John; Some of us have tried that route of sending in information on our Hessian ancestors only to receive a polite slap in the face. Twice I have submitted my info to you and was told to stick to the subject. My ancestor was a Hessian, fought in the American Revolution, and stayed behind. If that is getting off of the subject than why not research other materials that may provide clues. -----Original Message----- From: john <jmerz@cogeco.ca> Sent: May 13, 2005 11:59 AM To: AMREV-HESSIANS-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [HESSIAN] Notes on Hessian Soldiers Suzanne, to tell you the truth, there is nothing of substance in Clifford Neal Smith's Notes, and I would not spend a nickel on buying a copy, trust me. To search intelligently for a Hessian, you much better off to give us his full name, the place he first turned up, and all other little details like wife's name, children, will, how you found out about him, etc. Do this over this list, and you may have results! Don't overlook the list archives. A goldmine for Hessian research. Cheers, John Merz From: "Suzanne Pryse" <pryses@yahoo.com> Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 1:53 PM Subject: [HESSIAN] Notes on Hessian Soldiers > > Does anyone have a copy of "Notes on Hessian Solders Surnames beginning with S" by Clifford N. Smith? I'd like to know if my ancestor is listed before I try to hunt down a used copy to buy. > > Thanks, Suzanne > > You can search the archives for a specific message or browse them, going from one message to another. To search: http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/?list=AMREV-HESSIANS To browse: http://archiver.rootsweb.com/AMREV-HESSIANS-L > **************** ==== AMREV-HESSIANS Mailing List ==== The subject of this list - Hessian Soldiers of the American Revolution No other wars - no other German immigrants. Please stick to the subject. You can search the archives for a specific message or browse them, going from one message to another. To search: http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/?list=AMREV-HESSIANS To browse: http://archiver.rootsweb.com/AMREV-HESSIANS-L ============================== Search Family and Local Histories for stories about your family and the areas they lived. Over 85 million names added in the last 12 months. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13966/rd.ashx

Does anyone have a copy of "Notes on Hessian Solders Surnames beginning with S" by Clifford N. Smith? I'd like to know if my ancestor is listed before I try to hunt down a used copy to buy. Thanks, Suzanne --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour

Hello Hessians; I am invited to Hanau to meet the Landrat and some Buergermeisters, and so I am flying on 14.June with my grandson Pauli to Frankfurt. My good wife Emmi is in no shape to fly, and I am so sorry to have to go without her. Right now she is giving Pauli exact instructions how to look after me, when to take my pills, put my heart patches on, carry my bags, etc. Anyway, reason why I write - Is there anything I can show in Hanau in respect to my Hessian collection at the S.A.R. Library in Louisville, Ky. Pictures, webpages, leaflets, anything would be helpful. I do have the SAR Magazine with the article by Howard F. Horne, This was a real fine piece, and has had some good responses. Whatever I can get I would like to leave with the Hanau people, for their archives and collections. What I am really hoping for perhaps a picture of a Hessian descendant (or descendants) in front of the S.A.R. display. (How about Charles?) I will have a very hectic time between now and the time I leave, and over in Germany I'll have a full schedule, hardly will have time to come up to catch some breath, but with Pauli's help I hope to be able to manage. After all, my 81 years are definitely showing. Thanks in advance for all your help Btw. notice my new e-mail address - You know I did retire from the Hessians. Yours John Helmut Merz, Hamilton, Ontario, Canada jmerz@cogeco.ca

About Bones and Charnel Houses: I am reminded of my high school days and a line from Shakespeare's Hamlet: --From Hamlet (V, i, 203-204): "Alas, poor Yorick! I knew him, Horatio; a fellow of infinite jest, of most excellent fancy." (Often misquoted as 'Alas poor Yorick, I knew him well'). My English teacher said that it was common in Shakespeare's time to remove the bones from a grave after a few years, after the flesh was gone, (maybe ten years) and to store the bones in the church basement or a charnel house. This was to make room to bury another body. I was shocked at the time. Apparently, however, this was also commonly practiced and may still be practiced, from time to time, in America. HAMLET: Hamlet and Horatio come upon the grave of Ophelia, who killed herself after having gone mad. Hamlet is angry over the nonchalant way the two grave-diggers go about their job, singing and bantering while they dig. One of them digs up a skull that belonged to Hamlet's father's jester, Yorick. (The jester's bones were to be removed to the charnel house).Hamlet takes the skull in hand, and this ignites his thoughts on death and the ultimate and inescapable destruction of even the most powerful people. (from: http://www.allshakespeare.com/quotes/305) "Alas, poor Yorick! I knew him, Horatio: a fellow of infinite jest, of most excellent fancy: he hath borne me on his back a thousand times; and now, how abhorred in my imagination it is! my gorge rims at it. Here hung those lips that I have kissed I know not how oft. Where be your gibes now? your gambols? your songs? your flashes of merriment, that were wont to set the table on a roar? Not one now, to mock your own grinning? quite chap-fallen? Now get you to my lady's chamber, and tell her, let her paint an inch thick, to this favour she must come; make her laugh at that. Prithee, Horatio, tell me one thing". (From: http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/25500.html)

Hi, Bob and George, Thank you, the description of the sign and what each section/word meat is exactly what I needed. It has been years since I was in Germany (1985) but I'm glad I remembered it was like a city limits sign in the USA. The description or explanation of the burial proceedures helped too.. Thank you Nelda Nelda L. Percival nee Gilpin, IBSSG http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~bonsteinandgilpin/ http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~gillock/ http://freepages.history.rootsweb.com

On 11 May 2005 at 5:07, you sent the following: <snip> > > Schwalm - Eder - Kreis > This is an area in Germany. Frielendorf is inside it. It is the Schwalm - Eder > Circle (kreis means circle). "Kreis" also means "district"--probably similar in derivation from 'circle' to our word for a legal district: 'circuit' George McCallum ARM Computer Techniques Inc., 134 Manor Road East, Toronto, Canada M4S 2A3 (tel) 416-488-1757 (fax) 416-488-1758 (email) gmc@armct.com

> Grossropperhausen This is an area or city part in Germany. There is also a Ropperhausen. My German is downhill from earlier in life. > Gemeinde - Means Municipality or Community or something like that > Freelendorf A city in Germany. This web site (auf Deutsch!) http://www.hessennet.de/Frielendorf/ has the tag line in it "Gemeinde Frielendorf". I assume Freelendorf was a misspelling on your part. If not, nevermind this comment! > Schwalm - Eder - Kreis This is an area in Germany. Frielendorf is inside it. It is the Schwalm - Eder Circle (kreis means circle). This area is in the northern part of Hessen. Frielendorf is about 30 miles due south of Kassel and north northwest of Frankfort am Main. That puts it in the center left of Germany. What this sounds like to me is a sign with location designations of greater and greater area. In the US, that might be like neighborhood, city, county, state. I hope somebody else can confirm or deny my speculations here. I'd say this is not a street sign but a city marker. Craig Reges gggg grandson of Johann Phillip Reges

The old remains usually go to a charnel house or to a basement of a church. Under the floor of St. Stephen's Cathedral in Vienna, there are thousands of bones disinterred from Catholic cemeteries in the diocese. Sometimes the old bones (skulls) are carefully marked with a number identifying the deceased and placed artfully in a church basement/crypt. I suddenly came nose to nose with some of these in the dark in an old church crypt. It's very systematic in the Germanic countries. Don Fehlings Renton, Washington, USA Tel: 425/255-8588 Dfehlings@aol.com

You are correct. This is a roadside sign for a German town (Grossropperhausen), it's district (Gemeinde Freelendorf) and county (Schwalm-Eder Kreis). All towns have these on the approach roads. Black block letters on a yellow sign. Don Fehlings Renton, Washington, USA Tel: 425/255-8588 Dfehlings@aol.com

Hi Don, Thank you... Some day we in the states may have to do this too... Its sort of sad to me... I'd love to be able to go to the cemetery and see the old tombstones of my family. A lot of researchers get thier info from old tombstones. I understand that the tombstones are used in many different ways... but, I understand the space problems with a country as old as the countries in Europe. again Thank you Nelda Nelda L. Percival nee Gilpin, IBSSG http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~bonsteinandgilpin/ http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~gillock/ http://freepages.history.rootsweb.com/~bonsteinandgilpin/

Hi, thank you ... both of you, now I can explain it on my site... I reciently was sent a picture of the sign and a picture of the family house, supposedly the one our Hessians lived in...Johann Jacob and Paulus Bonnstein. ( Bonstein in the states) One more question burial customs... I understand you don't buy a plot in the cemetery.. you rent it. If no one pays they remove the body and re rent the plot...Right? what happens to the old remains... where are they put? I'm trying to explain the process to other Americans... Nelda Nelda L. Percival nee Gilpin, IBSSG http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~bonsteinandgilpin/ http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~gillock/ http://freepages.history.rootsweb.com/~bonsteinandgilpin/

Hi, Can anyone tell me if this is a City sign or a street sign... My cousin sent me a picture of a Sign in Germany And She said it was a street sign but I think it is a City sign...Help? Grossropperhausen Gemeinde Freelendorf Schwalm - Eder - Kreis Those are the words on the sign.. Thank you nelda Nelda L. Percival nee Gilpin, IBSSG http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~bonsteinandgilpin/ http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~gillock/ http://freepages.history.rootsweb.com/~bonsteinandgilpin/

Hello Stephen: Thanks very much for your very interesting description of the Mason's and their early influence in America. I am vaguely aware of some of this history but not of all of it. Conrad was an active Mason at Winchester, Frederick Co., VA during his life there. Information on him was seen at the Handley Library in Winchester. There are copies of Masonic publications from which I extracted the sketchy information that I have. Mason's were influential in Winchester which is apparent from the family names of some of the most prominent families in the area which were affiliated with one or another of the Masonic organizations. I am not a Mason nor am I very familiar with them. However, in my boyhood I clearly remember that membership in a Masonic organization was considered to be a step up the social ladder for young men. I have theorized that the success of my ancestor, Conrad Kremer, at Winchester, was probably largely due to his Rev. War military service in Von Heer's company, his German origins among the large Winchester German community, his literacy, and his Masonic affiliations. Conrad seems to have played his hand quite successfully and left an honorable legacy to his children, and substantial inheritances as well. Not bad for a former Hessian mercenary. To this day, there are Kremer descendants at Winchester. Thanks again for sharing information with me. All the best, Don Fehlings Renton, Washington, USA Tel: 425/255-8588 Dfehlings@aol.com

Your reference that ?Conrad became a Mason in 1797; made Worshipful Master of Masons at Winchester on 20 Dec 1812?, is very interesting.Especially now that Freemasons have come under attack by Christian fundamentalist in England and fast becoming ?forbidden history? here in the United States due to the rise of the use of fundamental Christianity in American politics.Conrad was listed to be a member of a specific order or lodge known as the Knights Templar here in Virginia.They exist today. This lodge had many famous members of which the grandsons and great grandsons of the American forefathers belonged.Many of these men fought and died for the Confederate cause several wars later.There are still lodges here in the Virginia belonging to the sect of the Knights Templar where a Mason may be buried with a full Masonic funeral.The American War of Independence secured American liberty through the Masons.Washington and his closets generals were Masons.Two Englishmen, both officers,! both Masons ensured that two bridges were left unguarded for Washington?s troops to cross during bleak hours of the New York campaign.Ahh ? the history you don?t know - it?s far more interesting that the diatribe in history books. I wear a ring today handed down to me from my grandfather. It was given to him by his grandfather. It belonged to our Hessian soldier private Christian Schweinsberger. The Masonic compass is clearly recognizable behind the Hessian Lion. /R Stephen Washington, DC >-----Original Message----- >From: Dfehlings@aol.com [mailto:Dfehlings@aol.com] >Sent: Friday, April 29, 2005 11:08 PM >To: AMREV-HESSIANS-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [HESSIAN] German names > >We have an ancestor, Conrad Kremer, born about May of 1748 in Germany, who >appears to have been a Hessian soldier. There are several credible sources that >say that he was, but none give the regiment to which he was assigned nor his >date of capture by the Continental Army. > >The sources we have indicate that he deserted as a Hessian soldier from the >British Army, while a prisoner of war, and enlisted in the Continental Army >near Philadelphia in May 1777. He enlisted in Capt. Bartholomew Von Heer's >company of Colonel Thomas Proctor's Fourth Artillery Regiment, participated in the >Battles of Brandywine and Germantown, and encamped with his regiment at Valley >Forge. > >On 1 July 1778 he enlisted in Capt. Von Herr's newly authorized company of >Light Dragoons (the Marechausee Corps) having been recruited by Capt. Von Heer >to be Quartermaster Sergeant. He served in this capacity until his three year >term of enlistment expired and he was honorably discharged after the Battle of >Springfield (NJ) in July of 1780 in Pennsylvania. > >He next appears in Winchester, Frederick County, Virginia in local histories. >He became in succession, a Blue Dyer, and later the owner/proprietor of a >Winchester hotel that had a good reputation and a tavern. This hotel had a wagon >yard in the rear of the tavern. In 1798 he was licensed to operate a tavern on >Court House Avenue. In 1814 he was licensed to operate an ordinary. His land >where his hotel was situated was originally granted to John Michael Rutter by >Lord Fairfax on 15 May 1753, and conveyed to Conrad Kremer by deeds dated 20 >and 21 Feb 1786. Conrad became a Mason in 1797; made Worshipful Master of >Masons at Winchester on 20 Dec 1812. He was listed by the Knights Templars, a >Masonic organization, as Sir Conrad Kremer, Grand Warden, on 27 Nov 1823. He had a >Masonic funeral and a Christian burial at Mt. Hebron Cemetery at Winchester on >31 May 1837. > >Beginning 11 Mar 1790 he became Sergeant at Arms of the Corporation of >Winchester. In 1798 he also became Clerk of the Market of Winchester. In 1822 he >became the first Superintendent of Police of the City of Winchester. He owned >other property in Winchester and is recorded as a buyer and seller of several >tracts. He was on several occasions a bondsman. He transferred property to his >son's before his death. > >On 16 Mar 1784 he married Catherine Helfenstein, daughter of Major Peter >Phillip Helfenstein who helped to organize and became Executive Officer of the 8th >Virginia Continental Regiment (The German Regiment) commanded by Colonel >Muhlenburg. They had six children. > >He applied for a Revolutionary War soldiers pension on 3 Jun 1825 at >Winchester, and was twice awarded Pensions for $96.00 and $180.00 per annum, >respectively. > >Interestingly, though he was conversant with the law and familiar with his >entitlements, he never applied for a Rev. War bounty land grant. This suggests >that he did not have an entitlement to such a bounty land grant because he had >been a Hessian soldier in British service. Hessian officers who deserted did >have an entitlement, Hessian soldiers did not. > >There were very few Rev. War veterans at Winchester who knew of Conrad >Kremer's desertion from British service, as a Hessian soldier. However, one such >veteran did record his recollection of Conrad's Hessian service. Other Hessian >deserters also served in Von Herr's Marechausee Corps. And Conrad had a Lutheran >Bible, in German, printed in 1768 at Marburg which is still in the Kremer >family at Winchester. > >What we are now interested to know is in what Hessian regiment did Conrad >serve, and when, his date of capture, his home and parents in Germany, and any >other available information on him. > >Yes, I am familiar with the HETRINA studies but have found no listing for >him. By a process of elimination, if he deserted from British service and >enlisted in the American army near Philadelphia in May of 1777, there were some >possibilities from the captives at Trenton. British deserters serving as American >soldiers and recaptured by British forces were subject to immediate execution. >Names could have been changed to try to avoid easy identification. There were >Hessian captives named Conrath Kram and Krammel. > >Any information, ideas or theories would be most welcome. > >Don Fehlings > >Renton, Washington, USA >Tel: 425/255-8588 >Dfehlings@aol.com > > >==== AMREV-HESSIANS Mailing List ==== >HETRINA - "Hessische Truppen im Amerikanischen Unabhaengigkeitskrieg" >Six Volumes covering Hessen-Kassel, Hessen-Hanau, and Waldeck. >HETRINA does not cover Braunschweig/Brunswick, Ansbach-Bayreuth or Anhalt-Zerbst. Those are partly covered by other publications. >This list was started in 1998 by Johannes (John) Helmut Merz, and you will find his explanations about HETRINA in our mail list archives. > >============================== >View and search Historical Newspapers. Read about your ancestors, find >marriage announcements and more. Learn more: >http://www.ancestry.com/s13969/rd.ashx > >

Hi Stephen, May I write you off list with some questions about genealogy and the Masonic Order? And will you answer me off list? Thank you Nelda Nelda L. Percival nee Gilpin, IBSSG http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~bonsteinandgilpin/ http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~gillock/ http://freepages.history.rootsweb.com/~bonsteinandgilpin/

Hello, after 6 years here comes a response - but ... she has nothing new about this name Tiffaner/Tiffany. John Merz ----- Original Message ----- From: Genatree@aol.com To: hessian@sympatico.ca ; cmcalljr@yahoo.com Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2005 3:30 AM Subject: Re: Old email - April 1999 - Tiffaner. Good Morning Gentlemen, Re: Christopher Tiffaner/Tiffany I had forgotten my 1999 inquiry on the above - and am responding now only to say that, regretably, I have nothing more on him than I did at that point in time. My email address, however, remains the same: Genatree@aol.com Janet Delorey

Ron, I don't see no reason why your postings don't go through to the list, unless someone put you on the 'reject' list. In such case you would still be getting the regular mail, but your own would be blocked - better clear this up with the L.M. Cheers, John Merz ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron Ferry" <brothers3.rf@tds.net> To: <Dfehlings@aol.com> Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2005 8:58 AM > Hi Don. > > My e-mails to the Amrev-Hessian List don't get posted anymore > although I still receive them. So I'm writing to you directly. > > C.N.Smith's monographs show those you mention and the following. > I am not versed enough in their movements to say any more. > Perhaps a historian on the List could tell you more. > > Impressive early history you have on your grandfather. > > Regards, > Ron Ferry > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ron Ferry" <brothers3.rf@tds.net> > To: <AMREV-HESSIANS-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, April 29, 2005 9:56 PM > Subject: Re: [HESSIAN] German names....Kremer > > > C.N.Smith's Mono #3, part 2: > > > > Kram, Conrath, GR. > > No date, no location. (on Trenton prisoner list) > > Grenadier Reg. von Rall, Maj.Mathaeus Company. > > > #3, part 1: > > Rgmt. von Lossberg. Lieb Company > > No location. No date. > > Kramer, -- , [S] > > > Mono #5: > > 1st Batt., Hessen-Hanau Infantry Rgmt Erbprinz, Grenadier Co. > > 14 Dec 1782: > > Krammer, --, Rank 'P', sold as hired hand, 12 Sep 1782 (his first name was Jonas) > > > Same mono, Unit, Rgmt and Co.: > > Cramer, -- Rank 'P', Place of Residence- Schlüchtern. > > > Ron

We have an ancestor, Conrad Kremer, born about May of 1748 in Germany, who appears to have been a Hessian soldier. There are several credible sources that say that he was, but none give the regiment to which he was assigned nor his date of capture by the Continental Army. The sources we have indicate that he deserted as a Hessian soldier from the British Army, while a prisoner of war, and enlisted in the Continental Army near Philadelphia in May 1777. He enlisted in Capt. Bartholomew Von Heer's company of Colonel Thomas Proctor's Fourth Artillery Regiment, participated in the Battles of Brandywine and Germantown, and encamped with his regiment at Valley Forge. On 1 July 1778 he enlisted in Capt. Von Herr's newly authorized company of Light Dragoons (the Marechausee Corps) having been recruited by Capt. Von Heer to be Quartermaster Sergeant. He served in this capacity until his three year term of enlistment expired and he was honorably discharged after the Battle of Springfield (NJ) in July of 1780 in Pennsylvania. He next appears in Winchester, Frederick County, Virginia in local histories. He became in succession, a Blue Dyer, and later the owner/proprietor of a Winchester hotel that had a good reputation and a tavern. This hotel had a wagon yard in the rear of the tavern. In 1798 he was licensed to operate a tavern on Court House Avenue. In 1814 he was licensed to operate an ordinary. His land where his hotel was situated was originally granted to John Michael Rutter by Lord Fairfax on 15 May 1753, and conveyed to Conrad Kremer by deeds dated 20 and 21 Feb 1786. Conrad became a Mason in 1797; made Worshipful Master of Masons at Winchester on 20 Dec 1812. He was listed by the Knights Templars, a Masonic organization, as Sir Conrad Kremer, Grand Warden, on 27 Nov 1823. He had a Masonic funeral and a Christian burial at Mt. Hebron Cemetery at Winchester on 31 May 1837. Beginning 11 Mar 1790 he became Sergeant at Arms of the Corporation of Winchester. In 1798 he also became Clerk of the Market of Winchester. In 1822 he became the first Superintendent of Police of the City of Winchester. He owned other property in Winchester and is recorded as a buyer and seller of several tracts. He was on several occasions a bondsman. He transferred property to his son's before his death. On 16 Mar 1784 he married Catherine Helfenstein, daughter of Major Peter Phillip Helfenstein who helped to organize and became Executive Officer of the 8th Virginia Continental Regiment (The German Regiment) commanded by Colonel Muhlenburg. They had six children. He applied for a Revolutionary War soldiers pension on 3 Jun 1825 at Winchester, and was twice awarded Pensions for $96.00 and $180.00 per annum, respectively. Interestingly, though he was conversant with the law and familiar with his entitlements, he never applied for a Rev. War bounty land grant. This suggests that he did not have an entitlement to such a bounty land grant because he had been a Hessian soldier in British service. Hessian officers who deserted did have an entitlement, Hessian soldiers did not. There were very few Rev. War veterans at Winchester who knew of Conrad Kremer's desertion from British service, as a Hessian soldier. However, one such veteran did record his recollection of Conrad's Hessian service. Other Hessian deserters also served in Von Herr's Marechausee Corps. And Conrad had a Lutheran Bible, in German, printed in 1768 at Marburg which is still in the Kremer family at Winchester. What we are now interested to know is in what Hessian regiment did Conrad serve, and when, his date of capture, his home and parents in Germany, and any other available information on him. Yes, I am familiar with the HETRINA studies but have found no listing for him. By a process of elimination, if he deserted from British service and enlisted in the American army near Philadelphia in May of 1777, there were some possibilities from the captives at Trenton. British deserters serving as American soldiers and recaptured by British forces were subject to immediate execution. Names could have been changed to try to avoid easy identification. There were Hessian captives named Conrath Kram and Krammel. Any information, ideas or theories would be most welcome. Don Fehlings Renton, Washington, USA Tel: 425/255-8588 Dfehlings@aol.com

Thanks for the indenture info on the above. Initially, I had thought it might be Johannes WIlhelm Siebert of the vonWIssenbach troops. born Feb 1751 and deserted in l782 in Savanna GA. I have long suspected an indenture for him and have looked for an oath or citizenship application after that time, especially before l793 when WIlliam Severs born l752 married in Montgomery Co VA. If you know anyplace new to look for such I would be glad to pay for a search. Last time I visitied the SAR Library in Louisville they were getting a nice place for your collection and had it on display as a "New Acquisition". Glad to hear you are still active. William Severs l752 died at age l00 (If he is really the Hessian Johannes WIlhelm SIebert, he was really 101). I always thought it was due to those good German Genes. I found his family in Metzebach Germany but have been unable to trace a male relative to a living person. Recently I was able to match my own DNA to that of another person named Severs but unknown descendant of William Severs l752 and it matched proving that line to be desc from the same person. If I could find a living male from the family of Jost or Wilhelm SIebert of Metzebach born around l720 I could do a similar study and probably prove or disprove that line as a Hessian ancestor. Best Charles Severs Louisville, Ky

Hello Hessian Soldier Searchers; I was wondering if anybody is paying attention to my once in a while postings, and yesterday I got an answer in the mail - I did mention that I still had some Personal Data Files on my computer's hard drive, and here came a request if I had the name SEEBOLD somewhere. Did not take me long to find two similar names, and perhaps the one or other of you have more to it. 1. one is Konrad SIEBOLD, he belonged to the Hessen-Kassel Leib Infantry Regiment, 4. Comp., but he was listed as missing in DEc. 1777, and later as having died of sickness or accident in Oct. 1780. Somebody once asked me for a soldier Johan Conrad SILBAUGH, who was said to be born 12 Dec 1758 in Hettenhausen, Bavaria. Konrad Siebold was born in Heringen/Werra. 2. the more likely one in my opinion is the Hanau soldier Johannes SEYBOLD (or SEIBOLD), who was captured at Saratoga with the Hessen-Hanau Regiment Erbprinz, 4. Comp. and went along with the rest of the Burgoyne army to Boston and Virginia, and later back to Pennsylvania, etc. He is reported as having 'SOLD' himself on 10 Oct. 1782, meaning he indentured himself for three years to some farmer. Here we could use some more information, anyway, Duncan, thanks for the ten bucks, and your trust in me, but no guarantee that any of the two is the one you need :--), the PDF's are in the mail. Cheers, John Helmut Merz