Thanks Ken, I had just read a bit here, a bit there, didn't know which was right. If Fred was born in 1833, say, maybe his father was Carroll .. but whatever when wrong there, when Sarah moved to John Garbutt (in 1835/36) perhaps Garbutt didn't want the boy so he was left with Sarah's parents and that way he assumed the name Ward ? Could that be likely? Cheers, John On Thu Mar 24 21:28 , Kenneth EDWARDS sent: John wrote.. " It might be because his mother, who is held to have been Sarah Ward the daughter of Michael Ward, convict" I do not agree with this "recent" theory, the basis for which was originally the age of Sarah's Mother..It was implied that at age 47, Sophia was too old to have a child !.. so naturally he had to be Sarah's boy...Recently further weight was given to the argument with the discovery of Sarah's application to marry a prisoner named John HASWELL in August 1832..Calculations based on data from certificates put Fred's birth year around 1833 making the prisoner a likely candidate.HASWELL'S application was refused, but what is overlooked is that in Sep 1833 a 17 year old Sarah Anne WARD of Windsor was granted permission to marry another prisoner named Morgan CARROLL.Whether or not that person was our Sarah remains to be seen.. regardless, she did end up marrying John GARBUTT on the 7th December 1835.According to prison records Fred was born in either 1835 or 1836 in which case John Garbutt may well be Fred's Father !In reality, the only person with the correct answer is his Mother! .. be it Sarah or Sophia ! Ken Please remember to snip most of the earlier message before you post any reply...... Thank you! ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [1]AUS-NSW-HUNTER-VALLEY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ) References 1. javascript:top.opencompose('AUS-NSW-HUNTER-VALLEY-request@rootsweb.com','','','')