I live in Virginia and my family has been here for over 300 years. Virginia had many "begats" with counties, in time one county was split into another, which later became another, etc. It can get very confusing for genealogists who are not aware of all the boundary and name changes. They can be looking in County A records, when the person was born when it was County A, died when that particular area became County B, and so those records are in another county entirely. And yet the person, with records in several counties, never physically moved from the same area their entire lives. Here, we list the person's vital dates as in the named county it was WHEN that event happened. That's where the records are. I think in the Alsace Lorraine area, when a living person was trying to keep on top of political changes at the time by giving different locality names to various officials is one thing; but the fact doesn't change that they were born in a particular place when it was under control of a particular country. I think, too, that keeps it simple for future genealogists; they will know that So-and-so, born in 1742 in This Locality, it would have, AT THAT TIME, been under control of This Country. To try to go beyond that gets too confusing, in one's mind and on paper, IMO. Nancy ------- I was never lost, but I was bewildered once for three days. --Daniel Boone On Feb 8, 2008, at 7:42 PM, Howard Kuhn wrote: > It is not always easy to identity and properly record the country > of origin for our ancestors—especially when they are born near the > sometimes fluid borders of a country.. > > My great grandfather Nikolaus was born in a village near > Wadgassen, in what is today the German state of Saarland—but in the > not-too-distant past I believe Wadgassen was considered part of > Alsace. We have traced Nikolaus’s progenitors to the 16th century, > with much help from a generous, living German relative. The > ancestors of Nikolaus nearly all originated in a half dozen > villages surrounding Wadgassen—Friedrichsweiler, Differten, > Hostenbach, Werbeln, Schaffhausen, Ludweiler, and others. > > My question is this: In my genealogy records, what do I list as > their respective countries of origin? Germany? France? Prussia? > Do I list their district as Saarland—or Alsace—or sometimes > Rheinland? Do I have to carefully determine political control at > the time of our ancestors’ respective births and deaths? I am > guessing that there are issues of political correctness here. > > Another great grandfather, Anton, was born in Schoenenbourg, > Alsace, in 1821, and he immigrated to the U.S. about 1840. In > subsequent census reports in the United States, he would report his > country of origin as France or Prussia or Germany, depending on the > politics of the decade. (Anton also used the names Anthony and > Antoine, depending on the venue.) Do we as proper genealogists > have to do a similar dance? > > If so, we would probably have to follow this little menu (which I > frankly find burdensome): > > Political affiliations of Wadgassen and the modern state of > Saarland, Germany (in broad and general terms): > Before 1684, Germany, Holy Roman Empire > 1684-1780: France; end of Thirty Years War brings French control > 1871-1919: Prussia; end of Franco-Prussian War brings German > rule > 1919-1935: France; settlement after World War I reverts land > to French control > 1935-1945: Germany; formation of Third Reich; World War II > 1945-1957: France; settlement after World War II brings > degree of French control > 1957-2008: Germany; plebiscite actually creates a state > called Saarland, with German control > > To repeat: how do I properly list the country of origin for the > progenitors of Nikolaus and Anton? I suppose I should know the > answer, but I don’t. > > Americans face the same problem when ancestors originate in > Fayette County, Virginia—prior to the Civil War—and later ancestors > originate in Fayette County, West Virginia—and all are born in the > same community of Fayetteville. And we face the same problem for > families with some ancestors who were born in the Dakota Territory, > and the somewhat later descendants who may have been born in the > same community which later becomes a city in North Dakota. When we > create our genealogical records, do we have to do the same > manipulation of geographical names in these cases, too? > > I would appreciate your thoughts on the matter. > Howard Kuhn, hkuhn38@yahoo.com > > > --------------------------------- > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. > Try it now. > -- > Resources for Alsace-Lorraine list members: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~valorie/Alsace-Lorraine-L.htm > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ALSACE- > LORRAINE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message