I'm off a bit on this... I was writing this when I was at work and away from my database. Now some researchers indicate that John Armstrong b. 1759 is the son of Robert Armstrong and Alice Calhoun. Robert Armstrong and Alice Calhoun son Robert Armstrong and Jan VanArsdale son John Armstrong and Nancy Erwin This is how I have seen it shown... Does anyone have any thoughts on this lineage. Could the following be concerning Robert Jr. from above? I found this many years ago while researching Fayette County Ohio records but have never figured out who it was. No. 198 Page 256 January 22, 1814. James Steele and Elizabeth or Betsey Steele his wife, the said Elizabeth being one of heirs or legal representatives of Robert Armstrong Jt. deceased, of Monroe County State of Virginia one part by their attorney in fact Joel Walker of Champaign County Ohio and Thomas Armstrong of Champaign County Ohio other part 400 A. being part of tract of 1000 A. conveyed to said Thomas and Elizabeth by heirs of Robert Armstrong, Junr. deceased, in manner following; 300 A. to Thomas and 400 A. to James Steele and wife Elizabeth, lying in Fayette County on both Witnesses Jonah Baldwin J.P. for Champaign Co. Ohio James Steele Elizabeth of Betsey Steele The following was found in the Fayette County Ohio Deed Book A: No. 199 Page 258 James Steele and Elizabeth Steele his wife of County of Monroe State of Virginia authorize Joel Walker of Champaign County Ohio to sell 400 A. land in Fayette County Ohio on North Fork of Paint Creek, being part of tract of 1000 A. granted to Robert Armstrong Junr. deceased 700 A. of said tract being conveyed to James Steele and Elizabeth his wife and Thomas Armstrong, the said Elizabeth and Thomas being two of legal heirs of Robert now deceased which was conveyed to them by Joel Walker and wife Margaret, Archibald Armstrong and Robert Armstrong heirs of said Robert, deceased. Witnesses William T. Mann James Steele Archibald Armstrong Elizabeth Steele Trist'm Patton J. P. for Monroe Co. VA. There is a marriage record in Bath Co., Va. for Elizabeth Armstrong and Thomas Mann for May 8, 1790. and another marriage record for Elizabeth Mann and James Steele for Jul 7, 1801.

No, Marilyn, those are real names and real people in my history. Cousin Ben from North-central Maine where the leaves are falling.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marilyn Otterson" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 10:41 PM Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] Potatoes > Ben, did you make those names up? I got a kick out of Ms. Lovely and her > daughter marrying somebody named "Nimrod." > > Cousin Marilyn > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ben Barr" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 10:36 PM > Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] Potatoes > > >> This discussion about potatoes and who grows them would actually be part >> of >> the geneaological discussion, as the DeMerchant that I mention married an >> Armstrong. >> >> Elizabeth Armstrong, daughter of Stillman Armstrong and Maria Lovely, >> married Nimrod DeMerchant circa 1860 in Perth, New Brunswick. >> >> Cousin Ben in North-central Maine where the leaves have begun to fall >> upon >> the potatoe fields >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Robyn Leeds" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 9:30 PM >> Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] Potatoes >> >> >>> "I can remember my cousin (1st-once removed) bringing a 50-pound sack of >>> DeMerchant potatoes every time he came for a visit to our area." >>> >>> This is bringing back memories for me too. I remember my big brother >>> Joe, >>> oldest of 4 brothers, bringing me a bag of Tassie potatoes when he went >>> home to visit Mum and Dad. I couldn't bring myself to eat them all, or >>> to >>> waste them either, so I planted them and grew my own!! ;D >>> >>> Take care, >>> >>> Rob. >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

"You, my best friend, has never read my blog." Is it on your website Marilynn? Speaking of which, would you believe that once again I can't find the darn URL?!? I swear gremlins keep stealing it on me! :(((( If it's on a DIFFERENT website, can you please send me the URL? I love the way you write, you always put a smile on my face, or better still make me laugh!! :D Take care, Rob.

Hi everyone :) ON topic for a change!! ;D There are quite a few Armstrong women listed on the Women's Suffrage Petition, which was (very briefly) a petition signed by women in Victoria, Australia fighting for the right to vote. Apparently there were nearly 30,000 signatures when it was tabled in parliament in September of that year, very impressive!! :D Anyway, here's the URL for the petition, just type in "Armstrong" under "Name" and search ... http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/WomensPetition/ It looks like there's about 30-40 Armstrong women who have signed, so if you have any ancestors in Australia (or any you can't find, you just never know!! ;D) it would pay to go do a search. While it doesn't give a huge amount of detail (basically only name and address), it's nice to know our female Armstrong ancestors were this "spunky"!! ;D Take care, Robyn. IBSSG Stockbridge, Georgia, USA Honey's Home of Genealogy www.honeyshome.com

"To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message" Since this is attached to ALL messages sent through this list, shouldn't you be able to unsubscribe from the email addy you're RECEIVING these email from? As John said, it must be a different one than you're trying to unsub from, but if that's the case, WHY are you trying to unsub from an email addy where you don't even get the messages? Are you blonde?!? Sorry, couldn't resist!! lol Take care, Rob.

You will enjoy the vist to the Borders Ben. Do a little research first. We visited the tower early in the AM and, of course, it opens at 1400 hrs. We moved on to the Clan Armstrong Center and of course that was the day it is closed. Our schedule did not allow for a lay-over because we had only 24 days to see ALL of Ireland and Scotland. We did enjoy the local scenery and driving our big motorhome out to the Hermitage was a hoot. Seems to me we did stop and read a historic marker where the famous A jumped his pony off of the bridge to escape a neck-stretching. We did get to stand in the hall at the Hermitage where all of those A's were invited for dinner and murdered. (death or haggis, don't know which would be worse) At our campground just south of the tower, the proprieter looked at my Visa card and said, "Ah, an Armstrong is it? 100 years ago we'da been happy ta hang ya. Now we're happy to welcome ya." Cousin Chuck, (late of N. Padre Island, now living in AZ) > [Original Message] > From: Ben Sessions <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Date: 10/10/2006 8:57:42 AM > Subject: [ARMSTRONG] Border Reivers > > Here's my A* lineage back through Johnnie of Gilnockie and even further back to Henry. It includes many Border Reivers. All this was sent to me by a cousin in Orlando,FL. > A common ancestor of ours was a great,great grandfather,Solomon STREET, who was married to a Mary Armstrong whose lineage you see below. If you connect to any of the A*'s below,please let me know. My mother is listed at the end of the list, Berta Aquina STREET SESSIONS. > My wife and I are planning a trip to Scotland (for next year) to visit the Gilnockie Tower and perhaps we'll run across some ARMSTRONG kin. > Blessings and peace from Houston,TX, > > Benj.STREET Sessions > [email protected] > > > Descendants of Henry ARMSTRONG > > > Generation No. 1 > > 1. HENRY1 ARMSTRONG was born in Scotland, Falde, and died in England. > > Notes for HENRY ARMSTRONG: > END > > Child of HENRY ARMSTRONG is: > 2. i. DAVID2 ARMSTRONG, b. Scotland, Falde. > > > Generation No. 2 > > 2. DAVID2 ARMSTRONG (HENRY1) was born in Scotland, Falde. > > Child of DAVID ARMSTRONG is: > 3. i. ALAN JOHN3 ARMSTRONG, b. Scotland, Galloway; d. Scotland, Falde. > > > Generation No. 3 > > 3. ALAN JOHN3 ARMSTRONG (DAVID2, HENRY1) was born in Scotland, Galloway, and died in Scotland, Falde. He married MARGARET DE MORMAER. She was born in Scotland, Galloway. > > Notes for MARGARET DE MORMAER: > END > > Child of ALAN ARMSTRONG and MARGARET DE MORMAER is: > 4. i. JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4 ARMSTRONG, b. Scotland, Northumberland; d. England. > > > Generation No. 4 > > 4. JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4 ARMSTRONG (ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born in Scotland, Northumberland, and died in England. He married ISABEL UNKNOWN. She was born in Scotland, Falde. > > Child of JOHN ARMSTRONG and ISABEL UNKNOWN is: > 5. i. FIRST LAIRD OF MANGERTON ALEXANDER5 ARMSTRONG, b. Scotland, Falde; d. Scotland, Falde. > > > Generation No. 5 > > 5. FIRST LAIRD OF MANGERTON ALEXANDER5 ARMSTRONG (JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born in Scotland, Falde, and died in Scotland, Falde. He married ISABEL UNKNOWN. She was born in Scotland, Falde. > > Child of ALEXANDER ARMSTRONG and ISABEL UNKNOWN is: > 6. i. WILLIAM6 ARMSTRONG, b. Scotland, Falde; d. Scotland. > > > Generation No. 6 > > 6. WILLIAM6 ARMSTRONG (ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born in Scotland, Falde, and died in Scotland. He married ELIZABETH DE BRUCE OF SCOTLAND, daughter of ROBERT OF SCOTLAND and ISABEL DE CLARE. She was born in Scotland, Falde. > > Child of WILLIAM ARMSTRONG and ELIZABETH OF SCOTLAND is: > 7. i. BRUCE7 ARMSTRONG, b. Scotland, Mangerton Castle Liddesdale Dumphrieshire. > > > Generation No. 7 > > 7. BRUCE7 ARMSTRONG (WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born in Scotland, Mangerton Castle Liddesdale Dumphrieshire. He married CLAR ELIZABETH CAMERON. > > Notes for BRUCE ARMSTRONG: > Born in 1241, the only son of Alexander II and his second wife, Marie de Coucy, Alexander became king at the age of seven, on the death of his father. On Christmas Day 1251, when he was ten, he was knighted at York by Henry III, and the following day he was married to the English monarch's eldest daughter, Princess Margaret. > > Alexander proved a strong-willed king who, despite the English influence in his youth, refused to swear homage for his kingdom. He continued his father's efforts to establish Scottish mastery of the Isles. In 1263 his army inflicted a notable defeat on Hakon, King of Norway, at the Battle of Largs in Ayrshire. The Norwegians were subsequently forced to concede to him the Western Isles and the Isle of Man, under the treaty of Perth in 1266. > > Alexander established good relations with his brother-in-law Edward I. On 19 August 1274, Alexander and Margaret attended the coronation of her brother in Westminster Abbey. Margaret died six months later, leaving three children. > > Within a few years, Alexander suffered a further series of family tragedies. His younger son David died in 1281 at the age of eight; his daughter Margaret, who had married King Eric of Norway, died in childbirth in 1283; and his elder son Alexander died childless in 1284 after a long illness. A week after the prince's death, the Scottish Parliament recognised Margaret, the little daughter of Eric and Margaret, as the heir presumptive to the Scottish throne. > � > Alexander was only 44, and so he decided that the best way to avoid a constitutional crisis was to remarry and have more sons. On 14 October 1285 he therefore took as his wife Yolande, Comtesse de Montfort, daughter of Robert IV, Comte de Dreux. > > Five months later, on 19 March 1286, Alexander's horse stumbled and he fell from a cliff near Kinghorn, Fife. The king was killed, leaving the Scots to mourn an energetic, effective monarch who had brought them peace and prosperity. > > > Child of BRUCE ARMSTRONG and CLAR CAMERON is: > 8. i. ALEXANDER II8 ARMSTRONG, b. Scotland, Jedburgh Roxburghshire; d. Scotland, Hermitage Castle Lindores Fife Fifeshire. > > > Generation No. 8 > > 8. ALEXANDER II8 ARMSTRONG (BRUCE7, WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born in Scotland, Jedburgh Roxburghshire, and died in Scotland, Hermitage Castle Lindores Fife Fifeshire. He married MARGUERITE DE DAMPIERRE OF FRANCE in Scotland, Roxburgh Roxburghshire, daughter of GUY OF FRANCE and MAHAUT OF FRANCE. She was born in France, Dampierre, and died in Scotland, Hermitage Castle Lindores Fife. > > Notes for ALEXANDER II ARMSTRONG: > CHECK LINK HERE > First Lord of Mangerton Castle. Murdered by Lord Soulis at Hermitage Castle. > Source- Chart of the Ten Lords of Mangerton Castle, Scotland > > Second Lord of Mangerton Castle. Murdered by William Lord Soulis at a feast in Hermitage Castle, when the black bull's head was placed upon the table. Accross the river, in full view of Maingertoun and facing the north wall of the castle, stands the Milnholm Cross. Upon it's shaft is carved a long two-headed sword pointing downward. An addition bearing a shield with arms has within a recent period been surmounted upon the cross; probably about the same time the upper portion of the face was removed, leaving the letters A A and M A in relief. These replaced the original characters A A II which were visible at the end of the last century (see map of 1812) This monument was erected about 1320. > > Alexander Armstrong, 2nd Laird of Mangerton, Called "The Young Laird" of Mangerton Castle, is understood to have been originally built by a Knight of the Baron De Soulis of Norman descent, named Maiger, and held by him before the year 1250. During a Bloody Civil War with England, Alexander Armstrong was appointed the 2nd Laird of Mangerton Castle in 1300, and believed to have been by, King of Scotland John of Baliol 1292-1306. Mangerton Castle, the fortress along the Border were repaired in 1244 by King Alexander II of Scotland, who also built in Liddesdale the Castle of Hermitage. > > Mangerton Castle was employed as a place of strength by King Robert Bruce, whom the Armstrongs followed. In a Deed of resignation, November 2, 1482, to the Earl of Angus, friend of Thomas Armstrong, in favor of David Scott of Branxhelme, Mangerton is there stated to have belonged to Thomas Armstrong "heritably". In 1569 the Regent Murray, spending a Sunday night at Mangerton, ordered the Castle in the morning to be destroyed by gunpowder. But it withstood the shock and must soon have been repaired, for in its northerly wall is a remarkable stone upon which is carved a shield bearing the charges of Merieton and the emblem of Siward. Outside of the shield are carved the numeral, 1583 with the letters S A and E F , standing it is said for Symon Armstrong and wife Elizabeth Foster. > > Alexander Armstrong, 1st Laird of Mangerton, Chief of the Armstrong Clan lived here in 1320 and his descendants remained until the Union of the Crowns in 1612, when the Castle was finally destroyed by the forces of King James VI of Scotland; who became King James I of England. Only portions of the west & south walls of the fortalice remain visible. Access gained at all times by the disused railway line south of Newcastleton. > > The story told in the first Ballad of "Alexander Murdered by Soulis, a Norman nobleman of ancient lineage who had been appointed overlord of "The Hermitage", a sister castle with extensive living quarters, dungeons and billets for as many an 100 soldiers charged with keeping the peace in Liddesdale. Because the Armstrongs had aided The Bruce when he was on the run and were friendly with him, de Soulis hated and envied them. > > On the evening, in 1320, when de Soulis was feeling bored, he rode along the river, where he saw the innocent young daughter of one of the Border families picking flowers, he decided he would have her, though she was only a peasant girl. He snatched her up and was about to return to the Hermitage when her piteous cries brought her father to the scene. Things were going very badly for de Soulis, who had to release the girl to defend himself from her enraged father, and had been knocked off his horse. At this point, Alexander Armstrong, the first Laird of Mangerton appeared, understood immediately what was happening, signalled de Soulis to scramble up behind him and delivered the haughty but shaken nobleman safely to the Hermitage. A couple nights later, the laird of Mangerton was invited to the castle to dine with de Soulis, presumably so de Soulis could properly thank him for saving his life. But in the middle of the meal, the Norman approached Armstrong and instead of > clapping him on the shoulder in friendly fashion, he stabbed him to the heart. > > Murdered by Lord Soulis at Hermitage Castle, at a feast, when the Black Bull's head was placed upon the table. In Sir Edmund Chambers "Mediaeval Stage" he says that a scramble for the head of the bull, the most prized part of the sacrifical beast was probably a "Fertility Cult". This ancient superstision (probably Danish) was current among the peoples of Liddesdale that when "The Black Bull's Head" was placed on the banquet table, the guest of honor was to be slain. Let us remember that Lord Soulis was a superstitious man and an evil one, also. The event was commemmorated in the poetry of the Armstrongs. > > Alexander, Murdered by Soulis > And Mangerton was basely slain > While at the festal board > This is the recompense was made > For saving Liddal's Laird > > But Liddal's sons, from hermitage > Mangerton's corpse convey'd > And opposite his own high towers > Was the procession staid > > Till the attendants were refresh'd > Who were oppress'd with grief > And many a noble Armstrong there > Bewail'd his fallen chief > > The Cross, still standing at Millholm > In antiquated state > With a long sword and letters rude > Emblems of Armstrong's fate > > A stone, with a rude sculptur's sword > Was laid upon his grave > And Liddal's sons did all bewail > Laird Mangerton, the Brave! > > Milnholm Cross, lies beside the road south of Newcastleton near a picnic site and layby. It has interesting carvings commemorating the murder of Alexander, the 2nd Laird of Mangerton who was treacherously murdered at Hermitage Castle in 1320, his grieving clansmen bore his body to the spot, and rested there overnight, before carrying there fallen chief on to Ettleton Kirkyard for burial. The Milnholm Cross was erected that year by the Clan, in full view from Mangerton Castle, as a memorial to Alexander. > > According to the Terwinney Records, the shield of the Armstrongs of Mangerton -which was the arm and hand holding a tree, with the mullet in the sinister chief, and the crescent in the dexter base- distinguished the first Laird of Mangerton from Fayborn the White Armstrong, that was Osbern's son, who did not immediately dwell upon the then outlying estate, but reserved those lands for later generations and himself occupied a more settled estate in Tynedale just south of Mangerton, where ancient monuments of the family may be found. > > In a letter to the Administrator of the Armstrong Genealogy & History Center, J. Alan Armstrong, Laird of Nether Thorniewhats, Guardian of Langholm Castle, and the former Chairman of the Clan Armstrong Trust of Scotland, provides his findings about the origins of the Armstrong name. > > Excerpts from a letter dated 4 Nov. 1996 from J. Alan Armstrong, Chairman, Clan Armstrong Trust to Dennis Armstrong, Administrator, Armstrong Genealogy & History Center > > The principal purpose of the Trust apart from its place as the acknowledged Armstrong Clan Society in Scotland is to "advance public education in the history and culture of the Scottish Border Area." Much has been written which is historically incorrect, some sheer fantasy, based on the writings of numerous Victorian writers to whom, many of the records now available to us were not then available. > > Over time, through our activities and the good offices of the Lord Lyon, King of Arms in Scotland, The Trust has become the acknowledged Clan Society of the Armstrongs. We commenced by examining original source documents lying in the various archives in both Scotland and England. The earliest record we examined was the Anglo Saxon Chronicles written by a series of monks of the times, to ascertain the origins of the tradition of the descent from Siward Beorn, following through with State Papers, Charters and such other material. Much of what you find in the Chronicles of the Armstrongs, regarding Siward, are basically correct but as for our descent from this man I can assure you that it is totally incorrect, The earliest reference to this descent came in the 18th century out of Ireland as a result of certain correspondence between certain Parsons. The legend that Siward was our first Chief of Mangerton is truly incorrect. If you examine the dates of Siward and the date of > the second Laird of Mangerton, one lived in the llth century and the next in the 14th century. A three hundred year gap! The earliest reference to anyone using the name in historical documents is in the 13th century and appears in a charter relating to a monastic settlement in Cumberland. The earliest reference to the Armstrongs in Scotland appears in a land rent roll of the 14th century. > > Over the past ten years five of us have worked on the early years of the Armstrongs from the 13th century until the 15th century. Through examination of Royal Land Grants of the 13th century it is now found that the name of our family before Adam Armstrong of Ousby, was De Ireby, which family stems from the 1lth century and descends from Ivor Taillbois a Norman knight who was awarded lands in Cumberland and the Midlands of England by William the Conqueror. The Armstrongs of Ousby sold their lands and received land from Robert the Bruce, and one of the female members of the De Ireby family married the Grandfather of Robert the Bruce. She inherited land from her husband in the Liddel valley, which land subsequently came into the hands of her relatives, the Armstrongs. I am presently writing this evidence up into a book for publication by the Trust. There is a connection with Siward but it is very tenuous and only arises through a succession of female marriages and linked > with the Bruces. > > The story you mention in your notes on the Internet regarding the beheading of Tostig by Siward is likewise incorrect.. Tostig was still alive after the death of Siward. Charles Kingsley who held the Chair of History at Oxford University did a tremendous amount of work researching Siward and his second son Waltheof, who had no sons, only daughters. Of the first son Osbeorn and his supposed two sons, there is little evidence. > > Actually there were eleven Lairds of Mangerton recorded in State Papers and elsewhere. The Armstrongs of Mangerton were never "Lords". There is in Scotland, a great deal of difference between "Lords" and "Lairds." Like yourself, until I commenced to question many of the records, by date, source document and the like, having read much of the supposed history of the Armstrongs, I believed what I read. Colourful, interesting it really is, but the true historical story is even more so. > > The Legend > > Although there is more than one story about the origins of the Armstrongs, perhaps one of the most widely accepted is the saga of Siward, The Viking, also know as Siward Fairbairn of the Strong Arm (The Armstrong Surname Bulletin, rocking Chair Tales, by Irma Armstrong, 1977. From the Chronicles of the Armstrongs). Siward was the son of a Danish King and lived in England from about 995 till his death in 1056. In those days, the ruler of any small territory was a king, so exactly where his father, Hringo, King of Upland, also known as Earl Beorn, would fall on the yardstick of earthly royalty is not clear; however, at the very least, he would be considered of noble birth. > > Whether Siward was born in England is also not known for certain. However, he was the first to carry the name of Armstrong and was listed in the History of England as having earned the right to the title of Earl of Northumbria (Northumberland) having been conferred the title by Edward the Confessor. > > Siward, the Fairbairn, was said to be of giant-like stature and a strong man, blue-eyed, very fair with light hair and beard. The legend goes that Siward took ship and sailed with 50 of his men from Danemark, arriving at what is today called the Shetland Islands, where he is said to have encountered a dragon which he slew in single combat. Dragons, as most of us know, are mythical creatures which the dictionary states were first defined as a large serpent. He apparently got a kick out of killing serpents, as he put out to sea again and finally landed in Northumbria where he began looking for another one to fight with. Here he met an old man who he thought was his god, Odin, who told him he had already killed the dragon and for him, Siward, to sail southward to the mouth of the Thames river which could bring him to the wealthy city of London (one would think that there would have been plenty of serpents there). The old man then gave him a standard (flag) to carry which > signified The Raven of Earthly Terror (Edgar Allen Poe must have read about our ancestor!). He was received by Edward the Confessor, the King of England, with much ceremony and was made many promises if he would stay with the King and help him fight to retain his kingship. > > The following story about Siward has endured. One day, as he was leaving the court after an audience with King Edward, he was confronted by Tostig, Earl of Huntington, on a bridge, who insulted him by throwing dirt upon him. Siward took no offense at the time, but on confronting him on his return on the same bridge, the story goes that he decapitated Earl Tostig and carried his head back to the King. The King, being suitably impressed by this brawny warrior with violent tendencies, wisely awarded Siward the Earldom of Huntington in addition to Northumbria. > > As Siward's reputation as a brave and valiant knight continued to increase, so also did the Kingdom of Edward continued to be visited by other Danes who held him and his people in much less esteem than did our good Siward. In fact, they became an ever-growing nuisance-- arriving by ship and plundering the eastern coast of England. As the most of the havoc they created was located in Westmoreland, Cumberland and Northumbria Counties, some wise soul counseled the King to put Siward in charge of defending this area. While perhaps properly descriptive if not overly flattering, it was reportedly stated that it was best that the little devil should be first exposed to the great devil. > > Siward governed in peace the territory of Northumbria which extended from the Humber River to the Tweed River on the border of Scotland, and was greatly respected and loved by the Northumbrians who were chiefly of Danish extraction (better a Danish devil than an English saint?). He orchestrated several forays from Northumbria to the north and was successful in putting all territory under the command of the King of England. > > The surname of Siward was Beorn (meaning bear) and relates to the Nordic legends of the Fairy Bear or Fay Bairn, from which the Border name of Fairbairn, originated. The name was applied to the stories of Siward and his father and were called the Fairy Bear Stories. > > Siward had a sister (who's name is not known) who married Duncan, the King of Scotland from 1034-1040 AD. Prior to his death in 1056, Siward supported his nephew Malcolm, the rightful heir, against Shakespeare's famous King Macbeth of Scotland who had killed Malcolm's father King Duncan. > > By 1070, the Battle of Hastings (1066) was over and England had been conquered by William of Normandy. Malcolm III had been on the Scottish throne since the death of Macbeth in 1057 and Siward has been dead since 1056. His first son, Osberne Bulax, was killed in the battle of Macbeth in 1054, some say by the hand of Macbeth, himself. Osberne is also said to have married the daughter of Lady Godiva. Siward's second son, Waltheof (which means forest thief - nice name!) is alternately in and out of favor with William the Conqueror. For example, his wife, Juditha, is a niece of William and in 1069 we find that King William restored the earldom of Northumbria to Waltheof. However, in 1076 he was betrayed by King William and brought to the outskirts of Westminster where he was beheaded. > > Osberne Bulax had two sons named Siward Barn the Red and Siward Barn the White (Fairbeorn). Not much is known of Siward the Red, but it is known that Siward Barn the White became a refugee and fled to Scotland with many other men of distinguished renown including Edgar, the Atheling, the rightful King of England. > > Waltheof left no male descendant. However, Matilda (called Maude), his daughter (after her first husband died) married King David I, the son of King Malcolm of Scotland and his wife Margaret, who was the sister of Edgar the Atheling mentioned above. Both the Scottish and English royalty have descended from Waltheof to the present day. > > Malcolm III, the 85th King of Scotland greeted Siward Barn the White (his cousin) with great kindness, and together they fought against William the Conqueror, driving him out of Northumbria. An interesting story apparently involves Siward the White Fairbeorn during a battle against England. During this battle, King Malcolm's horse was killed under him partially crippling him and young Siward fought his way to the King's side. Passing his left arm around the King's body under his arms, he reportedly fought his way with a great Sword through the enemy to a place of safety. For his courageous act he was knighted by the King, given land and a castle on the Scottish border, and from that time on was referred to as the Sword of the Strong Arm (or Armstrong). This was how he and his descendants came to inherit the lands of Mangerton in Liddesdale. > > These lands, known as the Debateable Land, were disputed for centuries by both Scotland and England. As time went on they were protected by neither nation and, as the Armstrongs were of both Anglo and Danish descent, they were entirely different from the Celtic Clans of Northern Scotland. As a result of blood ties and loyalties not unlike those of the Mafia in Sicily some centuries later, these Clans avenged blood for blood for centuries. In this environment it is not hard to understand how a reputation for plundering, bloodshed, and violence came to be tied to these marauders of the border lands. > > Little is said about the Armstrongs after the building of the Mangerton Tower, probably in 1135. Apparently no Chief was immediately recognized until 1300 when Alexander became the first Lord of Mangerton. Stories abound of the enmity between the Armstrongs and their neighbors the Lords of Soulis. For example, Alexander, the second Lord of Mangerton, was treacherously killed by William, Lord Soulis, after being invited to a feast at his castle. The Armstrong Clan flourished, however, and by the early 1500s, the Laird of Mangerton was able to gather 3,000 mounted fighters. One Scottish king said that while there were Armstrong and Elliots on the Border, Scotland was safe. The Armstrongs were ambassadors, earls, knights, farmers and above all, fighters. For example, Gilbert Armstrong, third son of Alexander, the second Lord of Mangerton, a distinguished clergyman and diplomat was the Canon of Moray from 1361 to 1375. In 1363 he served as a Commissioner to England for the > ransom of King David II of Scotland who was held as a prisoner in England. In all there were ten Lords of Mangerton from Alexander through Archibald Armstrong who was denounced as a rebel in 1603, deprived of his lands in 1610, and executed at Edinburgh. > > What happened to change our fortunes so greatly? James IV of Scotland was on good terms with the Scottish Border chiefs and he regularly visited and was entertained by them. His son, James V of Scotland, on the other hand, ruled by decree from distant Edinburgh and did little to protect his Border subjects or support them against repeated English incursions. In fact, in 1530, James V, with some 8000 men at arms surged into the borderlands and the betrayal of the Armstrongs began. Johnnie Armstrong, Laird of Gilknockie, was a much beloved and highly respected member of the Armstrong Clan, who James V invited to parlay. Accepting the King's invitation, he and 50 of his men went to meet with the King in good faith. Instead, they were seized and summarily executed. This incendiary act outraged the Armstrongs and their allies and set the Borders ablaze with rage and indignation-- increasing the violence and bloodshed it was intended to suppress. At the prodding of the King, > the Church also entered the fray and the Armstrong's and other Border reivers were cursed by the Church excommunicated enmasse. The Armstrongs, with other Borderers, were thus left to their own devices so far as mutual self-defense was concerned. > > Receiving neither aid nor comfort from the Scottish or from the English Crowns, the Armstrongs and other Border clans were forced to become makers of their own laws and protection. After Edward I of England slaughtered thousand of Scots at Berwick, self-defense and preservation became their paramount endeavor. The Borderers were forced to become the best in what had become a profession - a greater thief (raider) did never ride was one complimentary description of an Armstrong, Jock O'Syde, in Liddesdale. They would raid by night and attend Carlisle Market by day, greeted by all who knew them. Unable to do more than bare subsistence farming, the cupboard was frequently bare. When the lady of the house served her Laird a pair of spurs on a plate, this meant it was time to ride and raid the other side of the Border yet again. > > The bloodshed and violence continued. In 1603, Elizabeth I died and James VI of Scotland (James I of England) was declared her heir. After a splendid coronation at Westminister Abbey, James settled down to life at the English Court. One of his highest priorities was the suppression of the Border families like the Armstrongs, as he was afraid that their incursions would make him unpopular in England. As a result, he established powerful landlords in the Debateable Land around Liddesdale and Eskdale, and appointed Sir William Cranston to put to death all within two miles of the Border. A large number of Armstrong reivers were tortured and hung at the Market Cross in Edinburgh, at Carlisle and no doubt on a number of local gibbets. The last Armstrong raid of any importance took place in 1611 and for it, Lance Armstrong of Whithaugh - along with others - was executed a year later. Cranston generated the first forced migrations to Ireland and the subsequent Undertaking of the > Plantation of Ulster in 1608. In the 18th century, farms were merged and more migrations followed. > > The Armstrong lands of Mangerton passed into the hands of the Buccleuchs. Many members of the once powerful Armstrong Clan were shipped off to Ireland, including Johnnie Armstrong's grandson, William who settled in Fermanagh. Thus, many who had survived found themselves on the Solway shore waiting for emigrant ships to take them from an inhospitable homeland. Homeless, leaderless, and sometimes penniless, they went westward to Ireland and North America, and south to Australia and New Zealand in search of new beginnings. Perhaps the most famous descendent of the Fermanagh Armstrongs was Neil Armstrong, the American astronaut and the first human to set foot on the moon during the Apollo 11 mission in 1969. > > The dissolution and dispersal of the Armstrongs followed some two hundred years of Border brigandage and treachery, ending in the depopulated areas and vast estates of the present day Whithaugh, Mangerton and Gilknockie, which had at one time been the Clan's greatest strongholds. A proud and courageous family had been reduced to a smattering of broken men. The Armstrongs have been scattered and now have neither chief nor recognized leader. However, as individuals the Armstrongs have survived and have lived up to their clan motto of "Invictus Maneo" or "We Remain Unvanquished." > > Child of ALEXANDER ARMSTRONG and MARGUERITE OF FRANCE is: > 9. i. ALEXANDER III9 ARMSTRONG, b. Scotland, Mangerton Castle Liddesdale Dumfrieshire; d. Scotland, Hermitage Castle Lindores Fifeshire. > > > Generation No. 9 > > 9. ALEXANDER III9 ARMSTRONG (ALEXANDER II8, BRUCE7, WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born in Scotland, Mangerton Castle Liddesdale Dumfrieshire, and died in Scotland, Hermitage Castle Lindores Fifeshire. > > Notes for ALEXANDER III ARMSTRONG: > Carlisle Castle > Perhaps your protegees would like in the meanwhile to know something of the Armstrong Clan. A very interesting lot, and nowadays perfectly respectable, but with an historical reputation as "the most feared and warlike of the Border Reivers"! The Border Reivers were clans or families, both sides of the border between England and Scotland, who, finding it impossible to farm peacefully, when the two countries were for ever invading each other - settled into banditry instead. They mainly lived by stealing each other's cattle! This is why both sides of the border are studded with "pele towers" - small stone fortresses - living area on the first floor, approached by a wooden stair which could be drawn up at need, or fortified farms - farms with the buildings in a square which could be sealed off against raiders. > The village where I now live was one of the last to be raided by the famous "Kinmont Willie Armstrong" before he was caught and hanged. The raiding was finally stamped out when James King of Scotland became King of England also. It is a fascinating period in History There were even special laws drawn up to deal with the Reiving Clans, such as the "Hot Trod", whereby, if your cattle were raided, you were allowed to follow them into Scotland/England (depending on who was doing the raiding) - and cross the border so long as your posse was preceded by a horseman carrying a lighted turf on his spear! > > Child of ALEXANDER III ARMSTRONG is: > 10. i. ALEXANDER IV10 ARMSTRONG, b. Scotland, Mangerton Castle Liddesdale Dumphrieshire; d. Scotland, Mangerton Castle Mangerton Duffriesshire. > > > Generation No. 10 > > 10. ALEXANDER IV10 ARMSTRONG (ALEXANDER III9, ALEXANDER II8, BRUCE7, WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born in Scotland, Mangerton Castle Liddesdale Dumphrieshire, and died in Scotland, Mangerton Castle Mangerton Duffriesshire. > > Notes for ALEXANDER IV ARMSTRONG: > Alexander 6 was a bondsman for Earl of Douglas in 1398. Was 3rd Lord of Mangerton from 1376-1398. Alexander on the Tax List of Liddensdale in 1376 > > Source-Chart of the Ten Lords of Mangerton Scotland > > Child of ALEXANDER IV ARMSTRONG is: > 11. i. ARCHIBALD11 ARMSTRONG, b. Scotland, Mangerton Castle Liddesdale Dumphrieshire. > > > Generation No. 11 > > 11. ARCHIBALD11 ARMSTRONG (ALEXANDER IV10, ALEXANDER III9, ALEXANDER II8, BRUCE7, WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born in Scotland, Mangerton Castle Liddesdale Dumphrieshire. > > Notes for ARCHIBALD ARMSTRONG: > Lord of Mangerton Castle Note: David , a borrowis for Earl of Douglas in 1398 (History of Liddesdale) In 1482 > gives deed of Mangerton Lands to David Scott (Scotts of Buceleuch) Source-Chart of the Ten Lords of Mangerton Castle. > > On 11/2/1456 Archibald was a witness to a notorial instrument (Scott's of Buceleuch p. 110) On 11/19/1493 Archibald was chraged as an outlaw for slaying Laird of Ealdmer, court of Jedburgh(Books of Adjournal, MS. Justiciary Office vol. 1493-1504 f.7, p. 2) Source-Chart of the Ten Lords of Mangerton > > Child of ARCHIBALD ARMSTRONG is: > 12. i. THOMAS12 ARMSTRONG, b. Scotland, Mangerton Castle Dumphrieshire; d. Scotland, Falde. > > > Generation No. 12 > > 12. THOMAS12 ARMSTRONG (ARCHIBALD11, ALEXANDER IV10, ALEXANDER III9, ALEXANDER II8, BRUCE7, WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born in Scotland, Mangerton Castle Dumphrieshire, and died in Scotland, Falde. > > Notes for THOMAS ARMSTRONG: > Called 'Bell-the-Cat' Thomas in 1482 gave deed to Mangerton Castle to David > Scott (See pp. 111-112 Chron, of the Armstrongs) > > Source-Armstrong House of Langholm, Item 1. Source-Chart of the Ten Lords of Mangerton Castle Compiled by > W.L.A.(Az.) > > Child of THOMAS ARMSTRONG is: > 13. i. ALEXANDER13 ARMSTRONG, b. Scotland, Mangerton Dumphrieshire; d. Scotland. > > > Generation No. 13 > > 13. ALEXANDER13 ARMSTRONG (THOMAS12, ARCHIBALD11, ALEXANDER IV10, ALEXANDER III9, ALEXANDER II8, BRUCE7, WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born in Scotland, Mangerton Dumphrieshire, and died in Scotland. > > Notes for ALEXANDER ARMSTRONG: > Alexander was in court at Jedbuggh for stealing cows 28 Feb. > He was 6th Lord in 1482. Source-Chart of the Ten Lords of Mangerton > Source- Armstrong House of Langholm, > > Alexander had seven sons, that represent the seven branches of the Oak Tree that is used on the Armstrongs Shield or Coat of Arms. He was called ' Ill Will's or Andro' All of the following are the same source. Compiled by W.L.A.(Az.) > > There is a difference between being a Laird, leader of a clan and a Lord. It is NOT the same thing. A Laird can be a Lord but being a Laird is not being a Lord. > > In the following table we have named the Ten Lairds of Mangerton -- the Laird being the head man or leader of the family or clan, who lived in the castle called Mangerton, situated in Liddesdale on the Liddal River in Scotland. > > 1st Laird -- Siward Beorn (1020 to 1055) - A Dane by birth or descent. > 2nd Laird -- Alexander Armstrong - Known as the Young Laird of Mangerton. > 3rd Laird-- Name not known (probably Alexander) > 4th Laird-- Archibald Armstrong > 5th Laird-- Thomas Armstrong - 15th century. > > 1. Alexander Armstrong (6th Laird) > 2. John Armstrong of Whithaugh > 3. Will Armstrong of Chingils > 4. George Armstrong of Ailmure > > 6th Laird-- Alexander Armstrong 1460 > 1. Thomas Armstrong (7th Laird) > 2. John Armstrong of Gilnockie > 3. Christopher Armstrong of Langholm > 4. George Armstrong > 5. Alexander or Andro Armstrong > 6. Robet Armstrong > 7. William Armstrong > > 7th Laird -- Thomas Armstrong - Died 1548 or 1549. > 1. Archibald Armstrong (8th Laird) > 2. John Armstrong of Tinnisburn > 3. Richard Armstrong of Dryup > 4. Thomas Armstrong > 5. Simon Armstrong Tinnisburn > > 8th Laird -- Archibald Armstrong - 1548 or 1549 to 1558. > 1. Simon Armstrong (9th Laird) > 2. Ninian Armstrong > 3. Rowe Armstrong > > 9th Laird -- Simon Armstrong - 1558 to 1583. > 1. Archibald Armstrong (10th Laird) > 2. Ungle or Hingle Armstrong > 3. Simon Armstrong of Runchbach > > 10th Laird -- Archibald Armstrong - 1583 to 1610. > > Archibald Armstrong, the tenth and last Laird of Mangerton, remained as the Laird until 1610, when he and twenty-four of his followers were charged with plundering an enemys property. They were ordered to appear before the Council but failed to do so. Shortly thereafter, Archibald was expelled from his lairdship. > > Notes: Armstrong Clan: Ted Armstrong, 'Thyme', 7 Riverside,CANONBIE, Dumfresshire, SCOTLAND > > Notes: Tradition says that anyone who bears the name of Armstrong is descended from the original Scotsman John, who on seeing his King unhorsed hurried to place him on his saddle. The king unsheathed his sword and said, "I dub you Armstrong." > > Notes: Alexander's official title was: Alexander 6th Laird of Mangerton Castle. > > Notes: Ive seen an interest again regarding the history of Johnnie Armstrongof Gilnockie. The only stories I can tell are ones that will be retold,and my references are few, but most of the credit should go to George MacDonald Fraser, author of The Steel Bonnets. When Joe returns to Gateshead hemay have some corrections to post to this! > > Notes: Someone posted a notion that Johnnie may be considered as king of the Armstrongs. I do not intend in the least to admonish that thought, but such case is hardly true. Son of a chief of the clan, yes that is a fact. Alexander Armstrong, 6th Laird of Mangerton Christ was laid in I believe> was the father of our Johnnie of Gilnockie. Johnnie had one older brother however that would be Thomas. There is some argument regarding the correctness of history pertaining to the succession of the Lairdship of Mangerton. I know you have a question right now,and I'll answer it as best I can. There is no connecting succession currently. The last chief of the clan, by my references, faded into Cumbria in the early 17th century, and since then there has been no clan chief. > > Child of ALEXANDER ARMSTRONG is: > 14. i. JOHNNIE14 ARMSTRONG, b. Scotland, House Gilnockie hall; d. Scotland, Caerlanrig Whithaugh. > > > Generation No. 14 > > 14. JOHNNIE14 ARMSTRONG (ALEXANDER13, THOMAS12, ARCHIBALD11, ALEXANDER IV10, ALEXANDER III9, ALEXANDER II8, BRUCE7, WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born in Scotland, House Gilnockie hall, and died in Scotland, Caerlanrig Whithaugh. He married ELIZABETH GRAHAM. She was born in Scotland, Barngleish Dumfrieshire. > > Notes for JOHNNIE ARMSTRONG: > John was called 'The Strong' had 5 sons. John was Robin (Robyn Hood) of the Border, and the stories of his exploits run through all Scottish literature and Sir Walter Scott makes frequent reference to him. John was granted lands in Eskdale, & Dumfrieshire Scotland 8/4/1525 by Robert, Lord of Maxwell. (Book of Carlsvsverock vol. 2, p. 479 #102) Pamphlet on Debatable Lands by Thomas Carlyle. John had several times challenged King James V of England, to a duel, and John was considered an embarrassment to the Crown of England, so King James V, declared him an outlaw. > > King James V men, trapped John in Whithaugh, Scotland with a few of John's men, and without a trial, hung them on the spot. Source-Chronicles of the Armstrongs p. 328 & 354. Source- Armstrong House of Langholm. Item 3. Source- Chart of the Ten Lords of Mangerton Castle. Source- Notable Southern Families by Zella Armstrong states " All the Armstrongs of Ireland in the Seventeenth Century are decended from John, and all the American Armstrongs, who trace through the Scotch-Irish Clan." > > Source- The Armstrong Family History of Lancaster Co., Pa. by Mrs. Mae Armstrong Simon (Historian) > > Child of JOHNNIE ARMSTRONG and ELIZABETH GRAHAM is: > 15. i. CHRISTOPHER (JOHN'S CHRISTY)15 ARMSTRONG, b. Scotland, Barngleish Duffriesshire; d. September 22, 1606, Scotland, Langholm Dumfrieshire. > > > Generation No. 15 > > 15. CHRISTOPHER (JOHN'S CHRISTY)15 ARMSTRONG (JOHNNIE14, ALEXANDER13, THOMAS12, ARCHIBALD11, ALEXANDER IV10, ALEXANDER III9, ALEXANDER II8, BRUCE7, WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born in Scotland, Barngleish Duffriesshire, and died September 22, 1606 in Scotland, Langholm Dumfrieshire. He married GORTHE CATHERINE GRAHAM in Scotland, Barngleish Dumfrieshire, daughter of WILL GRAHAM. She was born in Scotland, Flade, and died in Scotland, Langholme Dumphrieshire. > > Notes for CHRISTOPHER (JOHN'S CHRISTY) ARMSTRONG: > Christopher led a raid into Annandale in1543. > Christopher was murdered by John Musgrave at Barngleish in 1606. > > Source- Chronicles General Listing 1/UKBC. Source- Chronicles of the Armstrongs Book 929.2242 Ar. 57a & 929.2 "717" Source- Chart of the Ten Lords of Mangerton Castle > > Child of CHRISTOPHER ARMSTRONG and GORTHE GRAHAM is: > 16. i. WILLIAM (CHRISTY'S WILL)16 ARMSTRONG, b. Scotland, House Gilnockie Dumfrieshire; d. 1649, Ireland, Brookboro Fermanagh Co. Ulster. > > > Generation No. 16 > > 16. WILLIAM (CHRISTY'S WILL)16 ARMSTRONG (CHRISTOPHER (JOHN'S CHRISTY)15, JOHNNIE14, ALEXANDER13, THOMAS12, ARCHIBALD11, ALEXANDER IV10, ALEXANDER III9, ALEXANDER II8, BRUCE7, WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born in Scotland, House Gilnockie Dumfrieshire, and died 1649 in Ireland, Brookboro Fermanagh Co. Ulster. He married MARGARET ELLIOTT 1600 in Scotland, Falde. She was born 1583 in Scotland, Gilnockie Duffriesshire, and died 1619 in Ireland, Brooksboro Fermanagh. > > Notes for WILLIAM (CHRISTY'S WILL) ARMSTRONG: > Called 'Christie's Will'. Also was called "The Younger of Barngleish & later Younger of Langholm, and Younger of Aughingill. > > It is well known that during the troubles of Charles I the Earl of Traquair continued unalterably fixed in his attachment to his unfortunate master, in whose service he hazarded his person and improverished his estate. On one occasion his lordship dispatched Christie's Will to London upon business of the highest importance to his Majesty. But the task was a difficult one, as the Parliamentary leaders used their utmost endeavors to prevent and communication between the > king and his Scottish friends. Will arrived at London and delivered his papers in safety. In the meantime his embassy had taken air, and orders were dispatched by the enemy to intercept him. He passed skillfully from London to Carlisle, a distance of 265 miles, stopping at the latter place to refresh his horse, and then proceeded on his journey. Crossing the bridge over the Eden just outside of Carlisle, he suddenly discovered Parliamentary soldiers springing up like magic at both ends of the bridge. There was nothing left to do but take to the water, which was in high flood. Facing down stream, he patted his horse's neck, and with a touch of the spur gracefully cleared the parapet. Horse and rider were carried by the swift current to a place called the Stanners, or Stanhouse, where he guided the horse up the wet bank but they slipped back into the river. Quickly cutting the loop that held his long wet cloak, he made for the bank again. With the noble effort the animal > brought his master to firm ground. The soldiers, for a time struck with wonder, forgot to fire upon him. Two or three ran down the waterside intending to capture him, but Will pointed his wet pistol at them, which weapon, although useless, caused them to halt. > From the Eden he was chased to the Esk, which he swam. Gaining the further side, he wheeled around and in true Border style called out to his pursuers to come through and drink with him. They declined, knowing he was in the neighborhood of friends. After this taunt, he proceeded on the journey and faithfully accomplished his mission. Source-Wilsons Tales of > the Border edit. London vol. 2, p. 736, on perilous mission from Scotland to King Charles 1st, in London. Source-Armstrong Surname Organization Salt Lake City, Utah > In 1630 William kidnapped Sir Alexander Gibson, Lord Durie, a Judge and kept him prisoner for 3 months, in a Castle Dungeon until court decided in favor of his friend, then released the Judge at night. Judge & friends thought William had been spirited away by witchcraft. > Source-(Preface of Forbe's Journal of the Sessions, Edinburgh 1714) > > Also In this year, reign of King Charles I, when the old Border practices were not entirely discontinued, the Tower of Gilknockie was occupied by William Armstrong called for distinction's sake Christie's Will, grandson to the famous John of Gilknockie executed by King James V. > From Armstrong Clan Association News, dated April 1997, page 9. > > There is a story told of Christie's Will, that when confined in Jedburgh Jail, the Earl Traquair, who knew him well, got him released, in order to send him to Edinburgh, to aid his Lordship in terminating a law plea, which he proposed doing by getting the Counsel opposed to him out of the way. Christie's Will undertook to do this. He said he liked to do a "pawky trick," and engaged to remove the opposing lawyer, whom he accordingly inveigled away on the promise of giving him some "flowing fees," and when he succeeded in getting the advocate into his own free-booting domain, he incarcerated him in a tower till Traquair gained his suit. This Earl was perhaps Charles the First's friend, who fought with his son at Preston on behalf of his Sovereign, and fell into the hands of the rebels, when they were committed to Warwick, and imprisoned like the counsel, though for a much longer period, their captivity extending to four years. After the Earl's release and return, he > suffered extreme poverty. Soon after this Christie's Will joined the Army of King Charles I. William son of Christopher and grandson John Of Gilnockie left Scotland in taking nephew Andrew with him and settleing in Northern Fermanugh Co., Ireland, where he became the founder of a numerious family whose branches flourished in those parts . This was some years after the death of Queen Elizabeth. > > The Munro Clan had a long minority in the chiefship from 1635 to 1651 coincided with the period of Civil War. During these years General Robert Munro commanded the army sent by the Scottish Parliament to Ireland in 1642. > Colonel William died in battle in King Charles I, British Army, during the period of the First Civil War with Ireland 1642-1646. > > There is an old house in Brookboro with the Armstrong crest and motto, "Valida Manu", over the fireplace. It must have been a grand place in it's time, and now is used as a hotel. This house marks the spot of the first home of the Armstrongs in Ireland, that of Christie's Will's family, who went there from the Border in the early part of the seventeenth century. Christie's Will upon his death, his heirs were awarded a land grant in Fermanagh County, Northern Ireland. Source-Chronicles of the Armstrongs, > > Called 'Christie's Will'. Source-Armstrong House of Langholm Item 5. In 1630 William kidnapped a Judge and kept him prisoner for 3 months, in a Castle Dungeon until court decided in favor of his friend, then released the Judge at night. Judge & friends thought William had been spirited away by witchcraft. > > Source- (Preface of Forbe's Journal of the Sessions, Edinburgh 1714) William son of Christopher and grandson of the famous John (Robin Hood )left Scotland in 1630 takeing nephew Andrew with him and settling in northern Fermanaugh Co., Ireland, where he became the founder of a numerious family whose branches flourished in those parts . This was some years after the death of Queen Elizabeth. Armstrong families of Ireland, most all trace back to William & nephew Andrew in Brooksboro Ireland. > > William died in battle in King Charles 1 Army about 1639 > > (Abstract of acts of settlement & explanation, reign of King Charles 1, in > Parliment at Westminister in 1640. Source-Chronicles General Listing > > Notes for MARGARET ELLIOTT: > Scottish > Spelling variations include: Elliott, Elliot, Eliot, Eliott, Ellegett, Ellegot, Ellecot, Ellacott, Ellacot, Ellgate, Ellett, Ellit and many more. > First found in Liddesdale and Teviotdale where they were seated from very ancient times, some say well before the Norman Conquest and the arrival of Duke William at Hastings in 1066 A.D. > Some of the first settlers of this name or some of its variants were: Lewis Ellett who settled in Virginia in 1721; Margeret Ellgate settled in the Barbados in 1635; Michael Elligot settled in Quebec in 1825; George, Hugh, Joseph, Robert, and Thomas Elliott settled in Philadelphia between 1800 and 1840. > Motto: Boldly and rightly > > Child of WILLIAM ARMSTRONG and MARGARET ELLIOTT is: > 17. i. THOMAS II17 ARMSTRONG, b. 1603, Scotland, Gilnockie Duffriesshire Scotland; d. 1690, Ireland. > > > Generation No. 17 > > 17. THOMAS II17 ARMSTRONG (WILLIAM (CHRISTY'S WILL)16, CHRISTOPHER (JOHN'S CHRISTY)15, JOHNNIE14, ALEXANDER13, THOMAS12, ARCHIBALD11, ALEXANDER IV10, ALEXANDER III9, ALEXANDER II8, BRUCE7, WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born 1603 in Scotland, Gilnockie Duffriesshire Scotland, and died 1690 in Ireland. He married ANNA ANDERSON. > > Notes for ANNA ANDERSON: > Scottish > > Spelling variations include: Anderson, Andison, Andersonne, Andersoun, Andirsoone, Andresoun, Androson, Andirston, Andrewson and many more. > First found in the Great Glen and Strathspey, where the anderson family was seated from ancient times. > Some of the first settlers of this name or some of its variants were: Thomas Anderson, who settled in Virginia in 1634; as did Joseph Anderson and Richard Anderson in 1635; Alester Anderson, who came to New England in 1652. > > Motto: Stand sure > > Child of THOMAS ARMSTRONG and ANNA ANDERSON is: > 18. i. JOHN II18 ARMSTRONG, b. 1645; d. 1666. > > > Generation No. 18 > > 18. JOHN II18 ARMSTRONG (THOMAS II17, WILLIAM (CHRISTY'S WILL)16, CHRISTOPHER (JOHN'S CHRISTY)15, JOHNNIE14, ALEXANDER13, THOMAS12, ARCHIBALD11, ALEXANDER IV10, ALEXANDER III9, ALEXANDER II8, BRUCE7, WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born 1645, and died 1666. He married KATHERINE BEARD. > > Child of JOHN ARMSTRONG and KATHERINE BEARD is: > 19. i. JOHN III19 ARMSTRONG, b. 1664, Ireland, Ulster Antrim. > > > Generation No. 19 > > 19. JOHN III19 ARMSTRONG (JOHN II18, THOMAS II17, WILLIAM (CHRISTY'S WILL)16, CHRISTOPHER (JOHN'S CHRISTY)15, JOHNNIE14, ALEXANDER13, THOMAS12, ARCHIBALD11, ALEXANDER IV10, ALEXANDER III9, ALEXANDER II8, BRUCE7, WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born 1664 in Ireland, Ulster Antrim. > > Child of JOHN III ARMSTRONG is: > 20. i. ROBERT SR.20 ARMSTRONG, b. 1700, Ireland, Antrim Co.; d. November 10, 1775, South Carolina, Abbeville District. > > > Generation No. 20 > > 20. ROBERT SR.20 ARMSTRONG (JOHN III19, JOHN II18, THOMAS II17, WILLIAM (CHRISTY'S WILL)16, CHRISTOPHER (JOHN'S CHRISTY)15, JOHNNIE14, ALEXANDER13, THOMAS12, ARCHIBALD11, ALEXANDER IV10, ALEXANDER III9, ALEXANDER II8, BRUCE7, WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born 1700 in Ireland, Antrim Co., and died November 10, 1775 in South Carolina, Abbeville District. He married ALICE CALHOUN 1728 in Ireland, Ulster Antrim, daughter of JAMES CALHOUN and CATHERINE MONTGOMERY. She was born 1705 in Ireland, Antrim County Ulster, and died November 12, 1753 in Virginia, Augusta Co.. > > Children of ROBERT ARMSTRONG and ALICE CALHOUN are: > i. JOHN21 ARMSTRONG. > ii. JAMES ARMSTRONG. > iii. BENJAMIN ARMSTRONG. > iv. CATHERINE "KATE" ARMSTRONG. > v. HANNAH ARMSTRONG. > vi. ALICE ARMSTRONG. > 21. vii. CAPTAIN ROBERT JAMES JR. ARMSTRONG, b. 1731, Ireland, Ulster Antrim Co.; d. February 28, 1798, Tennessee, 5 Miles East Of Knoxville Knox County. > > > Generation No. 21 > > 21. CAPTAIN ROBERT JAMES JR.21 ARMSTRONG (ROBERT SR.20, JOHN III19, JOHN II18, THOMAS II17, WILLIAM (CHRISTY'S WILL)16, CHRISTOPHER (JOHN'S CHRISTY)15, JOHNNIE14, ALEXANDER13, THOMAS12, ARCHIBALD11, ALEXANDER IV10, ALEXANDER III9, ALEXANDER II8, BRUCE7, WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born 1731 in Ireland, Ulster Antrim Co., and died February 28, 1798 in Tennessee, 5 Miles East Of Knoxville Knox County. He married MARGARET CUNNINGHAM in Tennessee, Anderson, daughter of SAMUEL CUNNINGHAM and MARY MCKAMY. She was born 1745 in Virginia, Augusta Co., and died June 03, 1837 in Tennessee, Anderson Knox County. > > Notes for CAPTAIN ROBERT JAMES JR. ARMSTRONG: > Revolutioinary War > Robert Armstrong's family came to Lancaster County, Virginia about 1650. The Armstrongs intermarried with the John Weirfamily of Lancaster County. Robert Armstrong, who came to KnoxCounty did live in South Carolina 8/15/1767, he sold land of180 acres in the Fork. The Robert Armstrong family came toAmerica with his father and mother in the year of 1735 settledin the County of Pennsylvania on the Susquehanna River. Theparty landed in Philadelphia. Following the Calhouns toAbbeyville District South Carolina, where the Calhouns hadestablished a settlement. > > > The Armstrong family received its surname, according to family legend, in recognition of the > heroics of a Scottish warrior named Fairbairn. Fairbairn, while fighting near his king in battle, > noticed the enemy kill the king���s horse with the king still beneath him. Fairbairn, at great > personal risk, grabbed the king by the thigh and set him upon a new horse, thus allowing him to > continue waging war. The king rewarded this heroism with the appellation ���Armstrong��� so that > such heroics would never again be forgotten. Fairbairn was also known as Siward, and William > Shakespeare mentions him in his play Macbeth. Siward, the earl of Northumberland and his son, > young Siward, are in several important scenes in the play. In fact, Siward killed Macbeth in > battle (at least in Shakespeare���s version), thus allowing the rightful family to regain the throne. > Siward���s granddaughter by his second wife married King David I of Scotland. The Armstrongs > remained in Scotland until the reign of James I of England (VI of Scotland). James offered lands > in Ireland to his loyal Scottish and English subjects, and a branch of the Armstrongs moved to > the province of Ulster at that time. > The Armstrong who was progenitor of the family in question was Robert Armstrong I, and he > was born in the province of Ulster, County Antrim, Ireland, c. 1700. He married in 1728 to > Alice Calhoun, also of the province of Ulster, County Antrim. She was born c. 1705, and she > was the sister of Patrick Calhoun. Patrick Calhoun was the grandfather of John C. Calhoun, vice > president of the United States under Andrew Jackson. In 1735, Robert, Alice, and their two > children at the time, John and Robert II, came to America, landing in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. > The family settled along the Susquehanna River, and lived there until some time before 1768, > when the family moved to the Abbeville District of South Carolina to be closer to Alice���s family, who had also emigrated to the colonies. Before moving to South Carolina, however, there is evidence that the family lived in Augusta County, Virginia for an indefinite period of time. Robert I and Alice had 9 children: John, Robert II, James, Ben, Kate, Hannah, Alice, and two unnamed daughters. Robert I died around 1775. It should be noted, however, that there was some discrepancy about the date of the death of Robert I. There are a few notes within the collection that suggest Robert I died in 1754 in Augusta County, Virginia. It must be noted, however, that the Armstrong family appears to accept the 1775 date as the death date of Robert I. Robert II, who was born in 1731, married Margaret Cunningham in 1767. Robert II served in the Revolutionary War as a First Lieutenant of the First South Carolina Regiment under the command of Francis Marion, the �"Swamp Fox.�" Robert II > and his family moved to Washington County, Tennessee in 1784, and in 1787, Robert II and his family moved to Knox County, Tennessee, where they settled. Robert II was a surveyor for the state of North Carolina, state of Franklin, and the state of Tennessee. Robert II and Margaret had 8 children: Moses and Aaron (twins), Robert III, John, Martha, Elizabeth, Margaret, and an unnamed daughter. Robert II diedin 1796. > > More About CAPTAIN ROBERT JAMES JR. ARMSTRONG: > Burial: Tennessee, Old McConnell Cemetery In Mooresville Tennessee > Emigration: August 1767, South Carolina > Occupation: Military > > More About MARGARET CUNNINGHAM: > Burial: Tennessee, Armstrong Cemetery Knoxville Knox County > > Marriage Notes for ROBERT ARMSTRONG and MARGARET CUNNINGHAM: > Robert Armstrong 1st was born in County Antrim, Ireland abt1700 and arrived in Philadelphia, Pa. abt 1735. He was married in Ireland to Alice Calhoun abt 1728. There were 7 children of this marriage. Robert Armstrong II, was born in County Antrim, Ireland in 1731 and is my linage. His brother John was also born in Antrim, Northern Ireland. The other children were James, Ben, Kate, Hanna, and Alice. After arriving in Philadelphia, the family slowly moved westward. After living in Penn. for about 7 years, they moved to Augusta County, Va.(not proven) and, eventually, to Abbeville, South Carolina. Robert II married Margaret Cunningham in 1767,somewhere in SC. Robert II fought in the Am Rev. war while in SC and I have firm documentation on this and joined the SAR through him. Several ladies have also joined the DAR through the Cunningham line. They had 8 children. Robert III was born in Abbeville on Dec. 13, 1774. Robert II moved his family to what now is Northeast Tenn. in > the late 1780's finally arriving in what is now Knoxville, Knox County, Tn. in 1787. Robert III married Elizabeth Wear in 1798 in Sevier County, Tn and moved back to Knoxville. Robert III had 12 children. Robert II died in 1796 in Knoxville and his will is on file in the Knox County archives. He and Margaret are buried in the old Armstrong/Kennedy cemetary in East Knox County and the DAR put a head stone on his grave signifying his service in the Am. Rev. War. > > Child of ROBERT ARMSTRONG and MARGARET CUNNINGHAM is: > 22. i. JOHN22 ARMSTRONG, b. Abt. 1760, Tennessee, Knox County; d. 1813, Tennessee, Rogersville - Hawkins County. > > > Generation No. 22 > > 22. JOHN22 ARMSTRONG (ROBERT JAMES JR.21, ROBERT SR.20, JOHN III19, JOHN II18, THOMAS II17, WILLIAM (CHRISTY'S WILL)16, CHRISTOPHER (JOHN'S CHRISTY)15, JOHNNIE14, ALEXANDER13, THOMAS12, ARCHIBALD11, ALEXANDER IV10, ALEXANDER III9, ALEXANDER II8, BRUCE7, WILLIAM6, ALEXANDER5, JOHN CAMERON "JOHN THE RED"4, ALAN JOHN3, DAVID2, HENRY1) was born Abt. 1760 in Tennessee, Knox County, and died 1813 in Tennessee, Rogersville - Hawkins County. He married JEAN "JANE" BAKER Abt. 1780 in Virginia, Prince Edward County, daughter of SR.BAKER DOUGLAS and JEAN THOMPSON. She was born Abt. 1758 in Virginia, Prince Edward. > > Notes for JOHN ARMSTRONG: > Source: http://awt.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=:2069019&id=I1105 > > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~jabe0321/pafg06.htm#71 > > More About JOHN ARMSTRONG: > Emigration: August 1767, South Carolina > > Marriage Notes for JOHN ARMSTRONG and JEAN BAKER: > From: Jeff Armstrong <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG-L] ARMSTRONG/BAKER in VA > Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 19:15:47 -0500 > References: <[email protected]> > > Hi, > > There are a number of places you can go for information on this line. > > First place you should look at is the book "The Mecklenburg Signers and > their Kin" by Worth S. Ray. It has some information on these Armstrongs, but > also very much more on the Bakers, and related lines the Thompsons, > Cunninghams, and others. > > The Worth Ray book gives evidence strongly suggesting this John Armstrong > was the son of Robert Armstrong/Alice Calhoun. This line is further > documented (through the Robert Jr. line) in the book "Notable Southern > Families" by Zella Armstrong. Unfortunately, not all the information given > by Zella about this line in this book may be correct or complete. There is > some pretty strong evidence to support that this is the correct line for > this John, however it is important to know that some other Armstrong > researchers have claimed that this John, the son of Robert and Alice, > instead was the John Armstrong in Augusta County, Va records who married > sisters Catherine and then Priscilla McDonald. For reasons too lengthy to go > into here, however, I doubt this. > > As outlined in the Worth Ray book, this family of Armstrongs and Bakers > moved from Prince Edward County, Va. in the 1770's to South Carolina in the > 1780's, then to Warren County, Georgia in the 1790's, and finally to Hawkins > County, Tennessee, around 1800. You'll find numerous records on these > families in the Warren County, Ga records. > > I don't believe it was a coincidence that this John's family left Georgia to > go live near the 103 year old William Armstrong's family in Hawkins County, > TN; I believe that this William was a cousin and that John's father Robert > and William's father James were the brothers Robert and James who were son's > of "Oldmon" Robert Armstrong who died in late 1750's Augusta County, Va. > > One more thing. The Worth Ray book doesn't give much info on the origins of > these Bakers and Armstrongs, but they clearly left Lancaster County, PA > probably about the late 1740's. You'll find a lot about them in the > Lancaster County records. > > Jeff Armstrong > > Child of JOHN ARMSTRONG and JEAN BAKER is: > 23. i. MARY23 ARMSTRONG, b. Abt. 1795, Tennessee; d. 1834, Mississippi, Missionary Jasper. > > > Generation

You know, members of the Graham family in the "old country" got in trouble with the royal authorities. (I think I have this right but if not, somebody will correct me.) Some changed their name to "Maharg" and others took the colors of the tartan for their names...Black, White, Green...I believe this it true. Marilyn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marilynn Masten" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 1:08 PM Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] Armstrong and Renshaw > Yep, my Armstrong DNA matches some people named Renshaw. We could have > been Renshaws who liked the name Armstrong, We could have been adopted > into an Armstrong family, we could have had a laddie smitten by a lassie > named Armstrong--or the other way around, Renshaw. Maybe we lived next > door to Renshaws, maybe we were Armstrongs in trouble with the law (I > know---impossible) who hid out with the Renshaws. If I weren't so lazy, > I'd write a book about this. > > I have in my Avery family, one son who left town hurriedly (something > about a young lady) and he changed his name to Andrews. If my cousin > hadn't been told this by an old aunt he never would have known-----but, he > still is now an Andrews, as was his father and grandfather. He says it's a > good name and I agree. > > > Marilynn > IBSSG > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Dennis L Armstrong > To: Marilynn Masten > Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 7:16 PM > Subject: Re: Armstrong and Renshaw > > > Hi: I read what David Strong had sent and the other messages attached to > it and I HAVEN'T A CLUE, what they are talking about! > I will have to go back over what was sent to se if I can make some sense > of it! > Hope all is well with you. > Best Regards > > Dennis Armstrong > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Marilynn Masten > To: Dennis L Armstrong > Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 5:10 PM > Subject: Fw: Armstrong and Renshaw > > > If you know what they are talking about, you're a better man than I am, > Dennis. > Marilynn > IBSSG > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: David B. Strong > To: Marilynn Masten ; Dennis Armstrong > Cc: Eleanor Gordon (Co-admin Renshaw) > Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 11:56 AM > Subject: Fw: Armstrong and Renshaw > > > Hello Marilynn and Dennis... > > Yesterday I had an interesting exchange of messages with Eleanor > Gordon, Co-Admin of the Renshaw project. I thought you should be made > aware of the discussion, to make of it what you will. I learned a bit > about "RecLOH", or "Recombinational Loss of Heterozygosity"; although I am > not sure I understand the science of it very well. Be sure to take a > look at the website cited by Eleanor, and then follow the links found in > that website... there are fuller explanations there. > > I am not sure that even given allowance for Eleanor's cousin's > "RecLOH", there is a real chance of a match between Dennis and her > cousin(s). I suspect we may really be dealing with a case of mutational > drift from further apart to a closer result... But, you can and should > have the opportunity to evaluate that possibility as well as the > suggestion made by Eleanor. > > Regards > Dave Strong > Co-Admin, Armstrong DNA Project > PS to Eleanor... Marilynn is also an administrator, of the Gardner DNA > Project, and Dennis her cousin. > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: [email protected] > To: [email protected] > Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 4:58 PM > Subject: RecLOH > > > > I can't exactly explain it, but I can tell you what it stands for and > what it does. It stands for "Recombinational Loss of Heterozygosity". > (Aren't you sorry you asked?!) See Wikipedia at > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RecLOH .. What it does in simple terms is > to duplicate one of the values in a two-part marker instead of having two > different values. So, looking at TDR1, instead of the 15, 16, 16, 16 at > #464 a-d which his cousins have, Ted has all 16's. Then at #CDY a-b, > instead of showing 36-41 or 36-42 like his cousins, Ted tested 36-36. > This is a 6-step change and would be huge if counted that way. Since it > is due to a RecLOH event, we can either not count it at all or count it as > one mutation. > > Note that all the cousins in the blue block on the Renshaw website > already have the doubling at #459 a-b, which is a third spot where > doubling occurs.. > > Does this give you some understanding of the situation? > > Eleanor > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: David B. Strong > To: [email protected] > Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 4:25 PM > Subject: Re: Armstrong and Renshaw > > > Hi Eleanor... > Thanks for your message. I have to admit, however, that I am confused > by the term "RecLOH". Can you explain this one for me? Thanks, > Dave Strong > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: [email protected] > To: [email protected] > Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 3:55 PM > Subject: Armstrong and Renshaw > > > Hi, David > > I am the co-admin for the Renshaw Y-DNA project. I noted with interest > on your webpage > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~donegalstrongs/armstrong.htm > the comparison of an Armstrong who does not match any other Armstrongs > with a Renshaw from my project -- with TDR1, one of my cousins. > > You mentioned that the two men matched 23/25 but the match fell apart > at 37 markers. This is because Ted had a RecLOH event somewhere along the > line in his branch which caused doubling of his markers. If you will go > to our Renshaw website http://www.renshawdna.com/Charts.htm and look at > the last three men in the top blue block, you will see that TDR1 has the > odd value at 464a and at CDYb. The two men below him in the blue block, > also my cousins, have the "real" value for our branch of the family tree. > Note that WAR now has 67 markers, so if your Armstrong is a close match he > may want to go to 67 markers as well. With the R1b folk, more is > definitely better. > > Eleanor Gordon > Renshaw Y-DNA Project Co-Administrator > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Seems I recall hearing about an Armstrong who was fixin' to have his neck stretched by the sherriff in Carlisle and some Grahams helped to spring him and got themselves on the sherriffs no-like list. Cousing Chuck > [Original Message] > From: Marilyn Otterson <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Date: 10/10/2006 4:03:55 PM > Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] Armstrong and Renshaw > > You know, members of the Graham family in the "old country" got in trouble > with the royal authorities. (I think I have this right but if not, somebody > will correct me.) Some changed their name to "Maharg" and others took the > colors of the tartan for their names...Black, White, Green...I believe this > it true. > > Marilyn > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Marilynn Masten" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 1:08 PM > Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] Armstrong and Renshaw > > > > Yep, my Armstrong DNA matches some people named Renshaw. We could have > > been Renshaws who liked the name Armstrong, We could have been adopted > > into an Armstrong family, we could have had a laddie smitten by a lassie > > named Armstrong--or the other way around, Renshaw. Maybe we lived next > > door to Renshaws, maybe we were Armstrongs in trouble with the law (I > > know---impossible) who hid out with the Renshaws. If I weren't so lazy, > > I'd write a book about this. > > > > I have in my Avery family, one son who left town hurriedly (something > > about a young lady) and he changed his name to Andrews. If my cousin > > hadn't been told this by an old aunt he never would have known-----but, he > > still is now an Andrews, as was his father and grandfather. He says it's a > > good name and I agree. > > > > > > Marilynn > > IBSSG > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Dennis L Armstrong > > To: Marilynn Masten > > Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 7:16 PM > > Subject: Re: Armstrong and Renshaw > > > > > > Hi: I read what David Strong had sent and the other messages attached to > > it and I HAVEN'T A CLUE, what they are talking about! > > I will have to go back over what was sent to se if I can make some sense > > of it! > > Hope all is well with you. > > Best Regards > > > > Dennis Armstrong > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Marilynn Masten > > To: Dennis L Armstrong > > Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 5:10 PM > > Subject: Fw: Armstrong and Renshaw > > > > > > If you know what they are talking about, you're a better man than I am, > > Dennis. > > Marilynn > > IBSSG > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: David B. Strong > > To: Marilynn Masten ; Dennis Armstrong > > Cc: Eleanor Gordon (Co-admin Renshaw) > > Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 11:56 AM > > Subject: Fw: Armstrong and Renshaw > > > > > > Hello Marilynn and Dennis... > > > > Yesterday I had an interesting exchange of messages with Eleanor > > Gordon, Co-Admin of the Renshaw project. I thought you should be made > > aware of the discussion, to make of it what you will. I learned a bit > > about "RecLOH", or "Recombinational Loss of Heterozygosity"; although I am > > not sure I understand the science of it very well. Be sure to take a > > look at the website cited by Eleanor, and then follow the links found in > > that website... there are fuller explanations there. > > > > I am not sure that even given allowance for Eleanor's cousin's > > "RecLOH", there is a real chance of a match between Dennis and her > > cousin(s). I suspect we may really be dealing with a case of mutational > > drift from further apart to a closer result... But, you can and should > > have the opportunity to evaluate that possibility as well as the > > suggestion made by Eleanor. > > > > Regards > > Dave Strong > > Co-Admin, Armstrong DNA Project > > PS to Eleanor... Marilynn is also an administrator, of the Gardner DNA > > Project, and Dennis her cousin. > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: [email protected] > > To: [email protected] > > Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 4:58 PM > > Subject: RecLOH > > > > > > > > I can't exactly explain it, but I can tell you what it stands for and > > what it does. It stands for "Recombinational Loss of Heterozygosity". > > (Aren't you sorry you asked?!) See Wikipedia at > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RecLOH .. What it does in simple terms is > > to duplicate one of the values in a two-part marker instead of having two > > different values. So, looking at TDR1, instead of the 15, 16, 16, 16 at > > #464 a-d which his cousins have, Ted has all 16's. Then at #CDY a-b, > > instead of showing 36-41 or 36-42 like his cousins, Ted tested 36-36. > > This is a 6-step change and would be huge if counted that way. Since it > > is due to a RecLOH event, we can either not count it at all or count it as > > one mutation. > > > > Note that all the cousins in the blue block on the Renshaw website > > already have the doubling at #459 a-b, which is a third spot where > > doubling occurs.. > > > > Does this give you some understanding of the situation? > > > > Eleanor > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: David B. Strong > > To: [email protected] > > Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 4:25 PM > > Subject: Re: Armstrong and Renshaw > > > > > > Hi Eleanor... > > Thanks for your message. I have to admit, however, that I am confused > > by the term "RecLOH". Can you explain this one for me? Thanks, > > Dave Strong > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: [email protected] > > To: [email protected] > > Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 3:55 PM > > Subject: Armstrong and Renshaw > > > > > > Hi, David > > > > I am the co-admin for the Renshaw Y-DNA project. I noted with interest > > on your webpage > > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~donegalstrongs/armstrong.htm > > the comparison of an Armstrong who does not match any other Armstrongs > > with a Renshaw from my project -- with TDR1, one of my cousins. > > > > You mentioned that the two men matched 23/25 but the match fell apart > > at 37 markers. This is because Ted had a RecLOH event somewhere along the > > line in his branch which caused doubling of his markers. If you will go > > to our Renshaw website http://www.renshawdna.com/Charts.htm and look at > > the last three men in the top blue block, you will see that TDR1 has the > > odd value at 464a and at CDYb. The two men below him in the blue block, > > also my cousins, have the "real" value for our branch of the family tree. > > Note that WAR now has 67 markers, so if your Armstrong is a close match he > > may want to go to 67 markers as well. With the R1b folk, more is > > definitely better. > > > > Eleanor Gordon > > Renshaw Y-DNA Project Co-Administrator > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Mary, I don't know how long you've been on this list but if you've been on awhile y ou'll know it has been very quiet for months, maybe a couple of years, with queries posted and only a few off topic comments now and then. My suggestion...when you see the "OT" just delete that post and you won't have to read what you're not interested in. My guess is that eventually we will all get busy and stop writing so much to the list and back we'll all go to genealogy...or...if you like you could unsub from this list and subscribe to the Armstrong-Gen-Only list. You will get less mail that way. Regards, Cousin Marilyn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mary O'Neil" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 9:55 AM Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] OT > Hi Everyone, > > I love reading all of the banter here, but I like Teddy have concidered > unsubscribing to this list. There are sooooo many emails coming in that I > do not have time to read, 64 in one day, and I don't always get here. Most > of the time I end up just deleting everything though I hate to miss > anything too. > > My suggestion, maybe someone could start a blog. I know they are free, I > myself belong to a couple in blog.com. Someone would have to maintain it, > but it isn't that difficult, and you can post photos too! Then when anyone > joins they can start their own blog page also. > > Just a suggestion, would really hate to delete this list, and I don't > have the time to manage a page. > > Mary (greatgrandmother was an Armstrong) > > Marilyn Otterson <[email protected]> wrote: > Rob, you are an Armstrong, too. Many people who have the Armstrong name > were adopted into the clan on the Borders of England and Scotland and > took/were given the name. I am sure many people who are now Armstrongs > might have been something else generations ago. But...what's in a name, > anyway? One of the reasons we all seem to have different Y-DNA is because > we come from different branches of Armstrongs. > > Renee, no, all Armstrongs aren't Irish, at least not way, way back. The > name, as we know it, probably originated somewhere in what's now northern > England or southern Scotland, but then people spread out all over the > world. > Many, many Armstrongs, considered troublemakers, were "gently" moved to > parts of what's now Northern Ireland around the end of the 16th century. > There they became soldiers, farmers, growers of flax for linen, etc. and > then many came to America, Australia, and all over the world so you can > find > us everywhere. There are very large numbers of Armstrongs in England and > Scotland as well as Ireland. And although I suppose most Armstrongs are > white, I'm sure we come in almost all shades. > > One of the things I like to do when we are traveling is to look in the > local > phone book for Armstrongs and often there are a good bunch or at least a > few, even in countries where English is not the first language. Have you > googled for the Armstrong name and looked at the clan websites? You'll > find > interesting information there. > > Regards, > Cousin Marilyn > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "R Hobbs" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 1:20 AM > Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] OT > > >> Hey Rob >> I moved south about 3 years ago, and I'm an Armstrong descendant by >> blood. >> So, now you have met one. Nice to meet you. There are tons of Armstrongs >> in >> the phone book here. Aren't most Armstrongs originally from Ireland? >> That's >> what made me curious when I heard there were Armstrongs from Trinidad, >> since >> I thought most came from Ireland. Maybe the guy was just wrong. Cheers ! >> Renee' >> >> >>>From: "Robyn Leeds" >>>Reply-To: [email protected] >>>To: >>>Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] OT >>>Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2006 11:26:10 -0400 >>> >>>"Also, are any of you in your little chat group (emails) here black? I >>>was >>>told there were so many black Armstrongs, especially from the south....is >>>this true?" >>> >>>Hi Renee :) >>> >>>Let's see ... I'm an Armstrong descendant (yes, I know, only by adoption, >>>sigh!!), I'm in the south (okay, it's temporary, humour me!!) but I'm as >>>white as the ... what WOULD I put in there? Snow? Yeah, that'll do, I >>>glow in the dark! lol But MY Armstrongs hail from Northumberland and >>>Durham, haven't managed to get back any further than that I'm afraid. >>>Anyway, I haven't met a single Armstrong since we've been in GA, so they >>>must be in hiding, black OR white!! ;D >>> >>>Take care, >>> >>>Rob. >>> >>>------------------------------- >>>To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>>quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > --------------------------------- > All-new Yahoo! Mail - Fire up a more powerful email and get things done > faster. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I WANT OFF THIS LIST...........I have tried everyway I know to UNSUBSCRIBE (the way you are suppose to do)..........WHY can't I get off............thank you.........pj

Good to hear that and I hope that it was mutually fruitful, Sean

He may very likely be related to our Armstrongs, though I cant readily find him. Our As migrated through Alabama, cont to be connected to Tenn and the Carolinas. If the same line, they came from PA. Two sources to check: "Armstrong, Branyon, Bryson & Allied Families", by Ethel S. Updike & "Youngblood - Armstrong and Allied Families" written by Frances Youngblood and Floelle Youngblood Bonner -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Fri, 6 Oct 2006 11:34 AM Subject: [ARMSTRONG] North Carolina Armstrongs Hi! I am looking for Thomas Armstrong born about 1794 in North Carolina. His wife's name was Elizabeth who was also born about 1797 in North Carolina. They went from North Carolina to Tennessee (between 1816 and 1819) to Lincoln County,Missouri to Texas (between 1852 and 1856). He was a minister for a long time before his death in 1869/1870 in Williamson County, TX. His wife died before 1869 ( not sure where). I think that I found a marriage record that might be them in Tyrell County, NC in 1812 (Thomas Armstrong m. Elizabeth Jones). Their first child was Permelia born about 1814 in North Carolina. They had at least 8 children. I have his will and probate records which name all his children and most of his grandchildren. I am related to the second oldest boy Thomas, JR born about 1829 in Lincoln County, MO. He first married Sarah E. Kimball in 1850 and secondly Frenetta Howdeshell in 1854. Thomas and Frenetta with child Plooma moved to Texas between 1852 and 1856. They were in the 1860 Hill County, TX Census near Hillsboro. Would love any kind of help. Catherine Fleming ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ________________________________________________________________________ Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more.

Well PJ, I'd say your first problem is that you have subscribed to this list under another email address than the one you sent this email with because this email address [email protected] is NOT subscribned to the Armstrong List Or as has happened to a few others, your intial IPS was incorporated into another IPS and for some reason the old email address is still working through your local IPS.... Is there another email address I can look up and unsubscribe from this end?? Sincerely, John D Armstrong Administrator A Little SoWest of North pj Thompson wrote: > I WANT OFF THIS LIST...........I have tried everyway I know to UNSUBSCRIBE (the way you are suppose to do)..........WHY can't I get off............thank you.........pj > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > >

Ben Here is some information on Robert Armstrong and Alice Calhoun _http://www.tennessee.gov/tsla/history/manuscripts/findingaids/ths889.pdf#sear ch=%22Robert%20Armstrong%20Alice%20Calhoun%22_ (http://www.tennessee.gov/tsla/history/manuscripts/findingaids/ths889.pdf#search="Robert%20Armstrong%20Alice% 20Calhoun") I descend from John Armstrong and Elizabeth Parrott. Elizabeth's Parrott's sister married a William Armstrong. They can both be found in Fayette County, Ohio. There is strong evidence that William Armstrong is the son of John Armstrong and Nancy Agnes Erwin. I believe that John and William are most likely brothers but I don't have strong proof of that. I believe that John Armstrong is a son of John Armstrong b. 1759 and Nancy Agnes Erwin of Highland County, Virginia. Now some researchers indicate that John Armstrong b. 1759 is the son of Robert Armstrong and Alice Calhoun. I've looked into this a bit but I can't straighten it all out in my head. Have you looked into it at all. It seems that you have done a great deal of research on this line. Thanks Ronda

Yep, my Armstrong DNA matches some people named Renshaw. We could have been Renshaws who liked the name Armstrong, We could have been adopted into an Armstrong family, we could have had a laddie smitten by a lassie named Armstrong--or the other way around, Renshaw. Maybe we lived next door to Renshaws, maybe we were Armstrongs in trouble with the law (I know---impossible) who hid out with the Renshaws. If I weren't so lazy, I'd write a book about this. I have in my Avery family, one son who left town hurriedly (something about a young lady) and he changed his name to Andrews. If my cousin hadn't been told this by an old aunt he never would have known-----but, he still is now an Andrews, as was his father and grandfather. He says it's a good name and I agree. Marilynn IBSSG ----- Original Message ----- From: Dennis L Armstrong To: Marilynn Masten Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 7:16 PM Subject: Re: Armstrong and Renshaw Hi: I read what David Strong had sent and the other messages attached to it and I HAVEN'T A CLUE, what they are talking about! I will have to go back over what was sent to se if I can make some sense of it! Hope all is well with you. Best Regards Dennis Armstrong ----- Original Message ----- From: Marilynn Masten To: Dennis L Armstrong Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 5:10 PM Subject: Fw: Armstrong and Renshaw If you know what they are talking about, you're a better man than I am, Dennis. Marilynn IBSSG ----- Original Message ----- From: David B. Strong To: Marilynn Masten ; Dennis Armstrong Cc: Eleanor Gordon (Co-admin Renshaw) Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 11:56 AM Subject: Fw: Armstrong and Renshaw Hello Marilynn and Dennis... Yesterday I had an interesting exchange of messages with Eleanor Gordon, Co-Admin of the Renshaw project. I thought you should be made aware of the discussion, to make of it what you will. I learned a bit about "RecLOH", or "Recombinational Loss of Heterozygosity"; although I am not sure I understand the science of it very well. Be sure to take a look at the website cited by Eleanor, and then follow the links found in that website... there are fuller explanations there. I am not sure that even given allowance for Eleanor's cousin's "RecLOH", there is a real chance of a match between Dennis and her cousin(s). I suspect we may really be dealing with a case of mutational drift from further apart to a closer result... But, you can and should have the opportunity to evaluate that possibility as well as the suggestion made by Eleanor. Regards Dave Strong Co-Admin, Armstrong DNA Project PS to Eleanor... Marilynn is also an administrator, of the Gardner DNA Project, and Dennis her cousin. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 4:58 PM Subject: RecLOH I can't exactly explain it, but I can tell you what it stands for and what it does. It stands for "Recombinational Loss of Heterozygosity". (Aren't you sorry you asked?!) See Wikipedia at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RecLOH .. What it does in simple terms is to duplicate one of the values in a two-part marker instead of having two different values. So, looking at TDR1, instead of the 15, 16, 16, 16 at #464 a-d which his cousins have, Ted has all 16's. Then at #CDY a-b, instead of showing 36-41 or 36-42 like his cousins, Ted tested 36-36. This is a 6-step change and would be huge if counted that way. Since it is due to a RecLOH event, we can either not count it at all or count it as one mutation. Note that all the cousins in the blue block on the Renshaw website already have the doubling at #459 a-b, which is a third spot where doubling occurs.. Does this give you some understanding of the situation? Eleanor ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: David B. Strong To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 4:25 PM Subject: Re: Armstrong and Renshaw Hi Eleanor... Thanks for your message. I have to admit, however, that I am confused by the term "RecLOH". Can you explain this one for me? Thanks, Dave Strong ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 3:55 PM Subject: Armstrong and Renshaw Hi, David I am the co-admin for the Renshaw Y-DNA project. I noted with interest on your webpage http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~donegalstrongs/armstrong.htm the comparison of an Armstrong who does not match any other Armstrongs with a Renshaw from my project -- with TDR1, one of my cousins. You mentioned that the two men matched 23/25 but the match fell apart at 37 markers. This is because Ted had a RecLOH event somewhere along the line in his branch which caused doubling of his markers. If you will go to our Renshaw website http://www.renshawdna.com/Charts.htm and look at the last three men in the top blue block, you will see that TDR1 has the odd value at 464a and at CDYb. The two men below him in the blue block, also my cousins, have the "real" value for our branch of the family tree. Note that WAR now has 67 markers, so if your Armstrong is a close match he may want to go to 67 markers as well. With the R1b folk, more is definitely better. Eleanor Gordon Renshaw Y-DNA Project Co-Administrator

Rob, I've got a blog. Now THAT sounds like a disease. Everything sounds like a disease to me today. You, my best friend, has never read my blog. Marilynn IBSSG ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robyn Leeds" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 10:05 AM Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] OT >" My suggestion, maybe someone could start a blog." > > Perhaps an easier option Mary would be a Yahoo!Groups mailing list? Just > for OT stuff of course, but you run the risk of ON topic stuff being added > and everyone here missing out on that part! :( Definitely an option, and > it's VERY easy to setup, I've done it myself with my K/Nibb/s mailing list > (the Yahoo!Groups list I started is for uploading of files/photos only) > and I'm Moderator on the Genealogy4Dummies list. Anyone willing to start > one and maintain it? Actually, unless you put all newbies on moderated > status, there's not much to maintain!! ;D > > Take care, > > Rob. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

Patti, I've got Cobbs. Sounds like a serious disease, huh? Marilynn IBSSG ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patti Armstrong" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 11:37 AM Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] 0T replies > Marilynn: > Potatoes in Spaghetti... what a novel idea, in the pasta or the sauce? > Were > they in chunks or mashed? Or flour in the pasta? Have a few Carbs. > > Some of us willingly joined the Armstrong Clan--we are good people a > little > eccentric but to join the A Clan well---. "They" say Birds of a feather > flock together. > > Idaho does grow great potatoes but they can be grown in most any garden > with > equal success. They are only a 90 day crop so some places (KS) can get > two > harvests. I know Idaho/Maine etc question that but---- > > Unfortunately the American Indians may not have been the "first > Americans". > Abused yes! The continent has been inhabited for many, many years! > > Rob: I tried eating raw hamburger-- I think they used to call it Tartar! > Not a good practice. Too much risk of salmonella or some other thing like > that. Just gross. (sounds like sushi to me) > Potatoes--The green comes from the sunlight on the tubers and it will make > you sick and some of it does seep into the rest of the potato. I toss > those... my compost bin is a thing of wonder. > > Armstrong's in the south: Many slaves took the names of their captors > when > they ran or were set free. I would love to find that in my tree > someplace. > I keep looking. My dad's side (Cobb) is the most likely and I am back to > 1700 in the Carolina's and still not finding it. Plenty of slave owners > though :( --- Lots of drunks. :) > > Patti > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Marilynn Masten" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 7:32 AM > Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] To Ben Barr, brother of Rosanne > > >> Patti: I ordered Spaghetti in Ireland. It had potatoes in the sauce. >> Marilynn >> IBSSG >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Patti Armstrong" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 9:22 AM >> Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] To Ben Barr, brother of Rosanne >> >> >> >I >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> -- >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> Version: 7.1.407 / Virus Database: 268.13.1/466 - Release Date: 10/7/06 >> >> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

Sean, I have been in correspondance with David. Regards, Ron Barnett -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]On Behalf Of Sean Armstrong Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 2:52 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] [Armstrong] Ron Barnett's email address David, I sent you an address for him yesterday directly. It was [email protected] As I replied to all that should have been posted as well. I got this address from his original post Sean A ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

" My suggestion, maybe someone could start a blog." Perhaps an easier option Mary would be a Yahoo!Groups mailing list? Just for OT stuff of course, but you run the risk of ON topic stuff being added and everyone here missing out on that part! :( Definitely an option, and it's VERY easy to setup, I've done it myself with my K/Nibb/s mailing list (the Yahoo!Groups list I started is for uploading of files/photos only) and I'm Moderator on the Genealogy4Dummies list. Anyone willing to start one and maintain it? Actually, unless you put all newbies on moderated status, there's not much to maintain!! ;D Take care, Rob.

Marilyn, The first Armstrong (Siward) last name was Beron from Upland, Denmark; then the King of England gave him the name of Armstrong, as the story goes. Bill Kingman, Az. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marilyn Otterson" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 4:05 AM Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] OT > Rob, you are an Armstrong, too. Many people who have the Armstrong name > were adopted into the clan on the Borders of England and Scotland and > took/were given the name. I am sure many people who are now Armstrongs > might have been something else generations ago. But...what's in a name, > anyway? One of the reasons we all seem to have different Y-DNA is because > we come from different branches of Armstrongs. > > Renee, no, all Armstrongs aren't Irish, at least not way, way back. The > name, as we know it, probably originated somewhere in what's now northern > England or southern Scotland, but then people spread out all over the > world. > Many, many Armstrongs, considered troublemakers, were "gently" moved to > parts of what's now Northern Ireland around the end of the 16th century. > There they became soldiers, farmers, growers of flax for linen, etc. and > then many came to America, Australia, and all over the world so you can > find > us everywhere. There are very large numbers of Armstrongs in England and > Scotland as well as Ireland. And although I suppose most Armstrongs are > white, I'm sure we come in almost all shades. > > One of the things I like to do when we are traveling is to look in the > local > phone book for Armstrongs and often there are a good bunch or at least a > few, even in countries where English is not the first language. Have you > googled for the Armstrong name and looked at the clan websites? You'll > find > interesting information there. > > Regards, > Cousin Marilyn > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "R Hobbs" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 1:20 AM > Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] OT > > >> Hey Rob >> I moved south about 3 years ago, and I'm an Armstrong descendant by >> blood. >> So, now you have met one. Nice to meet you. There are tons of Armstrongs >> in >> the phone book here. Aren't most Armstrongs originally from Ireland? >> That's >> what made me curious when I heard there were Armstrongs from Trinidad, >> since >> I thought most came from Ireland. Maybe the guy was just wrong. Cheers ! >> Renee' >> >> >>>From: "Robyn Leeds" <[email protected]> >>>Reply-To: [email protected] >>>To: <[email protected]> >>>Subject: Re: [ARMSTRONG] OT >>>Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2006 11:26:10 -0400 >>> >>>"Also, are any of you in your little chat group (emails) here black? I >>>was >>>told there were so many black Armstrongs, especially from the south....is >>>this true?" >>> >>>Hi Renee :) >>> >>>Let's see ... I'm an Armstrong descendant (yes, I know, only by adoption, >>>sigh!!), I'm in the south (okay, it's temporary, humour me!!) but I'm as >>>white as the ... what WOULD I put in there? Snow? Yeah, that'll do, I >>>glow in the dark! lol But MY Armstrongs hail from Northumberland and >>>Durham, haven't managed to get back any further than that I'm afraid. >>>Anyway, I haven't met a single Armstrong since we've been in GA, so they >>>must be in hiding, black OR white!! ;D >>> >>>Take care, >>> >>>Rob. >>> >>>------------------------------- >>>To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>>quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >