Hello Daphne, many thanks for the tips - I've done a few searches on Ancestry.com and came up with several ARROTTI's, even downloaded a file or two. Unfortunately, none of the ancestors go back further than 1890's, way too late for my lot to have been in the US before travelling on to England. However, it does prove your point - that name ERROTTI could well have been changed to ARROTTI. An 1861 London census would be a good starting point, or so I thought, until someone suggested it would take me 2 years to search the fiche, since I don't know what area they may have lived in London. Would you mind giving the full title of the book & author you have suggested please? I'll try and lay may hands on a copy, which as you say, should give me some perspective. Many thanks, Diane -----Original Message----- From: Daphne Dashfield [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Saturday, April 13, 2002 11:21 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [Anglo-Italian] Re: EROTTI/EROTY Hello Diane > The surname EROTTI / EROTY (possibly the English > variant) arrived in England 1858/59 and on ggrandmother's first marriage > certificate her father's occupation is listed as 'musician'. I have been > unable to find any variant of the name on any Census record. Have you tried starting with an 'A' instead of 'E'? E.g. it looks from Colpi's book as though the firm of Askey was actually Tedeschi (think how it sounds if you are an English clerk who doesn't know Italian spelling). My surname has 16 or so spellings and probably more yet to be discovered. See my signature below so you can see the types of variation. > London was > given as her birthplace but I have nothing more than that. Have you tried both parish and GRO records for the marriage and birth? An Italian priest may spell the name correctly. > Does your publication "TheItalian Factor..." say anything about Italian > migration around the late 1850's? Colpi's "The Italian Factor.." is well worth reading to understand what was happening in the 1850s and relating it to your own family. I read it with knowledge of my family's stories so may have a biased reading of the book. Italian migration in late 1850's was probably mainly from the Appenines (Tuscany and Emilia Romagna) esp. Borgo Val di Taro (Pr), Bardi (Pr). Poor, unskilled peasants: agricultural, labouring (eg paviors/asphalters), street entertainers (esp. barrel organ), street vendors, esp. ice-cream, chestnuts. There were also craftsmen from about 1800 (more specific details in the book and other occupations, areas), and some political refugees (mainly temporary) from other areas to London 1818-1860. > In regards to my family, another researcher turned up the name EROLI / > Guiseppe, merchant marine and suggested this is probably my family, some of > the documentation supporting this theory looks like it could fit but it > belies the story gg'mother told about her family's background. Oh dear, > just what does one believe! My family stories do fit the classic Appenine peasant profile, but we are also fairly long-lived which helps pass on the stories from grandfather to grandson more accurately. Also my gg grandfather took son(s) back to visit Italy making the stories much more worth telling their sons and nephews. There were also merchants and of course bankers from 12 or 1300. Also more recently from 1840 in the Clerkenwell community. Not so numerous as street musicians by late 1850s I suspect. Daphne Dashfield (Geradine) GHIRARDANI Variations: GERADINE, GHIRADANI, GEARDINI, GERARDINI, GHIREDANI, GHERARDINI, GHIRARDINI, GERADINI, JERIDINA, GERARDINE, GERARDANI, GEORDINI, JERIDI(E)NE, GHIRAND(I)ANI, GLARINI (1881 census transcription) ==== ANGLO-ITALIAN Mailing List ==== Inaugural Meeting of the Anglo-Italian Family History At the SOG Fair at 3pm For the venue address look at http://www.dreamwater.net/anglersrest/Italian.htm ============================== To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237