and an uncommon surname at that. I wonder if he was actually Kemley and the alias was Smith, but the court reporter had it back to front ? > Any comment ? > Smith and his companion in crime were sentenced to death. Smith was only 17, so possibly the sentence was commuted. Is there any way to find out if he was actually hanged ? > Ken Thompson

Hello Lesley & Listers Charles Smith alias Kemley was tried for burglary at the Old Bailey 17.9.1817. It seems strange that anyone named Smith would choose an alias, and an uncommon surname at that. I wonder if he was actually Kemley and the alias was Smith, but the court reporter had it back to front ? Any comment ? Smith and his companion in crime were sentenced to death. Smith was only 17, so possibly the sentence was commuted. Is there any way to find out if he was actually hanged ? Ken Thompson From: "Lesley Day" <[email protected]> Subject: [PJ] John Freezer alias Parker Hi Listers I was wondering if anyone would know how to get further information on John Freezer alias Parker who is my 3rd cousin 4 time removed. He was the son of Ann Freezer and John Parker who lived in Norfolk.

Hi Russell This information is very useful. One of my living Freezer's lives in Tasmania today and also family over in Australia. Have briefly looked at the Trove site but not returned anything so far. Would love to know whether John has any descendants. Many thanks for this. Best regards Lesley -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Russell Sent: 30 July 2011 22:45 To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [PJ] John Freezer alias Parker Convict from Norfolk, England to Australia on the "Ocean" in 1815 Lesley, He was immediately forwarded to Van Diemen's Land - this from the Colonial Secretary index: FREEZER, John. Per "Ocean", 1816 1816 Dec 16 On list of convicts to be sent to the Derwent per "Kangaroo" (Reel 6005; 4/3495 p.382) and this from the Tasmania archives: Freezer, John Convict No: 24984 Extra Identifier: SEE Surname: SEE Given Names: Voyage Ship: Kangaroo Voyage No: Arrival Date: 16 Dec 1816 Departure Date: Departure Port: Conduct Record: Muster Roll: Appropriation List: Other Records: CON13/1/1 <http://search.archives.tas.gov.au/default.aspx?detail=1&type=I&id=CON13/1/1 > p72 Indent: Description List: Remarks: To NSW per Ocean You will need to find a Tasmanian newsgroup for more help I guess. There also may be newspaper entries for John Freezer on the NLA site: http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper Regards, Russell Brisbane Lesley Day wrote: >Hi Listers > > > >I was wondering if anyone would know how to get further information on John >Freezer alias Parker who is my 3rd cousin 4 time removed. He was the son of >Ann Freezer and John Parker who lived in Norfolk. > > > >The information I have is the following from Ancestry. > > > >Trial at the Lent Assizes Thetford, Norfolk the 25 March 1815 before the >Right Honorable Edward Lord Ellenborough, Chief Justice of our Lord the >King. > > > >John Freezer, alias Parker aged 22 Committed October 28th, 1814 by the Court >of Qtr Sessions holden, by adjournement for the said county of Norfolk at >Holt in the said County, charged with felony. > > > >True bill. > > > >Sentenced to Life in Australia. Convicted 25 March 1815. Voyage 1815 on >the Ocean. > > > > > >Thank you for any information anyone may able to give me. > > > >With kind regards > > > >Lesley > >Researching in Norfolk, UK > > > > > > ---------------------- To send a message to the Port Jackson Convicts List, send an email to [email protected] ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message