Hi Richard, If you check BDM online he doesn't appear to have been a registered birth(?). Even the cold hard facts of the governor general's last Sunday lunch are quickly lost if the guv'mint or someone aren't doing their job. Perhaps they had a budget cut the year Thunderbolt was born and decided only to register two out of every five births at Wilberforce. I'm particularly interested in just how gaps in records came about. Or in any published studies on such. For convict records there's been a few studies, apparently, of how records came to get lost, or wilfully destroyed. But what happened to those studies? Perhaps they got lost too? I suspect it is all very complicated ... if only we knew. Cheers, John On Mon Mar 21 18:27 , Richard sent: Hello Does anyone have certificates of Thunderbolt's family - the BDM certificates? These should reveal the cold hard facts of the family lineage.. Richard Please remember to snip most of the earlier message before you post any reply...... Thank you! ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [1]AUS-NSW-HUNTER-VALLEY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ) References 1. javascript:top.opencompose('AUS-NSW-HUNTER-VALLEY-request@rootsweb.com','','','')

Hi John & listers, Firstly, regarding Frederick Ward (Thunderbolt), no record of his birth has been found, even according to the registry itself. See http://www.bdm.nsw.gov.au/familyHistory/thunderbolt.htm which also shows his death certificate (cert.copy). I don't know if it is true but I have read Thunderbolt was a Protestant and could have been born illegitimately. At the time of his birth (which ever date you agree with) you are actually talking about a record of baptism not a "registration" even though they appear as registrations in the registry's records. If a child was not baptised they may not have been recorded at all. Illegitimacy may be one reason, distance/remoteness another, remembering there wasn't a church for every denomination in every area at all times and just because the few Ministers travelled around doesn't mean they had contact with everyone or recorded events at the actual time they occurred, I would imagine. I remember reading somewhere that some, so attached to their own faith, refused to use a C of E minister and preferred to go without any marriage/baptism ceremony in the absence of their own. In 1810 the Governor had ordered Chaplains to keep registers of all births and deaths in their parish/district. I don't for one minute believe these were all accurate... and whilst C of E ministers were required to record & pass on registers to the government, other denominations were not required to until later years - see chart on guide 4 (these time gaps increase the likelihood of lost or inaccurate records in my opinion). I don't know anything about actual "gaps" in the records but living in the harsh environment of the colony (incl flood/fire), anything could happen to parish registers. Even in "civilised" England parish records have sometimes been lost/destroyed in full or part. In the guide 4 mentioned below you can look at the break down at "Detailed list of registers". Hopefully the following links & reading between the lines will give you an idea of why some births may not have been "registered". It pays to look for the background of records on the websites where you access them. I'm all for studies but you don't need a study to see that the record keeping was far from perfect in the colony. I think it was a miracle some births were recorded at all! History of the registry's records http://www.bdm.nsw.gov.au/familyHistory/historyofRegistrysRec.htm The 1810 order (partial quote) on the baptism page (SRNSW) http://tinyurl.com/4fe7ewm Short Guide 4 - Attorney General and Justice: Registers of births, deaths and marriages (SRNSW) http://tinyurl.com/4do9usx You may be interested in this page on lost & saved convict records which includes some census discussion (SRNSW). http://tinyurl.com/4cuv9h5 Regarding census/musters, are you aware of the following page? It is fantastic to refer to. http://www.convictcentral.com/index.html regards, Deb. -----Original Message----- From: john.mail@ozemail.com.au Sent: Monday, March 21, 2011 6:44 PM To: aus-nsw-hunter-valley@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [HV] Thunderbolts middle name Hi Richard, If you check BDM online he doesn't appear to have been a registered birth(?). Even the cold hard facts of the governor general's last Sunday lunch are quickly lost if the guv'mint or someone aren't doing their job. Perhaps they had a budget cut the year Thunderbolt was born and decided only to register two out of every five births at Wilberforce. I'm particularly interested in just how gaps in records came about. Or in any published studies on such. For convict records there's been a few studies, apparently, of how records came to get lost, or wilfully destroyed. But what happened to those studies? Perhaps they got lost too? I suspect it is all very complicated ... if only we knew. Cheers, John