I must respond! It is my firm belief that our history is not being adequately taught, at all levels in school. I hope that the DAR/SAR organizations are addressing this problem. It is easier to fight for a country, when you know why we are all here! It is easier to know where you are going, if you know where you have been! James Baker "James L. Stokes" wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "James L. Stokes" <jlstokes@supernet.com> > To: <Scrapcat2@aol.com> > Cc: <AMERICAN-REVOLUTION-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Tuesday, June 04, 2002 5:10 PM > Subject: DAR:Sar > > Just a reminder, the American revolution wasn't fought so people could > join the DAR or SAR. > Lets try not to trivialize it. > > Jim > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: <Scrapcat2@aol.com> > > To: <AMERICAN-REVOLUTION-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Monday, June 03, 2002 3:19 PM > > Subject: [A-REV] Re: Military Service & DAR > > > > > > > In a message dated 6/3/2002 12:03:26 PM Central Daylight Time, > > > AMERICAN-REVOLUTION-D-request@rootsweb.com writes: > > > > > > > > > > Remember, lots of ancestors in the Rev. War never saw military > service. > > > > They > > > > signed a petition, they gave money and aid to the War effort, they > were > > a > > > > local constable, etc. , You need to check with the NSDAR re this > > because > > > > their records will indicate what kind of service your ancestor > > performed. > > > > > > This is really good advice. There are a number of types of War effort > > > services performed by a Patirot that allows a descendant to join the DAR > > or > > > SAR. > > > > > > Carol > > > ==== AMERICAN-REVOLUTION Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > > > > > > ============================== > > > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy > records, > > go to: > > > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== AMERICAN-REVOLUTION Mailing List ==== > > ============================== > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237

----- Original Message ----- From: "James L. Stokes" <jlstokes@supernet.com> To: <Scrapcat2@aol.com> Cc: <AMERICAN-REVOLUTION-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 04, 2002 5:10 PM Subject: DAR:Sar Just a reminder, the American revolution wasn't fought so people could join the DAR or SAR. Lets try not to trivialize it. Jim > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <Scrapcat2@aol.com> > To: <AMERICAN-REVOLUTION-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Monday, June 03, 2002 3:19 PM > Subject: [A-REV] Re: Military Service & DAR > > > > In a message dated 6/3/2002 12:03:26 PM Central Daylight Time, > > AMERICAN-REVOLUTION-D-request@rootsweb.com writes: > > > > > > > Remember, lots of ancestors in the Rev. War never saw military service. > > > They > > > signed a petition, they gave money and aid to the War effort, they were > a > > > local constable, etc. , You need to check with the NSDAR re this > because > > > their records will indicate what kind of service your ancestor > performed. > > > > This is really good advice. There are a number of types of War effort > > services performed by a Patirot that allows a descendant to join the DAR > or > > SAR. > > > > Carol > > ==== AMERICAN-REVOLUTION Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > > ============================== > > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, > go to: > > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 > > > > > > >

Someone said: "...You are indeed correct. A Revolutionary Soldier had to live to a pretty ripe old age to get a pension..." This is purely and simply wrong. On August 26, 1776, the first pension legislation for the American colonies as a group was enacted. A resolution of the Continental Congress provided half pay for officers and enlisted men, including those on warships and armed vessels, who were disabled in the service of the United States and who were incapable of earning a living. The half pay was to continue for the duration of the disability. On May 15, 1778, another resolution provided half pay for 7 years after the conclusion of the war to all military officers who remained in the Continental service to the end of' the war. Enlisted men who continued to serve for the duration of the conflict were each to receive a gratuity of $80 after the war under the terms of the same enactment. The first national pension legislation for widows was a Continental Congress resolution of August 24, 1780, which offered the prospect of half pay for 7 years to widows and orphans of officers who met the requirements included in the terms of the resolution of May 15, 1778. On October 21, 1780, the Continental Congress resolution of May 15, 1778, was amended to provide half pay for life to officers after the war; but on March 22, 1783, the half-pay-for-life provision was changed to 5 years' full pay. Pension legislation during the Revolutionary War was designed to encourage enlistment and acceptance of commissions and to prevent desertion and resignation. After the war, pensions became a form of reward for services rendered. Both during and after the Revolution, the States as well as the U. S. Government awarded pensions based on participation in the conflict. Public acts, under which the majority of such pensions were authorized, encompassed large classes of veterans or their dependents who met common eligibility requirements. Private acts concerned specific individuals whose special services or circumstances merited consideration, but who could not be awarded pensions under existing public acts. Best regards, Ed -- For Revolutionary War information on the Internet, your first choice should be AMERICANREVOLUTION.ORG

Also have a rejected pension of someone who fought at Kings Mountain. Wonder if it was because he was fighting for the British.

One of my ancestor's widow applied for a pension and was denied...even though her brother ,a pensioner, testified regarding her husband's service.........a shame, since her husband did indeed serve in PA and VA...... now available in this day and age, his records are in the PA archives and I have a certificate of service from PA for him............I wonder how many failed to get a pension because of this?? It was a wonder that anyone was still alive to even offer any proof!

You are indeed correct. A Revolutionary Soldier had to live to a pretty ripe old age to get a pension and hopefully he retained his discharge paper. So many did not or else the paper was destroyed in a home fire and hence they lacked proof of service if no one was still alive could testify for them that they did serve. The widow usually was much younger than her husband and marriage records simply are non-existent in many states because they were not required. If they were lucky they had their family bible record and many of these were used to verify marriages and that is why we do not have them for our documentation. They would tear the pages from the bible and send them along with their application and then disappear. I do not know how many of these were recovered with applications and are now in DAR and SAR archives. Tree Mother ----- Original Message ----- From: MJK <lender@netrox.net> To: <AMERICAN-REVOLUTION-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 04, 2002 12:57 PM Subject: [A-REV] REJECTED PENSIONS > One of my ancestor's widow applied for a pension and was denied...even > though her brother ,a pensioner, testified regarding her husband's > service.........a shame, since her husband did indeed serve in PA and > VA...... > now available in this day and age, his records are in the PA archives and I > have a certificate of service from PA for him............I wonder how many > failed to get a pension because of this?? It was a wonder that anyone was > still alive to even offer any proof! > > > ==== AMERICAN-REVOLUTION Mailing List ==== > > > > ============================== > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 >

Greetings, MJK wrote: > It was a wonder that anyone was > still alive to even offer any proof! > Just to add another idea to the discussion ...... Within the past year a Pension Application was found at the Easton Library in PA. This Pension had been rejected for lack of the witnesses named in application. I have no idea if a copy is on file at any of the named places, SAR/DAR. What is interesting about this particular application is that it gives explicit information on the whereabouts of some of the men taken prisoner in the Battle of Brooklyn, LI, before they were taken to Halifax for service in the Royal Highland Emigrants, later known as the 84th Regiment. So, perhaps there are others which are part of the 'Special Collections' in the Libraries of our country. Regards, Jan

In a message dated 6/4/2002 3:03:24 AM Central Daylight Time, AMERICAN-REVOLUTION-D-request@rootsweb.com writes: > I was just pointing out that just because an ancestor isn't listed in > the DAR does not indicate that they didn't serve. I can prove descent > but somehow I don't think the DAR will take me......a gender thing I > think! Norb Norb and others.... are you aware that there is an SAR? Sons of the American Revolution. It is a fine group and very active. There's also a group for children... a wonderful way for kids to be involved in a very patriotic effort. I was impressed to learn that many DAR Chapters have annual Essay Contests to encourage young students. Carol

Don't forget to check your ancestor's name (various spellings) at the Pennsylvania State Archives Revolutionary War Military Abstract Card File. http://www.digitalarchives.state.pa.us/

Hello All: I received several requests for look-ups for ancestors' pension applications. I have not forgotten your requests even if I have not replied. I can make a special trip to the library to do Revolutionary Pension look-ups and make photocopies of the pages at 50 cents plus some postage for copies. After I find the record I will tell you how many pages are in the record and you can then send me the money to pay for these costs. I also do Revolutionary research for folks at the rate of $15.00 hour and furnish a report of all materials searched and copies of any documents found. This would cover military and patriotic services especially in SC and NC. I have done this for a few folks on the list and others and try to be a diligent about the research as if it were my own ancestor. I have a deep feeling of thankfulness to the men and women who created our country and want everyone possible to document their ancestors and get them into the SAR and DAR records. This past Saturday I ran out of time to search for all the ancestors pensions I received requests for. Have to work on my family too on that day so I thought a special trip may most beneficial to all of you. If you know definitely that your ancestor had military duty I will be glad to look up a pension application for him under his or his widow's name. We also have film for rejected pensions. That film covers people who did not serve enough time or served only in a local militia or a wife who cannot prove her marriage. I can look here also just in case. Would the people who are looking for ESTILL, TIMBERLAKE, and ELLIS contact me again in response to this message and the copying and charges. I am a DAR and am working on several more men whose relationship to me requires mended linkage after their descendants made the unfortunate mistake of going to Mississippi prior to and during the time of the War of 1812 and the burnt courthouse "plague" which seems to strike with regularity there. Tree Mother

----- Original Message ----- From: <PmpGenie@aol.com> > DAR approves new ancestors all the time. Just because your ancestor is not > in the Patriot Index is no reason not to apply. If you ancestor has valid > service, and your can document descent, you should join. That way all your > counsins can join, too. I was just pointing out that just because an ancestor isn't listed in the DAR does not indicate that they didn't serve. I can prove descent but somehow I don't think the DAR will take me......a gender thing I think! Norb

In a message dated 06/03/2002 6:49:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time, bankern@sunyit.edu writes: << I have at least 8 ancestors with known service in the American Revolution, two are pensioned. Only one (not pensioned) is found in the DAR. So don't give up just because your ancestor is not listed. Norb >> DAR approves new ancestors all the time. Just because your ancestor is not in the Patriot Index is no reason not to apply. If you ancestor has valid service, and your can document descent, you should join. That way all your counsins can join, too. I have several ancestors with valid service, but I can't sufficiently document the lineage. I continue to look for the missing link. So far I have 35 approved Revolutionary ancestors. I have LOTS of other ancestors, but I can't document from there to here. Phyllis in GA

In a message dated 06/03/2002 4:17:17 PM Eastern Daylight Time, lender@netrox.net writes: << Patriot Index listings for those who served but no one has joined DAR for those to date: my Philip Catt and Richard Shipp, for example....... >> No, that is not correct. The Patriot Index contains only those Revolutionary ancestors whose descendants have joined DAR. Phyllis

I have at least 8 ancestors with known service in the American Revolution, two are pensioned. Only one (not pensioned) is found in the DAR. So don't give up just because your ancestor is not listed. Norb > MJK wrote: > > > And, there are MANY who served, received pensions but are not listed by > > DAR.......I have the pension papers for our Anthony Kennon and he is not > > listed............

It's kind of hard now to even get supplemental ancestors as they are what about $30 or more each? Persons on SS certainly can't afford all that. I have 8 for supplementals (I already belong) but they will have to wait unless someone gives me money for a birthday present <grin> Antoinette (Tacoma, Washington) waughtel@oz.net ----- Original Message ----- From: <PmpGenie@aol.com> To: <AMERICAN-REVOLUTION-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, June 03, 2002 5:21 PM Subject: Re: [A-REV] DAR RECORDS > In a message dated 06/03/2002 6:49:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > bankern@sunyit.edu writes: > > << I have at least 8 ancestors with known service in the American > Revolution, two are pensioned. Only one (not pensioned) is found in > the DAR. So don't give up just because your ancestor is not listed. > > Norb >> > > DAR approves new ancestors all the time. Just because your ancestor is not > in the Patriot Index is no reason not to apply. If you ancestor has valid > service, and your can document descent, you should join. That way all your > counsins can join, too. > > I have several ancestors with valid service, but I can't sufficiently > document the lineage. I continue to look for the missing link. So far I > have 35 approved Revolutionary ancestors. I have LOTS of other ancestors, > but I can't document from there to here. > > Phyllis in GA > > > ==== AMERICAN-REVOLUTION Mailing List ==== > > > > ============================== > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 > >

Good information, Annie. Thanks. Paul of San Diego

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They also have the Patriot Index listings for those who served but no one has joined DAR for those to date: my Philip Catt and Richard Shipp, for example....... Michele

In order to be listed in DAR records, the person must have a descendant who joined DAR. Phyllis ----------- In a message dated Mon, 3 Jun 2002  3:44:10 PM Eastern Daylight Time, "MJK" <lender@netrox.net> writes: >And, there are MANY who served, received pensions but are not listed by >DAR.......I have the pension papers for our Anthony Kennon and he is not >listed............ > > >==== AMERICAN-REVOLUTION Mailing List ==== > > > >============================== >To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: >http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 > >

And, there are MANY who served, received pensions but are not listed by DAR.......I have the pension papers for our Anthony Kennon and he is not listed............