Wilma, You indicated that the wife of Joshua Logan Younger who was Elizabeth Virginia Lee b. 27 Feb 1755, Prince William, VA, d. 15 Sep 1787 KY. had not been connected to the Lee Family. I thought she was the daughter of Henry Lee II, b. ca 1730 Lee Hall, Westmoreland, VA, d. 15 Aug 1787 Leesylvania Plantation, Prince William, VA. and Lucy Grymes b. 26 Apr 1734 Morattico, Richmond, VA. c. 1792. Henry Lee II, is well documented as a Lieutenant Colonel, Judge and Senator. That line goes back to the immigrant from England Richard Henry Lee and wife Anna Owen. I know several researchers tried to put her in other families but I though this was fairly well documented. I have not researched it in detail. I wondered if you know if Thomas Coleman Younger b. 15 Jan 1844 Lee's Summit, Jackson, MO. married Myra Maebelle Shirley. She was known as "Belle Starr" I found three other marriages for Belle but I never found one where she married Thomas Coleman Younger. I have read about them living together and being partners in crimes. Emily Jane Younger b. 1852, Lee's Summitt, Jackson, MO. sister of Thomas Coleman Younger, married a Kitt Porter Rose b. 4 Jan 1840 KY. I have not been able to tie him to my wife's Rose line. Do you know his parents names. I see that a Lewis Rose b. 1821 KY is living with him in 1870 Census, wonder if that is his father. Don

Don, all I can say is that all the genealogists I'm in contact with, say there is no proof that Elizabeth was surnamed Lee. That's not to say it can't be true, most everyone does give her name as Lee or ?Lee (meaning unproven). Cole in his biography says she was the daughter of "Lighthorse Harry Lee", but I've heard several Lee researchers deny that. I just don't know for sure, as far as I am aware there has not been a marriage license or bond found. Again, according to Cole's autobiography, "The story of Cole Younger" by Himself - Oak Hills Publishing, 818 N. Forest Avenue, Springfield, MO 65802. He emphatically denies ever having married Belle Shirley. He states he first met her when she was 14 years old, the daughter of John Shirley. The next time he met her was 4 years later and she was the wife of his comrade, Jim Reed, and he met her at the home of Jim's mother. "That was about 3 months before the birth of her daughter, Pearl". She later married Sam Starr. A few years later, he again met her and was warned that she wanted him, but he made sure to avoid her. According to him, he never married anyone. Emily Younger did marry Kitt Rose Feb 20, 1869 in Jackson Co. MO but I have nothing in my file to connect him to his parents. You might search the 1850 and 1860 census for Kitt P Rose, perhaps you would find him with parents. I have him born Jan 1840 so he should be with his parents in 1850 for sure, and possibly 1860. I have his birth state as Kentucky. The following from his autobiography: "One day Belle Reed told me of her troubles, and that night "Aunt Suse" our family servant, warned me "Belle's sure in love with you, Cap'n Cole." she explained. "You better be careful." What that hint I thereafter evaded the wife of my former comrade in arms. Reed was killed a few years later after the robbery of the stage near San Antonia and Belle married again, this time to Tom or Sam Starr. Later she came to Missouri and traveled under the name of Younger, boasted of an intimate acquaintance with me, served time in state prison, and at this time declared that she was my wife, and that the girl Pearl was our child. Her story was a fabrication, inspired undoubtedly by the notoriety it would give her through the Cherokee nation where the name of Younger was widely known whether fortunately or unfortunately" ----- Original Message ----- From: Don Ott To: arizard@rootsweb.com Sent: Monday, November 15, 2010 3:09 PM Subject: [ARIZARD] Younger Wilma, You indicated that the wife of Joshua Logan Younger who was Elizabeth Virginia Lee b. 27 Feb 1755, Prince William, VA, d. 15 Sep 1787 KY. had not been connected to the Lee Family. I thought she was the daughter of Henry Lee II, b. ca 1730 Lee Hall, Westmoreland, VA, d. 15 Aug 1787 Leesylvania Plantation, Prince William, VA. and Lucy Grymes b. 26 Apr 1734 Morattico, Richmond, VA. c. 1792. Henry Lee II, is well documented as a Lieutenant Colonel, Judge and Senator. That line goes back to the immigrant from England Richard Henry Lee and wife Anna Owen. I know several researchers tried to put her in other families but I though this was fairly well documented. I have not researched it in detail. I wondered if you know if Thomas Coleman Younger b. 15 Jan 1844 Lee's Summit, Jackson, MO. married Myra Maebelle Shirley. She was known as "Belle Starr" I found three other marriages for Belle but I never found one where she married Thomas Coleman Younger. I have read about them living together and being partners in crimes. Emily Jane Younger b. 1852, Lee's Summitt, Jackson, MO. sister of Thomas Coleman Younger, married a Kitt Porter Rose b. 4 Jan 1840 KY. I have not been able to tie him to my wife's Rose line. Do you know his parents names. I see that a Lewis Rose b. 1821 KY is living with him in 1870 Census, wonder if that is his father. Don ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ARIZARD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I have a question on the name Kitt, we had several 'Kits' in mom's line, used as a nickname for Christopher. Could this be the same for this Kitt? gen --- On Mon, 11/15/10, Wilma Norton <wilma.norton@cox.net> wrote: > From: Wilma Norton <wilma.norton@cox.net> > Subject: Re: [ARIZARD] Younger > To: arizard@rootsweb.com > Date: Monday, November 15, 2010, 4:21 PM > Don, all I can say is that all the > genealogists I'm in contact with, say there is no proof that > Elizabeth was surnamed Lee.  That's not to say it can't > be true, most everyone does give her name as Lee or ?Lee > (meaning unproven).  Cole in his biography says she was > the daughter of "Lighthorse Harry Lee", but I've heard > several Lee researchers deny that.  I just don't know > for sure, as far as I am aware there has not been a marriage > license or bond found. > > Again, according to Cole's autobiography, "The story of > Cole Younger" by Himself - Oak Hills Publishing, 818 N. > Forest Avenue, Springfield, MO  65802.  He > emphatically denies ever having married Belle Shirley.  > He states he first met her when she was 14 years old, the > daughter of John Shirley.  The next time he met her was > 4 years later and she was the wife of his comrade, Jim Reed, > and he met her at the home of Jim's mother.  "That was > about 3 months before the birth of her daughter, > Pearl".  She later married Sam Starr.  A few years > later, he again met her and was warned that she wanted him, > but he made sure to avoid her.  According to him, he > never married anyone. > > Emily Younger did marry Kitt Rose Feb 20, 1869 in Jackson > Co. MO but I have nothing in my file to connect him to his > parents.  You might search the 1850 and 1860 census for > Kitt P Rose, perhaps you would find him with parents.  > I have him born Jan 1840 so he should be with his parents in > 1850 for sure, and possibly 1860.  I have his birth > state as Kentucky. > > The following from his autobiography: > "One day Belle Reed told me of her troubles, and that night > "Aunt Suse" our family servant, warned me "Belle's sure in > love with you, Cap'n Cole." she explained.  "You better > be careful."  What that hint I thereafter evaded the > wife of my former comrade in arms.  Reed was killed a > few years later after the robbery of the stage near San > Antonia and Belle married again, this time to Tom or Sam > Starr.  Later she came to Missouri and traveled under > the name of Younger, boasted of an intimate acquaintance > with me, served time in state prison, and at this time > declared that she was my wife, and that the girl Pearl was > our child.  Her story was a fabrication, inspired > undoubtedly by the notoriety it would give her through the > Cherokee nation where the name of Younger was widely known > whether fortunately or unfortunately" >   ----- Original Message ----- >   From: Don Ott >   To: arizard@rootsweb.com > >   Sent: Monday, November 15, 2010 3:09 PM >   Subject: [ARIZARD] Younger > > >   Wilma, >   You indicated that the wife of Joshua Logan Younger > who was >   Elizabeth Virginia Lee b. 27 Feb 1755, Prince > William, VA, d. 15 Sep >   1787 KY. had not been connected to the Lee Family. I > thought she was >   the daughter of Henry Lee II, b. ca 1730 Lee Hall, > Westmoreland, VA, >   d. 15 Aug 1787 Leesylvania Plantation, Prince > William, VA. and Lucy >   Grymes b. 26 Apr 1734 Morattico, Richmond, VA. c. > 1792. Henry Lee II, >   is well documented as a Lieutenant Colonel, Judge > and Senator. That >   line goes back to the immigrant from England Richard > Henry Lee and >   wife Anna Owen.  I know several researchers > tried to put her in other >   families but I though this was fairly well > documented. I have not >   researched it in detail. >   I wondered if you know if Thomas Coleman Younger b. > 15 Jan 1844 >   Lee's Summit, Jackson, MO. married Myra Maebelle > Shirley. She was >   known as "Belle Starr" I found three other marriages > for Belle but I >   never found one where she married  Thomas > Coleman Younger. I have >   read about them living together and being partners > in crimes. >   Emily Jane Younger b. 1852, Lee's Summitt, Jackson, > MO. sister of >   Thomas Coleman Younger, married a Kitt Porter Rose > b. 4 Jan 1840 KY. >   I have not been able to tie him to my wife's Rose > line. Do you know >   his parents names. I see that a Lewis Rose b. 1821 > KY is living with >   him in 1870 Census, wonder if that is his father. >   Don > >     >   ------------------------------- >   To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email > to ARIZARD-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the > subject and the body of the message > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ARIZARD-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the > subject and the body of the message >