Hi Pam, If no one on the list knows, then my suggestion would be to write to the Archivist at the Haut-Rhin Archives and ask that question. See below. http://www.archives.cg68.fr/Informations_Contact.aspx I had a minor problem with missing census pages for a Bas-Rhin village, e-mailed the Archivist and within a couple of days received a response that it would be corrected in July. And for those, as I am, interested in Bas-Rhin notary records the response was that they are understaffed and lack finances to scan those documents. And so there are no plans to include them in the foreseeable future. We need a wealthy benefactor to help finance this project. Charlie Homosassa, FL

First, I've not seen any plans posted on the Haut-Rhin Archives website to do the census records. They haven't even done the Parish Registers yet. On the wealthy benefactor idea. It doesn't take that. A single person could build an apparatus to hold the books gently without damaging them and also to gently hold the pages "flat", and be able to photograph them with a digital camera. This could be done for under $30. Any decent digital camera would work for taking the pictures. With this apparatus, a person could scan 300 pages a day. I've done that much and more. Not sure if they'd let a volunteer do that. Just saying, it could be done cheaply. Now of course for anyone here in the states wanting to volunteer for such a task it would mean a not cheap travel expense, and likely an expense for bringing the apparatus (there are plans for one on the Internet). Although Bas-Rhin might have their own better equipment. I'm surprised almost none of these bodies think to ask for qualified volunteers. They lose out on the whole "commons" idea. The driving force that has turned a single student's personal project into a world-wide phenomenon and a major competitor to Microsoft (ie Linux). I know that someone was at my local genealogy library scanning books. Not sure if he was a volunteer or paid professional. But there are countless amateur and professional genealogists who would likely donate hours to do some scanning. These projects often have one person doing scanning for years, as part of their regular duties. With a few dozen volunteers, such projects could be done in months or even less. Think about it: 1) 24 volunteers 2) 24 cameras 3) 24 scanning platforms 4) 150 pages per seven hour day (being ultra conservative 3+ minutes/page) = 3600 pages/day I generally average about 70-90 pages/hour, or 490-630 pages/day. Using that figure, a realistic goal for 24 volunteers in a day is 10000. How many pages in a notary per town on average x 600 towns? Say 100? If my figure is close 600x100 = 6000 pages or about half a day for 24 volunteers. Even at a 1000 pages that's 5 days. For an employee of Bas-Rhin/Haut-Rhin that's probably 2 hours a days for a whole year. As a comparison, a small town (500-4000), I've done, contains about 3000 "pages" (ie both leaves) for 150 years of registers (BMD). About 6 days work for me. This is how the FHL is able to digitize all these millions of records. Think how much more time-consuming it is to transcribe than it is to turn a page and take 1 or 2 pictures. Brian On Sun, June 12, 2011 10:30 am, Charlie Sheridan wrote: > Hi Pam, > > If no one on the list knows, then my suggestion would be to write to the > Archivist at the Haut-Rhin Archives and ask that question. See below. > > http://www.archives.cg68.fr/Informations_Contact.aspx > > > I had a minor problem with missing census pages for a Bas-Rhin village, > e-mailed the Archivist and within a couple of days received a response > that > it would be corrected in July. > > And for those, as I am, interested in Bas-Rhin notary records the response > was that they are understaffed and lack finances to scan those documents. > And so there are no plans to include them in the foreseeable future. > We need a wealthy benefactor to help finance this project. > > Charlie > Homosassa, FL > > > > > -- > Resources for Alsace-Lorraine list members: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~valorie/Alsace-Lorraine-L.htm > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

Fellow members. I don't enjoy having disagreements at your expense but believe I must answer Brian's comments on my statement "wealthy benefactor idea" that refers to notary records being scanned. My comment was only a passing dream that might resolve the issue in my lifetime. Hopefully it won't cause any hard feelings. I don't know what personal experience Brian has had with the Bas-Rhin Archives but I've been there 2 or 3 times and cannot even conjecture on just what they are capable of doing without financial assistance. The notary records I've seen are not in registers like the vital stat documents. They are original documents and I believe they were located in folders or binders. They must be handled carefully and it is better to have one who is knowledgeable of the language of the records with a helper to keep the pages from rolling up. Thanks to an Alsatian friend I have several ancestral documents that she photographed for me. And how many documents are there? I have 5 ancestral documents - one has 2 pages; another 12 pages; one with 19 pages and two others with 36 & 37 pages. That was just 3 people. How many other documents just for these ancestors exist. What years would be covered, what transactions required a notary, etc.? Documents could be in the hundreds of thousands just for Bas-Rhin. Or perhaps that's an exaggeration - it's just a guesstimate. I believe only the Archivist is in the position to make any calls on just when and how notary records will be scanned & if that's feasible in the foreseeable future. An acquaintance once was the ass't director but he has relocated to greener pastures. Apparently Brian has vast experience on scanning and/or filming documents but he fails to take into consideration that you still need the assets to purchase the equipment, the facilities to house them and staff that can put them into a searchable order that includes the names of those who are signatories to the document & their village; the notary and possibly his village; type of document; item number; date, etc. In one of my 2 Alsatian extraction databases and it depends on the event I am researching I can do an easy search of between 25 & 60 items that have been entered. I have some experience having extracted over 60,000 Latin & French documents; photocopied & digitally photographed thousands of documents from original church & civil registers in Alsace; and digitally photographed perhaps thousands of documents taken from the LDS films at a FHC. It is a strain on the eyes; difficult on the feet and back; can be boring and lends itself to errors if one is not concentrating, and of course the image must be in focus. It really helps if the distractions are kept to a minimum. Just look at some of the Ancestry.com info where people have misread a document entering erroneous info or even the LDS films where some documents are missed or the person doing the microfilming lost track and duplicated or even triplicated his/her efforts or the images are too light or dark. And if possible the equipment, and maybe they have it, should be top of the line. And if they don't have it then as I suggested, a wealthy benefactor would indeed serve the purpose. LDS has fabulous resources that I'm sure the Archives wish they had available. It's not just getting volunteers but even a dedicated volunteer needs to be trained and to some extent supervised. And I wonder how many professional or even amateur genealogists would volunteer many hours when esp. the professional could be giving up actual paid research. And how many of those live in the Colmar or Strasbourg area. I know that there are dedicated genealogists who do extractions in areas of Bas-Rhin but could those Alsatians be persuaded to delay their own work. To me it sounds what Brian suggests is called here in the States "piece work" - one is paid by the number of pieces of a product one completes in a day. He does not take into consideration that volunteers or paid workers are not machines and each should work at a fair pace. That as great as volunteers are they are free to come and go or work when they can. Lots of projects look feasible on paper but often there are obstacles that are encountered when works begins. If Brian feels that he could obtain permission to lead a team to institute said project in the Bas-Rhin or Haut-Rhin Archives I'm sure he would have our blessings. Quote from Brian: 'As a comparison, a small town (500-4000), I've done, contains about 3000 "pages" (ie both leaves) for 150 years of registers (BMD). About 6 days work for me.' See 2nd paragraph from bottom of Brian's comments. I only wish that in 6 days time I could accomplish as much but I do need several breaks along the way and my age & health gets in the way. I guess Brian rested on the 7th day. Sorry Brian but I couldn't let that pass. In fairness to Brian and you I have included his complete remarks & my initial e-mail to Pam. Charlie Homosassa, FL -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] Sent: Monday, June 13, 2011 10:08 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [A-L] Census Records - Notary Records First, I've not seen any plans posted on the Haut-Rhin Archives website to do the census records. They haven't even done the Parish Registers yet. On the wealthy benefactor idea. It doesn't take that. A single person could build an apparatus to hold the books gently without damaging them and also to gently hold the pages "flat", and be able to photograph them with a digital camera. This could be done for under $30. Any decent digital camera would work for taking the pictures. With this apparatus, a person could scan 300 pages a day. I've done that much and more. Not sure if they'd let a volunteer do that. Just saying, it could be done cheaply. Now of course for anyone here in the states wanting to volunteer for such a task it would mean a not cheap travel expense, and likely an expense for bringing the apparatus (there are plans for one on the Internet). Although Bas-Rhin might have their own better equipment. I'm surprised almost none of these bodies think to ask for qualified volunteers. They lose out on the whole "commons" idea. The driving force that has turned a single student's personal project into a world-wide phenomenon and a major competitor to Microsoft (ie Linux). I know that someone was at my local genealogy library scanning books. Not sure if he was a volunteer or paid professional. But there are countless amateur and professional genealogists who would likely donate hours to do some scanning. These projects often have one person doing scanning for years, as part of their regular duties. With a few dozen volunteers, such projects could be done in months or even less. Think about it: 1) 24 volunteers 2) 24 cameras 3) 24 scanning platforms 4) 150 pages per seven hour day (being ultra conservative 3+ minutes/page) = 3600 pages/day I generally average about 70-90 pages/hour, or 490-630 pages/day. Using that figure, a realistic goal for 24 volunteers in a day is 10000. How many pages in a notary per town on average x 600 towns? Say 100? If my figure is close 600x100 = 6000 pages or about half a day for 24 volunteers. Even at a 1000 pages that's 5 days. For an employee of Bas-Rhin/Haut-Rhin that's probably 2 hours a days for a whole year. As a comparison, a small town (500-4000), I've done, contains about 3000 "pages" (ie both leaves) for 150 years of registers (BMD). About 6 days work for me. This is how the FHL is able to digitize all these millions of records. Think how much more time-consuming it is to transcribe than it is to turn a page and take 1 or 2 pictures. On Sun, June 12, 2011 10:30 am, Charlie Sheridan wrote: > Hi Pam, > > If no one on the list knows, then my suggestion would be to write to the > Archivist at the Haut-Rhin Archives and ask that question. See below. > > http://www.archives.cg68.fr/Informations_Contact.aspx > > > I had a minor problem with missing census pages for a Bas-Rhin village, > e-mailed the Archivist and within a couple of days received a response > that > it would be corrected in July. > > And for those, as I am, interested in Bas-Rhin notary records the response > was that they are understaffed and lack finances to scan those documents. > And so there are no plans to include them in the foreseeable future. > We need a wealthy benefactor to help finance this project. > > Charlie > Homosassa, FL