Julia Martha Mary Ann Ryan married Thomas William Smith on 18 July 1893 in Yass. Various NSW BDM certificates I have provide bits of information. There is one reference to her father being Patrick Ryan. Her ages and dates suggest she was born sometime between 1866 and 1871 - most likely 1866-1867. There are several references to her being born in Denman NSW. There was an Ann Ryan born 1869 in Muswellbrook but she died the same year. There was a Martha Ryan who had lots of kids in Muswellbrook around that time but they all died in 1870 and none had this person's name. Something must be wrong. Either ... She was lying about her age She was not born in Denman (or anywhere within cooee of Yass) Her father's name was not Patrick In any case I can't find anyone that fits the bill on the NSW BDM index. Is that normal?? I think she must have been born overseas. But it even says Denman, Hunter River on one of the certs. I'm out of ideas ? I've searched Trove as well but no luck there either. I do know of one other of my ancestors who's birth was not registered - maybe this is another such case.?? Regards Tim Jones

Hi Tim   Do you know Julia's mother's name? If you do, I suggest you do a search for her under her mother's maiden name - she may have been born prior to her mother marrying a Ryan and she took the Ryan surname. I have this occurring in my family tree, which is also Ryan based. In my case Elizabeth Ryan gave birth to a daughter then married James Smails and the daughter took the Smails surname and named James as her father when she married even though her birth was registered under the name of Ryan with no father named.   I am also looking for a birth for one of Elizabeth's sisters. Her name is Honora and she only became known to me via her parent's death certificates as she was named as a child of their marriage but todate I have been able to find a birth registration for her. I have come to the conclusion Honora is the name she was known to the family as but may not necessarily be her christian name or the name her birth was registered under. These Ryan's are a difficult bunch to piece together.   Good luck.   Roseanne  

What I found out is that Julia's mother (Martha Priest) and 5 of her siblings died in the massive 1870 floods in Denman. Only Julia (4 years old) and her father Patrick Ryan survived by clinging to a tree. Her birth certificate says "unnamed" which is why I couldn't find her. Thanks to Muswellbrook FHS for finding her for me. Tim Jones - Mobile: 0417-432-374 711/66 Bowman St, Pyrmont NSW 2009 -----Original Message----- From: Tim Jones Sent: Thursday, 10 March, 2011 12:42 AM To: aus-nsw-hunter-valley@rootsweb.com Subject: [HV] Julia Martha Mary Ann Ryan appeared out of nowhere Julia Martha Mary Ann Ryan married Thomas William Smith on 18 July 1893 in Yass.