In message <73k245-6dv.ln1@remote.clifto.com> clifto <clifto@gmail.com> wrote: > Graeme Wall wrote: > > Would Estonia be listed as Russia in British Censuses? In the 1881 his > > birthplace is listed as Russia. > > I don't trust census-listed birthplaces. I have at least two relatives who > were born in a different place in every different census they're in. Me too, and what a hassle that was sorting it out! Just wondered whether it was normal to refer to the Baltic states as Russia then. -- Graeme Wall My genealogy website <www.greywall.demon.co.uk/genealogy>

On Dec 23, 12:14 pm, Mary_Gor...@tvo.org wrote: > So, your mother was born in 1926, which means sister Vienna was born > around 1936 or so, and died about 1960, which means BOTH were born too > late for Ontario internet access records - at this point, your best > bet is to get a copy of your mother's marriage or birth registrations > (for which you have to pay for from the provincial government) and > that will provide you with the names of both her parents. > > For next time,the timeline is crucial - when you ask questions give > all the details you know. Myself and other responders were looking for > information for you and supplied what we could find that turned out to > be totally off base (such as info from 1901 or 1911 census data) > because we did not know the timelines involved. The Vienna from the > earlier census may be an ancestor but she certainly isn't  your > mother's younger sister. > > M Any and all particles of information are most welcome, thank you for your help.Now I believe with such an unusual name as Vienna, these must be ancesters.

Merry Christmas & Blessed New Year to You & All Those Dear to You---- >From Texas to our newsgroup friends around the world--- Donna

On Sun, 23 Dec 2007 15:56:27 +0000, Graeme Wall <Graeme@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote: >Merry Christmas and Seasons Greetings to everyone, may your brick walls >crumble in 2008. > The same from me. I hope you all find those missing ancestors in 2008. I've just found the death (or at least the burial) date of my GGGGf after about 3 or 4 years searching :-) -- Frank Erskine

In message <13msmioqgib5q2f@corp.supernews.com> "CWatters" <colin.watters@turnersoak.plus.com> wrote: > > "Graeme Wall" <Graeme@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote in message > news:8689f554f%Graeme@greywall.demon.co.uk... > > > > > > > Marriages Dec 1899 (>99%) > > > > > > Buck Walter John T B.Stortford 3a947 > > > Godfrey Thomas De Breton B. Stortford 3a947 > > > Thickings Amy B Stortford 3a947 > > > Wall Ruth Mary A B. Stortford 3a947 > > > > > > Are you sure that's the same Ruth? > > > > > > > Yes for two reasons, first Ruth Mary Ann Wall appears to be a unique name, > > she's named after her paternal grandmother, Ruth Mary Ann Whitethorne. > > > > Secondly I've just been contacted by someone who is tracing the de Breton > > Godfrey connection. There's a family story of Thomas blowing his > > inheritance (an Irish estate) on fast living, abandoning his wife and two > > children, and running off to New York with a Ruth Baranoff. > > > > Should get the cert to check fathers name. > > Hopefully some time in the new year. -- Graeme Wall My genealogy website <www.greywall.demon.co.uk/genealogy>

Merry Christmas and Seasons Greetings to everyone, may your brick walls crumble in 2008. Many thanks to all those who have been so generous with their help. On-line card at <www.greywall.demon.co.uk/Xmas.html> -- Graeme Wall My genealogy website <www.greywall.demon.co.uk/genealogy>

Graeme Wall wrote: > Merry Christmas and Seasons Greetings to everyone, may your brick walls > crumble in 2008. > > Many thanks to all those who have been so generous with their help. > > On-line card at <www.greywall.demon.co.uk/Xmas.html> > And from me, Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays, or Sneezin's Greetings, as you prefer. May your week be wonderful and white ... and may your electric power stay on (an important point in some parts of the US right now). Cheryl

Graeme Wall wrote: > Would Estonia be listed as Russia in British Censuses? In the 1881 his > birthplace is listed as Russia. I don't trust census-listed birthplaces. I have at least two relatives who were born in a different place in every different census they're in. I also have lots whose parents switch birthplaces from census to census. -- Dec. 6 (Bloomberg) -- Government officials and activists flying to Bali, Indonesia, for the United Nations meeting on climate change will cause as much pollution as 20,000 cars in a year.

In article <e51sm3hh5r8cfvpmf9qncvsum8bfr86gsc@4ax.com>, hayesmstw@hotmail.com says... > TV news is reporting that for the third time in as many months important data > about British citizens have gone missing from government departments. > > It's all getting a bit much -- haven't British civil servants ever heard of > backups? > I think you'll find that the data hasn't been 'lost' as such, just a copy or backup of the original data. UK media doesn't seem to care about the subtle distinction. I think, that if the fuzz went to some low-grade civil servant's house, they'd find the disks being used as a coaster! -- Regards, Mike Fry Johannesburg.

"Steve Hayes" <hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:e51sm3hh5r8cfvpmf9qncvsum8bfr86gsc@4ax.com... > TV news is reporting that for the third time in as many months important > data > about British citizens have gone missing from government departments. > > It's all getting a bit much -- haven't British civil servants ever heard > of > backups? > It's not the main copies of the data that's gone missiing. It's working copies sent out because the info isn't processed where it's stored. They're getting into a tiz because of issues of trust, general incompetence and identity theft. Lesley Robertson

Any info on surname Cawthorne of England

So, your mother was born in 1926, which means sister Vienna was born around 1936 or so, and died about 1960, which means BOTH were born too late for Ontario internet access records - at this point, your best bet is to get a copy of your mother's marriage or birth registrations (for which you have to pay for from the provincial government) and that will provide you with the names of both her parents. For next time,the timeline is crucial - when you ask questions give all the details you know. Myself and other responders were looking for information for you and supplied what we could find that turned out to be totally off base (such as info from 1901 or 1911 census data) because we did not know the timelines involved. The Vienna from the earlier census may be an ancestor but she certainly isn't your mother's younger sister. M

In message <e51sm3hh5r8cfvpmf9qncvsum8bfr86gsc@4ax.com> Steve Hayes <hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote: > TV news is reporting that for the third time in as many months important > data about British citizens have gone missing from government departments. > > It's all getting a bit much -- haven't British civil servants ever heard of > backups? Back-ups isn't the problem, the problem is that confidential data is being mishandled on an epic scale by a government that wants to bring in the most draconian ID card legislation on the planet. What is going astray is copies of the data being transferred between departments or other agencies. The government still has the data but now, potentially, does every crook in the world. -- Graeme Wall My genealogy website <www.greywall.demon.co.uk/genealogy>

In message <13mr2a19ubdpda4@corp.supernews.com> "CWatters" <colin.watters@turnersoak.plus.com> wrote: > > "CWatters" <colin.watters@turnersoak.plus.com> wrote in message > news:13mr0dhfrjc1o9e@corp.supernews.com... > > Then Ruth Hall married Constantin BARANOFF in London... > > > > Marriages Sep 1881 (>99%) > > **BARANOFF Constantin Pancras 1b319 > > FLOWERS Julia Pancras 1b319 > > Raison William Pancras 1b319 > > **WALL Ruth Mary A Pancras 1b319 > > and they had a son so it looks like a possible shotgun wedding. That's my suspicion :-) > > Births Jun 1882 (>99%) > Baranoff Constantin William Pancras 1b165 > > before Constantin runs off and gets married again in NY in 1888 and Ruth > marries in Bishops Stortford in 1889? > > Ok so far I think.. I'm with you up to there. As I said the son appears to be with his widowed grandmother in 1901, enumerated as William Wall. > > Now Ancestry has him (?) going to California.. > > Constantin Baranoff > California Passenger and Crew Lists, 1893-1957 > Immigration & Emigration > Port of Arrival: San Francisco, California > > and > > U.S. Public Records Index > Directories & Member Lists > Name: Constantin Baranoff > Residence: city, Sacramento, California > Very interesting, I note he's lost the 'von'. Many thanks for that. -- Graeme Wall My genealogy website <www.greywall.demon.co.uk/genealogy>

In message <13mr0dhfrjc1o9e@corp.supernews.com> "CWatters" <colin.watters@turnersoak.plus.com> wrote: > > "Graeme Wall" <Graeme@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote in message > news:292440554f%Graeme@greywall.demon.co.uk... > > Could someone do a look up for me in New Yoek in 1900. > > > > I'm looking for a Thomas de Breton Godfrey and his wife Ruth Mary Ann > (nee > > Wall formerly Baranoff). > > Let me see if I follow this... > > Here they are in 1881.. > > Household Record 1881 British Census > Search results | Download Previous Household Next Household > Household: > Name RelationMarital StatusGenderAgeBirthplaceOccupationDisability > William WALL Head M Male 59 London, Middlesex, England Retired Clerk > Maria WALL Wife M Female 50 London, Middlesex, England > Maria R. WALL Daur U Female 19 London, Middlesex, England Governess > Ruth M. WALL Daur U Female 18 London, Middlesex, England Governess > Elizabeth WALL Daur Female 14 London, Middlesex, England Scholar > Constantin BARANOFF Lodger U Male 24 Nat B Subject, Russia Generl > Clerk > Source Information: > Dwelling 109 Mansfield Rd > Census PlaceLondon, Middlesex, England > Family History Library Film 1341048 > Public Records Office Reference RG11 > Piece / Folio 0219 / 74 > Page Number 62 That's the family, marrying the lodger seems to have been a habit, Maria Ruth married the lodger 10 years later. Their father was a lodger when he married his landlady, a wealthy widow! > > Then Ruth Hall married Constantin BARANOFF in London... > > Marriages Sep 1881 (>99%) > **BARANOFF Constantin Pancras 1b319 > FLOWERS Julia Pancras 1b319 > Raison William Pancras 1b319 > **WALL Ruth Mary A Pancras 1b319 That's them > > Then she married Thomas De Breton Godfrey > > Marriages Dec 1899 (>99%) > > Buck Walter John T B.Stortford 3a947 > Godfrey Thomas De Breton B. Stortford 3a947 > Thickings Amy B Stortford 3a947 > Wall Ruth Mary A B. Stortford 3a947 > > Are you sure that's the same Ruth? > Yes for two reasons, first Ruth Mary Ann Wall appears to be a unique name, she's named after her paternal grandmother, Ruth Mary Ann Whitethorne. Secondly I've just been contacted by someone who is tracing the de Breton Godfrey connection. There's a family story of Thomas blowing his inheritance (an Irish estate) on fast living, abandoning his wife and two children, and running off to New York with a Ruth Baranoff. -- Graeme Wall My genealogy website <www.greywall.demon.co.uk/genealogy>

In message <13mqvjf21ub7e9b@corp.supernews.com> "CWatters" <colin.watters@turnersoak.plus.com> wrote: > > "Graeme Wall" <Graeme@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote in message > news:292440554f%Graeme@greywall.demon.co.uk... > > Could someone do a look up for me in New Yoek in 1900. > > > > I'm looking for a Thomas de Breton Godfrey and his wife Ruth Mary Ann > > (nee Wall formerly Baranoff). Tney married in England in 1898 and are > > thought to have gone to New York shortly after. Either or both of them > > may have been bigamously married! > > > > Also can anyone find a Constantin Baranoff, also in New York. > > Looks like married in NY.. > > IGI Individual RecordFamilySearch™ International Genealogical Index v5.0 > North America Search Results | Download Constantin V. Th. von Baranoff > Pedigree > Male Family Event(s): Birth: Balgi, , Estonia, Ussr Christening: Death: > Burial: Parents: > Father: John von Baranoff Family > Mother: Eveline Marg. Maranuskill > Marriages: > Spouse: Katie Nietert Family > Marriage: 30 NOV 1888 Manhattan, New York, New York > Messages: > Extracted marriage record for locality listed in the record. The source > records are usually arranged chronologically by the marriage date. > Source Information: > Batch No.: Dates: Source Call No.: Type: Printout Call No.: Type: > > M004997 Film > If that's my bloke he's gained a 'von'. That wouldn't surprise me. Would Estonia be listed as Russia in British Censuses? In the 1881 his birthplace is listed as Russia. Thanks Colin -- Graeme Wall My genealogy website <www.greywall.demon.co.uk/genealogy>

On Sun, 23 Dec 2007 08:50:55 +0200, Steve Hayes <hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote: >TV news is reporting that for the third time in as many months important data >about British citizens have gone missing from government departments. > >It's all getting a bit much -- haven't British civil servants ever heard of >backups? It's not just the matter of losing the data - it's more a matter of data falling into the wrong hands. -- Frank Erskine

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On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 12:33:39 -0800, jj206 <jj206@remoooooooooooovethisdrizzle.com> wrote: >Michelle, Sabrina's Mom wrote: >> Excuse my ignorance on the subject. But I was wondering, if you were 15 in >> 1870, living in Massachusetts, when you became legal age, would you have had >> to register for a draft or would going into the military be voluntary? >> Thanks, >> Michelle >Keep in mind that not everyone knew their age back then. >Also kids lied about their age so they could fight along >side their fathers, cousins, uncles, friends, etc... >Genealogy is an art not a science, although with dna >matching, it might be getting half and half. *smile* The answer is no. There was no peace time draft until about 1940 and that was really in anticipation of WW II. Before that the only draft was the Civil War in 1862 (Confed) and 1863 (Union). A permanent peace-time as well as war-time office of Selective Service or its equivilant did not exist until 1940. The large standing army that required draftees is purely a Cold War phenomenon.

Hello Cathy, Thank You. Ever little bit helps. Ancestry's copy must be a little better in this case. Any who, this is my 3 GGF to me. Josephine is a daughter. Ann may be George Ann, another daughter, given the possible DOB. Both Husband and mother were born in PA. Thanks again 8>) Mike in Ohio Huntersglenn wrote: > The bottom of the page is pretty messed up. I can make out that the > bottom name is Josephine, born Aug, but not the year or her age. The > one above her looks to be a two-name person - something Ann. May 1881, > aged 19. > > Jacob and Mary had been married 40 years, she's had 12 children and 10 > are still alive. They were both born in 1841 - he in January and her in > September, and I have no clue as to what the enumerator (or his > assistant) was trying to write in for their place of birth - I'm > thinking it's supposed to be Pennsylvania, but... > > Hope that helps, > Cathy > > Michael Kenefick wrote: > >> Hello SKSs, >> >> Is the Ancestry copy of 1900 Warren Township, Jefferson, Ohio Census >> Series: T623 Roll: 1290 Page: 199 lines 95?-100 as bad as the >> Heritagequest.com copy. This is the last family on the sheet. I >> could not find the family via name search but the head (should be) is >> Jacob Starr, Wife Margaret A., Cleveland and some other children(?). >> >> I cannot access ancestry images links. >> >> Mike in Ohio >> kenefick at copper dot net >>