Hi Paul, HEAR HEAR !!!! We had a few Officers too. One being threatened to be thrown overboard from the Sydney on our way home. We never saw him on the boat (ship). Many lives saved through courage of mates (mine included), but alas these are non events in the eyes of the egotists. Regards Wal ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Kinney" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 5:26 PM Subject: Re: AUS-MILITARY-D Digest V03 #34 > Ms Val Harris. > Dear Val, > The Victoria Cross has never had a 'lesser value' at any time. It > has always been for Conspicuous Gallantry above and beyond the Call of Duty > at the highest level. The reason the man did not get his medal is possibly > due to the quota system instituted by the British. Only so many awards of > the Victoria Cross could be awarded to the Colonies. > Many is the man who deserved the Victoria Cross while fighting for > Australia and few are the men who have recieved it because of the quota > system. The same applies to other gallantry awards issued by the British and > available to Australian servicemen. I well remember a platoon commander in > Viet Nam who told his men he would get his Military Cross no matter how many > of them died while he was earning it. > He managed to get 3 of them killed and 3 of them seriously wounded, he got > his medal and is spending his life in a wheel chair, hoping to never meet > any of his former platoon, they want to kill him. The one thing you will > notice about award systems is that they favour officers, not enlisted men. > The reason for this is that officers write up the recommendations for > awards. The system is open to abuse, and is abused. The American officers > who wrote each other up in Viet Nam is a classic example. Gallantry awards > are a major boost to an officers or NCO's career, my own section commander > informed us that he was desirous of obtaining a Military Medal. We > collectively wished him good luck and told him he was on his own. We > survived, he survived, without his MM. > There are thousands's of recipients of gallantry awards in this > country who have thoroughly deserved their awards and the recognition that > go's with them, equally, their are thousands more who deserve awards who > will never get them, the dingo's who have received awards they didn't > deserve become known. While the quota system exists > for British awards the system will continue to be unfair. If the Australian > government bites the bullet and gives the Pom awards the old heave ho, then > it is possible that Australian service men and women might be in with a show > of having their gallantry recognised when it occurs. From my understanding > of the current situation the Australian government can award the Australia > Victoria Cross. Whether it is made from the metal of the Sebastapol cannon > or not I don't know. > Hope this information is of some use to you. > Respectfully > Paul Kinney > > > > > > >From: [email protected] > >Reply-To: [email protected] > >To: [email protected] > >Subject: AUS-MILITARY-D Digest V03 #34 > >Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 14:00:01 -0700 > > > ><< message2.txt >> > ><< message4.txt >> > ><< message6.txt >> > ><< message8.txt >> > ><< message10.txt >> > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Hotmail now available on Australian mobile phones. Go to > http://ninemsn.com.au/mobilecentral/hotmail_mobile.asp > > > ==== AUS-MILITARY Mailing List ==== > The Military Historical Society of Australia > http://www.pcug.org.au/~astaunto/mhsa.htm >

Paul Kinney says, "While the quota system exists for British awards the system will continue to be unfair. If the Australian government bites the bullet and gives the Pom awards the old heave ho, then it is possible that Australian service men and women might be in with a show of having their gallantry recognised when it occurs. From my understanding > of the current situation the Australian government can award the Australia Victoria Cross." ******************* Hey Paul, read the newspaper once in a while Australia has had it's own Awards system in place for quite a while. Do you seriously believe that a quota system will not be applied? What is the benefit, so far, of the Australian Awards system? We have awarded medals to hundreds of thousands of National Servicemen who did 94 days training in the 1950s, we have made tens of thousands of men who did buggar all, eligible for the Australian Service Medal 1945/75, we have medals for this medals for that and the end result is that they become almost meaningless. If you want an American opinion of the situation go to http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-medals/too-many.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Annie and Wal" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 7:19 PM Subject: Re: AUS-MILITARY-D Digest V03 #34 > Hi Paul, > HEAR HEAR !!!! > We had a few Officers too. > One being threatened to be thrown overboard from the Sydney on our way home. > We never saw him on the boat (ship). > Many lives saved through courage of mates (mine included), but alas these > are non events in the eyes of the egotists. > Regards > Wal > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Paul Kinney" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 5:26 PM > Subject: Re: AUS-MILITARY-D Digest V03 #34 > > > > Ms Val Harris. > > Dear Val, > > The Victoria Cross has never had a 'lesser value' at any time. It > > has always been for Conspicuous Gallantry above and beyond the Call of > Duty > > at the highest level. The reason the man did not get his medal is possibly > > due to the quota system instituted by the British. Only so many awards of > > the Victoria Cross could be awarded to the Colonies. > > Many is the man who deserved the Victoria Cross while fighting for > > Australia and few are the men who have recieved it because of the quota > > system. The same applies to other gallantry awards issued by the British > and > > available to Australian servicemen. I well remember a platoon commander in > > Viet Nam who told his men he would get his Military Cross no matter how > many > > of them died while he was earning it. > > He managed to get 3 of them killed and 3 of them seriously wounded, he got > > his medal and is spending his life in a wheel chair, hoping to never meet > > any of his former platoon, they want to kill him. The one thing you will > > notice about award systems is that they favour officers, not enlisted men. > > The reason for this is that officers write up the recommendations for > > awards. The system is open to abuse, and is abused. The American officers > > who wrote each other up in Viet Nam is a classic example. Gallantry awards > > are a major boost to an officers or NCO's career, my own section commander > > informed us that he was desirous of obtaining a Military Medal. We > > collectively wished him good luck and told him he was on his own. We > > survived, he survived, without his MM. > > There are thousands's of recipients of gallantry awards in this > > country who have thoroughly deserved their awards and the recognition that > > go's with them, equally, their are thousands more who deserve awards who > > will never get them, the dingo's who have received awards they didn't > > deserve become known. While the quota system exists > > for British awards the system will continue to be unfair. If the > Australian > > government bites the bullet and gives the Pom awards the old heave ho, > then > > it is possible that Australian service men and women might be in with a > show > > of having their gallantry recognised when it occurs. From my understanding > > of the current situation the Australian government can award the Australia > > Victoria Cross. Whether it is made from the metal of the Sebastapol cannon > > or not I don't know. > > Hope this information is of some use to you. > > Respectfully > > Paul Kinney > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: [email protected] > > >Reply-To: [email protected] > > >To: [email protected] > > >Subject: AUS-MILITARY-D Digest V03 #34 > > >Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 14:00:01 -0700 > > > > > ><< message2.txt >> > > ><< message4.txt >> > > ><< message6.txt >> > > ><< message8.txt >> > > ><< message10.txt >> > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Hotmail now available on Australian mobile phones. Go to > > http://ninemsn.com.au/mobilecentral/hotmail_mobile.asp > > > > > > ==== AUS-MILITARY Mailing List ==== > > The Military Historical Society of Australia > > http://www.pcug.org.au/~astaunto/mhsa.htm > > >