Brian, Thank you for setting the record straight. Yes, the little fish example is absolutely correct. I was just using a generalization to answer the question as to whether the suetterlinschrift site would be helpful. I assure you what I don't know about the German language and its written variants would fill an ocean. As you suggested it is a learnable skill and I hope to get better at it. I was very pleased with the suetterlinschrift sites you sent. They will be very helpful to us as we continue to work on a particularly difficult translation. Thank you for sharing the useful information. I hope you will allow me to keep your email address handily in case I have something I need advice on. Best Regards, Auf Wiedersehen, Linda P.S. Do you have the name of the Edna Bentz book. I would like to order one. On 2/13/13 5:43 PM, "Brian J Densmore" <brian@amason.net> wrote: >On Wed, February 13, 2013 11:49 am, Linda Passwaters wrote: >> Greetings, >> >> You must have some knowledge of German in order for it to work for you. >>My >I'm not sure how correct that is. But I have no ruler to measure it by. >I've studied a dozen languages, and so am ill qualified to say it isn't >so. >Certainly it helps, but having a German dictionary handy and a few >learning tools one can learn quite easily the basic to decipher much of >what one will find in vital records. I would certainly not discourage >someone by telling them they must have German knowledge to proceed. The >brain is an amazingly agile tool. Often neglected for years and decades. > >> Mom is 86 and can read Sutterlin, but the German written word back in >>the >> 1800s is like us trying to read very old English today. You must have an >I find Old English fairly easy to read. but then, I'm a geek. > >> For example, >> Mom is currently trying to translate a document that has the name, "von >> Steiger" in the first line. The sutterlinschrift for an "S" looks very >> much like our English "G". So as an English speaking person I would >>assume >> the name is "von Geiger". There are many differences that with a little >> time and patience a person might be able to translate. Using the >> Sutterlinschrift chart can be helpful in determining if document refers >>to >> the correct family name. >That is not completely accurate. The sutterlinschrift "S" CAN look like a >"G". It usually looks like a fish standing on it's head. Although, it can >also look like a musical clef sign. Sutterlinschrift is also mostly a >misnomer, as the actual sutterlinschrift name didn't come into use until >very late, in an attempt to standardize the various forms of German script >writing. > >I find these two pages much more useful in deciphering German writing. > >Upper case examples: >http://www.suetterlinschrift.de/Lese/Kanzlei2.htm > >lower case examples: >http://www.suetterlinschrift.de/Lese/Kanzlei1.htm > >I find it best when tackling a hard to read text is to make a table, and >copy down a sample of each letter of the alphabet in the text. I rarely >use such a technique anymore, but it's a useful learning aid. Names and >dates are usually not too difficult to extract. Edna Bentz' book has an >extensive listing of professions, diseases and causes of death and some >standard wording used. There are some very complete German genealogical >dictionaries and the Familysearch website has still further tools. > >This is a totally learnable skill that should be encouraged among amateur >genealogists working records in Alsace and Germany, et al. > >I do use a table and letter example when working with Dutch and sometimes >Danish, but only because I do so little work in Dutch and Dutch is often >very sloppy and really, really hard. It can be done though. Yet, I still >make mistakes, and I sometimes disagree with some of our very skilled >German script readers here on a particular letter. Sometimes even when I'm >wrong. ;) > >Brian > > >-- >Resources for Alsace-Lorraine list members: >http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~valorie/Alsace-Lorraine-L.htm > > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >ALSACE-LORRAINE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without >the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

The following link leads to information about how the script form of the letters has changed with time from 1580 to 1935 with entries about each 50 years. https://www.familysearch.org/learn/wiki/en/Czech_Republic_Language_and_Languages Under "Language Aids" click the 2 links at "See the examples of the Czech Script Alphabet at a to m n to z " Henry Kuska

On Wed, February 13, 2013 2:36 pm, Linda Passwaters wrote: > Brian, > > Thank you for setting the record straight. Yes, the little fish example is > absolutely correct. I was just using a generalization to answer the > question as to whether the suetterlinschrift site would be helpful. I > assure you what I don't know about the German language and its written > variants would fill an ocean. As you suggested it is a learnable skill and > I hope to get better at it. I was very pleased with the suetterlinschrift > sites you sent. They will be very helpful to us as we continue to work on > a particularly difficult translation. Thank you for sharing the useful > information. I hope you will allow me to keep your email address handily > in case I have something I need advice on. No problem. What I don't know about German script would only fill the Great Lakes. So I'm happy to help where I can. I'm actually pretty good with the script, but do make rare mistakes on a letter or two. Ewald and Etienne have both corrected me from time to time, although there is one record which we dispute what it says. But then I still make mistakes on some French documents, and many on my Aunt's English handwriting. But she's an atrocious speller too! > > Best Regards, > > Auf Wiedersehen, > > Linda > > P.S. Do you have the name of the Edna Bentz book. I would like to order > one. "If I Can, You Can Decipher German Records" Edna died several years back and one of her children continued selling them (after getting numerous requests). She used to sell them for $5, but they are now $17 (or more if you are unlucky). The St. Louis Genealogy Society sells them for $17 if you have a hard time finding a copy. I never did buy one, having multiple copies in my local library. Even at $17 you might it's worth having. Not for me, as I can always check one out or use the reference version if I need it. It was very handy when I first started doing it. I had meant to buy a copy when they were $5. Best regards, Brian Please don't be put off, if I sometimes come across as crash, harsh, rude, impolite, or brusque. It's the medium. Writing is so impersonal, and rarely captures my rather twisted, demented, Irish/German/Alsatian, lighthearted, politically-incorrect, Dickensonian humor. I've had many people want to punch my lights out, I think, because my words don't always match up with what I'm trying to say. Not to mention, I'm often busy and may over simplify an email or flood with with wandering, scattered, disconnected thoughts. Like now. ;)