Sorry, original E-mail sent from incorrect AUS-MILITARY subscriber E-mail address and therefore was not accepted into the AUS-MILITARY Mailing List!!!!! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eldon R.J. (Don) Bryant" <[email protected]> To: "AUSTRALIAN MILITARY Mailing List" <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, 21 April 2003 16:35 Subject: " W.W.I Map ref. " > Belated Easter Greetings to list readers from Townsville, Oz. > > I am currently completing the transcription of six (6) personal W.W.I > diaries kept by a Lieutenant Lyell Keith SWANN MM, some details > as follows; > > "" Some time back I inherited his diaries which consist of daily hand > written entries, newspaper cuttings and photographs spanning the years > March 1916 to November 1918. The entries relate up until the previous > day ( 13/11/1918 ) of his flying death whilst taking off with a flight > patrol at 11 a.m. on 14 November 1918 when he was seen to spin at > about 300 feet. > > He crashed to the ground and was taken to 63rd C.C.S. where he died at 10 > p.m. the same night, fractured Bone and internal injuries. > > Aerodrome. Grande Ennehierres: near LILLE. > > Buried at "ASCQ" Cemetery by Hospital Chaplain. > > Map reference TOURNAI.5. > > ( Some of above details were extracted from a copy of ' STATEMENT D.16. > signed by W.J. COOPER. Capt. for O.C. 4th A.F.C. ) > > Lyell Keith SWANN Enlisted in the AIF 14/03/1916 in Adelaide, South > Australia with the rank of Private, Number 2156. > > Left Australia on the boat " ANCHINES " 28/08/1916. > > Arrived England 11/10/1916. > > Sgt. L.K. Swann > " C " Co > 40th Battalion No 8 Camp, Lark Hill > > Sgt. L.K. Swann > 3rd Reinforcements > 43rd Battalion. AIF > > Graduated for A.F.C. Pilot > Category A July 30th 1918 > Category B October, 23rd 1918 > > Awarded the Military Medal for Conspicuous Gallantry at Messines > 29/06/1917 > > Received his commission July 1, 1917. > > Last entry in diary six (6) he was flying to Ostende from Ennetieres > ( approx. 9 klm from Lille ). Landed at Froidmont near Tournai. > > Last diary entry reads: " " 13th NOVEMBER 1918 - OUR ACTING FLIGHT > COMMANDER HELLER TOOK MOXHAM & I FOR A FORMATION FLIP. > WE WERE GOING UP TO OSTEND BUT HELLER HAD TO LAND NEAR > WERVING SO WE SET OFF FOR HOME. HOWEVER WHEN WE HAD > ONLY GONE A FEW MILES WE LANDED AT AN AERODROME AT > LINSELLES TO PROCURE ASSISTANCE FOR HIM. AFTER HAVING > SOME TEA THERE WE TOOK OFF & SET FOR HOME. > > WE MISSED THE DROME THOUGH & HAD TO LAND > AT FROIDMONT NEAR TOURNAI. STAYED WITH THE > 21st R.A.F. SQUADRON ALL NIGHT & RETURNED > NEXT MORNING. THE TERMS OF THE ARMISTACE > ARE GREAT & I DON'T THINK FOR A MOMENT THAT > WE'LL HAVE TO STOUSH UP AGAIN. STAN HOWARD > JOINED UP AGAIN TODAY. "" > > > >>>>>>>>NOW FOR THE MAIN REASON FOR THIS MESSAGE POSTING... > > > The ' Sunday Mail ' newspaper, Brisbane ( Page 6 April 20, 2003 ) > contained an editorial W.W.I DIGGERS' REMAINS FOUND and the > ' Townsville Bulletin ' newspaper ( Page 32 Monday, April 21, 2003 ) > contained an editorial DIGGERS' REMAINS FOUND IN FRANCE. > > A lengthly entry in the Swann diaries 7th June 1917 makes reference > to four (4) soldiers being killed, gives two (2) of the killed soldiers > names, burial details etc etc and a map reference and I quote; > > Map ref. approx. Ploegsteert 1/10,000. 28. S.W.4. Edition 4.8. 8.A. > 5 - 3.50. > > What I need to know from some knowledgeable person, is the conversion of > the above Map ref. to today's Latitude and Longitude to compare with Lat. > / Long. information procured via the Internet and as follows: > > > HAZEBROUCK ( France ) > Lat 50 degree 43' 0 North > Long 2 degree 31' 60 East > > PLOEGSTEERT ( Belgium ) > Lat 50 degree 43' 0 North > Long 2 degree 52' 60 East > > I am rather excited at the prospects of clarification coming from someone > and on the eve of ANZAC day too! > > Yours in anticipation, > > Eldon Bryant........ > > > GREETINGS FROM TOWNSVILLE; > > Eldon R.J. (Don) Bryant > J.P. (C.dec) QJA Life Member > " Villa Pamphili " > 7 Hibiscus Street > Cranbrook. 4814. Queensland. AUSTRALIA. > > Telephone: (07) 4775 6579. > Facsimile: (07) 4775 3579. > E-mail: [email protected] > [email protected] > [email protected] > [email protected] > > GENEALOGISTS HAVE GREAT-GREAT-GREAT RELATIONS. > > ............ END OF SIGNATURE ............ > > > > > > >
I have looked at Peter Chausseaud's 'The Topography of Armageddon'. The book does include three extracts from the Ploegstreert 1/000 map (28SW4). Unfortunately none of these include the part of the map that you are interested in. You will need either a copy of the map or access to the Imperial War Museum CD-ROM of trench maps. The map reference reads; The sheet title - in your case 28 SW4 Then the 6000 yard square indicated by a letter ('8') then the 1000 yard square within the 6000 yard square given by a letter ('A') and within that square the reference is 5/10 along from west to east and 3.5/10 up from south to north. I do not know of an easy way to convert trench map references to latitude and longitude. It would be very useful if it could be done - we could have g.p.s. guided battlefield walks. Hope this helps Roger Beckett (in UK) -----Original Message----- From: Eldon R J (Don) Bryant [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: 21 April 2003 11:57 To: [email protected] Subject: Fw: " WWI Map ref. " Sorry, original E-mail sent from incorrect AUS-MILITARY subscriber E-mail address and therefore was not accepted into the AUS-MILITARY Mailing List!!!!! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eldon R.J. (Don) Bryant" <[email protected]> To: "AUSTRALIAN MILITARY Mailing List" <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, 21 April 2003 16:35 Subject: " W.W.I Map ref. " > Belated Easter Greetings to list readers from Townsville, Oz. > > I am currently completing the transcription of six (6) personal W.W.I > diaries kept by a Lieutenant Lyell Keith SWANN MM, some details > as follows; > > "" Some time back I inherited his diaries which consist of daily hand > written entries, newspaper cuttings and photographs spanning the years > March 1916 to November 1918. The entries relate up until the previous > day ( 13/11/1918 ) of his flying death whilst taking off with a flight > patrol at 11 a.m. on 14 November 1918 when he was seen to spin at > about 300 feet. > > He crashed to the ground and was taken to 63rd C.C.S. where he died at 10 > p.m. the same night, fractured Bone and internal injuries. > > Aerodrome. Grande Ennehierres: near LILLE. > > Buried at "ASCQ" Cemetery by Hospital Chaplain. > > Map reference TOURNAI.5. > > ( Some of above details were extracted from a copy of ' STATEMENT D.16. > signed by W.J. COOPER. Capt. for O.C. 4th A.F.C. ) > > Lyell Keith SWANN Enlisted in the AIF 14/03/1916 in Adelaide, South > Australia with the rank of Private, Number 2156. > > Left Australia on the boat " ANCHINES " 28/08/1916. > > Arrived England 11/10/1916. > > Sgt. L.K. Swann > " C " Co > 40th Battalion No 8 Camp, Lark Hill > > Sgt. L.K. Swann > 3rd Reinforcements > 43rd Battalion. AIF > > Graduated for A.F.C. Pilot > Category A July 30th 1918 > Category B October, 23rd 1918 > > Awarded the Military Medal for Conspicuous Gallantry at Messines > 29/06/1917 > > Received his commission July 1, 1917. > > Last entry in diary six (6) he was flying to Ostende from Ennetieres > ( approx. 9 klm from Lille ). Landed at Froidmont near Tournai. > > Last diary entry reads: " " 13th NOVEMBER 1918 - OUR ACTING FLIGHT > COMMANDER HELLER TOOK MOXHAM & I FOR A FORMATION FLIP. > WE WERE GOING UP TO OSTEND BUT HELLER HAD TO LAND NEAR > WERVING SO WE SET OFF FOR HOME. HOWEVER WHEN WE HAD > ONLY GONE A FEW MILES WE LANDED AT AN AERODROME AT > LINSELLES TO PROCURE ASSISTANCE FOR HIM. AFTER HAVING > SOME TEA THERE WE TOOK OFF & SET FOR HOME. > > WE MISSED THE DROME THOUGH & HAD TO LAND > AT FROIDMONT NEAR TOURNAI. STAYED WITH THE > 21st R.A.F. SQUADRON ALL NIGHT & RETURNED > NEXT MORNING. THE TERMS OF THE ARMISTACE > ARE GREAT & I DON'T THINK FOR A MOMENT THAT > WE'LL HAVE TO STOUSH UP AGAIN. STAN HOWARD > JOINED UP AGAIN TODAY. "" > > > >>>>>>>>NOW FOR THE MAIN REASON FOR THIS MESSAGE POSTING... > > > The ' Sunday Mail ' newspaper, Brisbane ( Page 6 April 20, 2003 ) > contained an editorial W.W.I DIGGERS' REMAINS FOUND and the > ' Townsville Bulletin ' newspaper ( Page 32 Monday, April 21, 2003 ) > contained an editorial DIGGERS' REMAINS FOUND IN FRANCE. > > A lengthly entry in the Swann diaries 7th June 1917 makes reference > to four (4) soldiers being killed, gives two (2) of the killed soldiers > names, burial details etc etc and a map reference and I quote; > > Map ref. approx. Ploegsteert 1/10,000. 28. S.W.4. Edition 4.8. 8.A. > 5 - 3.50. > > What I need to know from some knowledgeable person, is the conversion of > the above Map ref. to today's Latitude and Longitude to compare with Lat. > / Long. information procured via the Internet and as follows: > > > HAZEBROUCK ( France ) > Lat 50 degree 43' 0 North > Long 2 degree 31' 60 East > > PLOEGSTEERT ( Belgium ) > Lat 50 degree 43' 0 North > Long 2 degree 52' 60 East > > I am rather excited at the prospects of clarification coming from someone > and on the eve of ANZAC day too! > > Yours in anticipation, > > Eldon Bryant........ > > > GREETINGS FROM TOWNSVILLE; > > Eldon R.J. (Don) Bryant > J.P. (C.dec) QJA Life Member > " Villa Pamphili " > 7 Hibiscus Street > Cranbrook. 4814. Queensland. AUSTRALIA. > > Telephone: (07) 4775 6579. > Facsimile: (07) 4775 3579. > E-mail: [email protected] > [email protected] > [email protected] > [email protected] > > GENEALOGISTS HAVE GREAT-GREAT-GREAT RELATIONS. > > ............ 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