Thanks for the info Robert! I started researching in Moselle with my Schmitts. Along the way I've seen nearly all the surnames you listed! Moselle-born Elisabeth Schmitt married my Swiss 2nd great-grandfather in Chicago. His surname was Müller (which later became Mueller). On Tue, Aug 9, 2011 at 4:11 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > Laura, > > According to Atlas des noms de famille en France, by Laurent Fordant > (Paris : Archives & Culture/Swic, 1999; ISBN 2911665236), the ten most > common surnames in Moselle in the period 1891-1915 were: > > Muller > Schmitt > Klein > Schneider > Weber > Becker > Wagner > Meyer > Jung > Schmidt > >

Now that the Bas Rhin records are available at http://etat-civil.bas-rhin.fr/adeloch/index.php, I thought I would share what I do to extract family information. I start with the civil records that are on forms starting about 1811-1812 and put marriages into my genealogy software. I record as much information as possible on the bride, groom, parents and witnesses. I make notes of my guesses at spelling when the records are unclear. I go forward in time and pull all the marriages until 1871 when the German language starts. (I cannot read German & my family emigrated before 1871). This gives me a family scaffold and allows me to see how the surnames change spellings over time. I then go back to the 1811-1812 records and extract births. I make a note that I verified the birth date and that the father's age was x years. Next I go through the marriages and deaths for that year and make comments that I verified the person died at X age. This allows me to know where I got various pieces of data & know how things were spelled on the various records. At a later date, I can translate the dates which used Napoleon's calendar as I have the dates in my notes if they appear in a marriage or death record after 1811. At some point, I can go back and take a look at the earlier Latin records and add those to the database. Hope this speeds up the extraction process for your families. Carolyn

Dear Justin, I'm happy that you found you way to this listserv made up of some very knowledgeable, expert and supportive people (cousins). You'll find that virtually any question you have will be promptly and accurately answered. I do want to correct something you wrote in your e-mail, though, relating to my family. My Brion descendant was married to a Goepp, and for a time the Geoffroi Goepp family (whose wife descended from a Brion) lived in St. Louis, MO, teaching foreign languages at Washington University; then San Francisco, CA where he taught Greek Latin, French and German at the Girls High School. But there his wife (nee Amelie Tafel) died at age 17 after having had three children. What happened to Geoffroi and his children I am trying to piece together with the help of a Tafel friend in Stuttgart. But the family never actually emigrated or directly came to the Midwest. I think it was the case of a job opportunity, although it could be that Geoffroi's intention was to emigrate until the death of his wife changed his plans. The son of Geoffroi and Amelie, Othon, my grandfather , whom I never knew) grew up in France, went to the University of Paris, became a journalist, came to the United State to lecture, remained to teach French at Cornell University in Ithaca, New York, where my family lived and where I grew up. I am going to take your information and try to plug it in where I can in my tree, and I look forward sharing information with you (and others) in the future. I'm glad you found this community of Alsacian relatives and friends. Best wishes, Lucy

For you Riedseltz KOLB descendants esp. those whose ancestors emigrated to the States I have from St. Andre’s Catholic church in Weiler a photo of a stained glass window donated by an Elise KOLB of Riedseltz. Sorry can’t ID which Elise KOLB and there’s no date but if you want I’ll send you a digital photo. Also quite a few with the KOLB surname are buried in the Riedseltz cemetery. Please direct request to me personally. Charlie Homosassa, FL [email protected]

Most of the half timbered homes have no outward markings that would allow one to determine the original owner of the structure. Many that can be identified with much effort often just contain initials with a date but there are those that have the owner’s names engraved usually in a section of the timber. I’ve photographed these structures as I came across them. If anyone is interested I’ll look through this file. I’ll need the ancestral names to do a check along with a village. Again as before this is not a research project. Below is the list of villages but odds are that what you are looking to find will not be there. It’s just a matter of luck. Aschbach; Betschdorf; Cleebourg; Croetwiller; Eberbach-Seltz; Ebersheim; Eschbach; Forstheim; Geitershof; Hoffen; Hunspach; Huttenheim; Ingolsheim; Kaidenbourg; Kuhlendorf; Memmelshoffen; Morschwiller; Mothern; Niederlauterbach, Oberlauterbach; Preuschdorf; Riedseltz, Scheibenhard; Schleithal; Schoenenbourg; Seebach/Oberseebach; Seltz; Siegen; Soufflenheim; Steinseltz; Surbourg; Uhlwiller; Weyersheim & Wintzenbach. If you are going to a country where such dating was practiced check the homes and barns carefully. Many times it’ll be on a part of a structure you can’t readily see, a barn that is in the rear of the property, a date that has been painted over but is still visible or it can be on the stone arch of the cellar (usually just initials and perhaps just a date or both). Be observant but don’t let the dogs that charge up to an enclosed fenced yard deter you from looking. In my case I’ve identified 2 of the 4 known surviving structures of ancestral homes. One has just part of the name with a year while the other contains both the name of husband and wife and a year. The latter is found on a barn which was constructed at the back and to the right of the home. A difficult read from the sidewalk. Please direct any requests to me and not to the list. Charlie Homosassa, FL [email protected]

It's a good bet I'll be able to visit Ribeauville, Bergheim and Hunawihr this coming fall. My German cousin says she can't find good lodging in any of these towns. I'm reaching out to my Alsatian researchers for help in locating a reasonably priced hotel in probably Ribeauville. Thanks in advance for any assistance you may be able to give me. I am so excited; I'm really going to be able to walk the same streets of my Alsatian ancestors. Beverly Mack Zanon Researching: Ribeauville, Bergheim, Hunawihr WISSER, MULLER, STADLER

Hi Listers, The data contained in the book quoted by Robert "Atlas des noms de famille en France" are all available online at www.geopatronyme.com. To see the most common surnames in Moselle in the period 1891-1915: - go to the above site - click in the left column called "Les noms les plus portés" on "Recherches par département" - then in the box called << N° de département>> enter the number of the French département: 57 Moselle, 67 Bas-Rhin, 68 Haut-Rhin, etc.... Ewald ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 2011/8/9 <[email protected]> > Laura, > > According to Atlas des noms de famille en France, by Laurent Fordant > (Paris : Archives & Culture/Swic, 1999; ISBN 2911665236), the ten most > common surnames in Moselle in the period 1891-1915 were: > > Muller > Schmitt > Klein > Schneider > Weber > Becker > Wagner > Meyer > Jung > Schmidt > > Compare that list with those for Bas-Rhin and Haut-Rhin in the same > period: > > Bas-Rhin > > Muller > Meyer > Schmitt > Klein > Schneider > Weber > Fischer > Wolff > Bauer > Jung > > Haut-Rhin > > Meyer > Muller > Schmitt > Schneider > Zimmermann > Keller > Weber > Fischer > Fuchs > Simon > > This book also has an interesting feature -- the (I suspect this list is present-day [i.e., 1999], rather than being historical). That list for > Moselle: > > Schoun > Thonnatte > Dempt > Churka > Trinkwell > Weisskopp > Reschmann > Birig > Estreich > Laumesfelt > > Robert > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Laura <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Thu, Aug 4, 2011 10:43 am > Subject: [A-L] Surnames in Moselle > > > In an earlier email, Dave wrote " The surname Abba is only listed in > Moselle > in Walscheid and is not listed at > all in Alsace for that time period." > > I would like to know more about the list to which Dave referred. I'm > curious > about my Gury and Houpert lines (they hail from Moselle) and I wonder if > these surnames names appear in towns other than the ones I know thus > far. > Thanks for any information about "the list". > > It's all relative, > > Laura > > PS - Do we have an ancestor in common? Check my family history web > site<http://livinginthepastlane.com/> or > my blog <http://livinginthepastlane.blogspot.com/>. > -- > Resources for Alsace-Lorraine list members: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~valorie/Alsace-Lorraine-L.htm > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the > body of > the message > > -- > Resources for Alsace-Lorraine list members: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~valorie/Alsace-Lorraine-L.htm > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Laura, According to Atlas des noms de famille en France, by Laurent Fordant (Paris : Archives & Culture/Swic, 1999; ISBN 2911665236), the ten most common surnames in Moselle in the period 1891-1915 were: Muller Schmitt Klein Schneider Weber Becker Wagner Meyer Jung Schmidt Compare that list with those for Bas-Rhin and Haut-Rhin in the same period: Bas-Rhin Muller Meyer Schmitt Klein Schneider Weber Fischer Wolff Bauer Jung Haut-Rhin Meyer Muller Schmitt Schneider Zimmermann Keller Weber Fischer Fuchs Simon This book also has an interesting feature -- the ten most common surnames found ONLY in a particular department (I suspect this list is present-day [i.e., 1999], rather than being historical). That list for Moselle: Schoun Thonnatte Dempt Churka Trinkwell Weisskopp Reschmann Birig Estreich Laumesfelt Robert -----Original Message----- From: Laura <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Thu, Aug 4, 2011 10:43 am Subject: [A-L] Surnames in Moselle In an earlier email, Dave wrote " The surname Abba is only listed in Moselle in Walscheid and is not listed at all in Alsace for that time period." I would like to know more about the list to which Dave referred. I'm curious about my Gury and Houpert lines (they hail from Moselle) and I wonder if these surnames names appear in towns other than the ones I know thus far. Thanks for any information about "the list". It's all relative, Laura PS - Do we have an ancestor in common? Check my family history web site<http://livinginthepastlane.com/> or my blog <http://livinginthepastlane.blogspot.com/>. -- Resources for Alsace-Lorraine list members: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~valorie/Alsace-Lorraine-L.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2011 11:28:03 -0400 From: Justin Houser <[email protected]> Subject: [A-L] Greetings / Questions concerning Kirrberg/Diedendorf/Rauwiller paris On 8/9/11 12:00 AM, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote: > 3. Third, I've read that a Dr. Gerhard Hein has done extracts from many > parish records in this area, compiling the records into family groups. Did > he do complete extracts for all the families of a given parish for a given > time period? Is there a record of which parishes, and time periods, he > extracted? I heard that his work is available on CD-ROM. Where might I > purchase it? Such a guide would likely help me focus my search of the > parish registers to specific dates and names, rather than reading page after > page. Dr Hein's work has been microfilmed by the LDS. Here is the list of 63 matching titles. [Access further information on each desired village via the LDS FHL Catalog online.] RE: the CD > Altsaarwerden Hein, Gerhard > Altweiler Hein, Gerhard > Das Amtsprotokoll der Grafschaft Saarwerden, 1589 Hein, Gerhard > Assweiler Hein, Gerhard > Berg und Thal Hein, Gerhard > Burbach mit Gerichtsbuch des Jörg Erhardt Hein, Gerhard > Bärendorf Hein, Gerhard > Büst, Eschburg, Graufthal, Lohr, Petersbach, Schönburg Hein, Gerhard > Bütten Hein, Gerhard > Diedendorf Hein, Gerhard > Diemeringen Hein, Gerhard > Das Dorf Dehlingen Hein, Gerhard > Dossenheim a/d Zinsel Hein, Gerhard > Drulingen Hein, Gerhard > Durstel Hein, Gerhard > Die Einwohner des Fürstentums Lixheim vor 1700 Girardin, Albert > Die Einwohner des Grafschaft Saarwerden in den Jahren 1350, 1542, 1570, 1610, > 1725 und 1742 Hein, Gerhard > Die Einwohner von Neuwerbaß in der Batschka 1785-1944 und ihre Herkunft : die > Familien nach dem reformierten Kirchenbuch Neuwerbaß 1786-1832 Hein, Gerhard > Erckartsweiler, Zittersheim und Sparsbach Hein, Gerhard > Eschweiler Hein, Gerhard > Das evangelisch-lutherische Kirchenbuch von Hangweiler mit den Filialorten > Berlingen, Büst, Eschberg, Graufthal, Pfaltzweyer und Schönberg 1603-1619, > Einzeleintragungen bis 1629 Hein, Gerhard > Das evangelisch-lutherische Kirchenbuch von Lützelstein 1636-1684/5 und > 1697/98-1700 und das Schatzungsregister der Graftschaft Lützelstein 1662 > Hein, Gerhard > Die evangelisch-lutherische Kirchenbücher von Bockenheim 1596-1685 und > Wolkskirchen 1671-1679; die evangelische Pfarrer, Schulmeister und Diacone und > ihre Verwandten im krummen Elsaß und seiner Ungeburg, nach M.J. Bopp; Die > katholische Geistlichkeit im Bockenheim, nach F. Cuny; die katholischen > Kirchenbücher von Bockenheim 1631-1704 Hein, Gerhard > Die evangelisch-lutherische Kirchenbücher von Vinstingen 1603-1685 Hein, > Gerhard > Die evangelisch-lutherischen Kirchenbücher von Diemeringen Hein, Gerhard > Die evangelisch-lutherischen Kirchenbücher von Lorentzen, Pisdorf, > Domfessel/Völlerdinden und Wintersburg vor 1700 Hein, Gerhard > Eyweiler mit kath. Kirchenbuch Wolfskirchen Hein, Gerhard > Familienbücher Krummes Elsaß Hein, Gerhard > Die Grafschaft Lützelstein Hein, Gerhard > Görlingen Hein, Gerhard > Harskirchen Hein, Gerhard > Herbitzheim Hein, Gerhard > Hirschland Hein, Gerhard > Ingweiler Hein, Gerhard > Keskastel Hein, Gerhard > Kirberg Hein, Gerhard > Die Kirchenbücher von Durstel ab 1695 und von Waldhambach ab 1683 Hein, > Gerhard > Die Kirchenbücher von Weyer, Baerendorf, Keskastel und Herbitzheim Hein, > Gerhard > Lorentzen Hein, Gerhard > Lützelstein Hein, Gerhard > Mackweiler Hein, Gerhard > Mennonitisches Lexikon Hege, Christian > Neusaarwerden Hein, Gerhard > Neuweiler (bei Zabern) Hein, Gerhard > Ottweiler Hein, Gerhard > Pisdorf Hein, Gerhard > Rauweiler Hein, Gerhard > Rexingen Hein, Gerhard > Rimsdorf Hein, Gerhard > Schöpperten Hein, Gerhard > Sieweiler Hein, Gerhard > Silzheim u. Sültzen Hein, Gerhard > Sparsbach, Weinburg Hein, Gerhard > Tiefenbach Hein, Gerhard > Völlerdingen Hein, Gerhard > Waldhambach Hein, Gerhard > Weitersweiler Hein, Gerhard > Weyer Hein, Gerhard > Wimmenau Hein, Gerhard > Wingen a/d Moder Hein, Gerhard > Wolfskirchen Hein, Gerhard > Zollingen Hein, Gerhard > Örmingen Hein, Gerhard > > 4. Fourth, has anyone ever translated the old statements on the opening > page of the Diedendorf parish register? I'm curious as to what it says. My > Germanic-script reading is good enough to make sense of most of the vital > acts, but when one gets into narrative sentences, my ability rapidly > declines! I don¹t know the answer to that; and even IF someone has deciphered and translated those fascinating notes, usually by the pastor, it¹s not too likely it will be online, THOUGH not impossible. Try searching google. Also, if your German schrift reading is pretty good, I suggest you make a copy of the paragraph/pages, get it greatly enlarged and cleaned up, and then work it, letter by letter for yourself. Once you¹ve done your own decipher/transliteration/translation, then YOU can put it online. <G> Good luck, Justin. By the way, I¹ve early HAUSSERs in Niederroedern. Any chance? Cari Thomas

Justin, To answer, at least in part, your third question, here is the record in the catalog of the Family History Library for the CD (unfortunately, their copy has been unavailable for at least the last year or two): ----------------------------------------- Title Familienbücher Krummes Elsaß Authors Hein, Gerhard (Main Author) Barth, Johann Heinrich (Added Author) Notes Titel vom Bildschirm. Systemvoraussetzungen: gebraucht Adobe Acrobat Reader. Familienbücher von Gerhard Hein ; Register von Johann Heinrich Barth. Excerpts from 68 genealogical publications pertaining to the region of Alsace-Lorraine, France (now, Bas-Rhin and Haut-Rhin departments). It was formerly called Elsaß-Lothringen, Germany. Particular emphasis is given to the former counties of Nassau-Saarwerden and Lützelstein. Includes extensive index to the publications. Subjects France, Alsace-Lorraine (région) - Genealogy Germany, Elsaß-Lothringen - Genealogy Copies Call Number - Location - Status - High Density CD-ROM no. 2652 pt. 1 - FHL INTL Access Window - Not available - CD-ROM no. 2652 pt. 2 - FHL INTL Access Window - Not available - Format Books/Monographs (Compact Disc) Language German Publication Oberhausen : Barth, Johann Heinrich, 2000 Physical 2 CD-ROMs : Kte. ISBN/ISSN 3980873994 -------------------------------------- and here is the corresponding record from WorldCat (OCLC): Familienbücher Krummes Elsaß Gerhard Hein 2001, ? German Computer File Book 1 CD-ROM ; 12 cm. 2 CD-ROMs 12 cm. Oberhausen, Schillerstraße 12 Freytag & Barth ; ISBN: 3000067426 9783000067426 Get This Item Availability: Check the catalogs in your library. Libraries worldwide that own item: 1 Connect to the catalog at your library External Resources: Request Interlibrary Loan Cite This Item Find Related Find Items About: Hein, Gerhard (7) Title: Familienbücher Krummes Elsaß Author(s): Hein, Gerhard Publication: Oberhausen, Schillerstraße 12 Freytag & Barth Year: 2001, ? Description: 1 CD-ROM ; 12 cm. 2 CD-ROMs 12 cm.; Medium: Optische Speicherplatte. Language: German Standard No: ISBN: 3000067426; 9783000067426 SUBJECT(S) Descriptor: Familie Geschichte. Verzeichnis CD-ROM Genealogie Geographic: Krummes Elsass Note(s): Titel auf dem Behältnis. Responsibility: Verf. [der] Buchreihe: Gerhard Hein Material Type: 5.25 in. disc (514); CD for computer (cdc) Document Type: Computer File; Book Date of Entry: 20031015 Update: 20100624 Accession No: OCLC: 643252092 Database: WorldCat -------------------------------------------------------- and here is a message about the CDs, sent to a RootsWeb list a decade ago (so the contact information may no longer be good): From: jvreeb <[email protected]> Subject: Fw: Dr. Gerhard Heins compiled records on CD Date: Mon, 07 May 2001 09:40:20 -0700 -----Original Message----- From: jvreeb <[email protected]> To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Date: Monday, May 07, 2001 9:17 AM Subject: Dr. Gerhard Heins compiled records on CD Pierre has asked me to answer some question in regards to CDs which contain the compiled records of Dr. Gerhard Hein as transcribed from all of the churchbooks and civil notary (estate settlements etc.) of the Grafschaft Saarwerden. What Dr. Hein done was to compile these records into many books; I don't know exactly how many at this moment, but I do remember back in 1980s Dr. Hein had wrote to me that there were over 69 done at that time. He had made 12 copies of each, one for the Departmental Archives in Strasbourg, one for himself and one for certain other people, who I understand were of some assistance to him in one way or other. These CDs are available through Freytag & Barth at Schillerstrasse 12, 46047 Oberhausen, Germany or Fax No. 0208 86341, or at [email protected] Please understand that I am not advertizing for them, however for those who are SERIOUSLY interested in obtaining the genealogical information of their ancestors from Alsace-Bossue [der Krummes Els! ass] region which was known in former times as Grafschaft Saarwerden or Nassau-Saarwerden and after 1745 as Nassau-Weilburg or Nassau-Saarbruecken, until 1793 when the entire region became part of France until 1871 when with the rest of Alsace and most of Lorraine it became part of Germany, until the end of the first world war when it once again became part of Bas-Rhin, France. These books by Dr. Gerhard Hein were written basically in German, however international genealogical symbols are used therefore with a little effort almost anyone should be able to read them with few if any problems. John V. Reeb ------------------------------------------------- The German version of Amazon lists is as not available: http://www.amazon.de/Genealogie-Service-de-GmbH-Familienb%C3%BCcher-Krummes-Elsass/dp/3980873994 and the organization they mention, Genealogie-Service.de, may no longer be in business: http://www.genealogie-service.de/index.html That's information, but it doesn't get you any closer to the CDs. Robert Behra -----Original Message----- From: Justin Houser <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Thu, Aug 4, 2011 9:28 am Subject: [A-L] Greetings / Questions concerning Kirrberg/Diedendorf/Rauwiller parishes Good morning, listmembers, Please allow me to introduce myself, and hopefully I will be able to receive answers to a few questions. I'm very glad to have found this RootsWeb list. I have been researching my family tree now for almost 20 years. A sizable portion of my ancestors were "Pennsylvania Germans" who came from what is now southwestern Germany, Alsace, Lorraine, and parts of Switzerland to Pennsylvania in the 18th century. One of my main family lines is Brion/Breon. My 8th-great-grandparents, Hans Jacob and Maria (Jouin) Brion, were from Kirrberg, Bas-Rhin department, were married in the Diedendorf Reformed Church in 1706, and baptized a number of their children there between 1706 and 1727. Many of these children came to Pennsylvania on the ship "Lydia" in 1741. Over the years I've obtained various information on this family, from Annette Kunselman Burgert's book on 18th century immigrants from Alsace (which I have), as well as genealogical postings on the Internet and miscellaneous photocopies of material sent to me by various individuals. (These documents have traced the lineage to one Peter Brion, born ca. 1590, who had a son Jacob Brion, born in Burbach in 1619.) I also have a very thick paperback book, with a blue cover I believe (it is currently stored away) on the history of Kirrberg, which is written all in German. At least three distant cousins have visited the Kirrberg and Diedendorf area, and have made contact with some of the family still living there, and have sent back pictures. It is a trip that I also hope to make at some point. Recently, I was contacted by a Lucy Battersby, who descends from a different Brion who immigrated at a much later date from Kirrberg and settled in the Mid-West. She told me about this list. As I was attempting to piece together her connection to our Brion family, I discovered that the Bas-Rhin archives have placed their parish and civil records online, a fact probably well-known to most on this list. I am greatly enjoying going through the old Diedendorf parish registers, finding many, many records of Brions, Jouins, and their kin who were baptized, sponsored baptisms, etc., etc. But this leads me to a few questions: 1. First, is there anyone else on the list who is researching these families? If so, I'd love to hear from you! 2. Second, I notice that Brions from Kirrberg are listed in the Reformed Church registers from Diedendorf (which begin in 1698) and also in the Reformed Church registers from Rauwiller (which begin in 1723). I have read that the area was settled very early (16th century) by Protestant Huguenots, and that, at various times, church communities were closed/decimated. My question is: Is the Reformed parish at Rauwiller a "daughter" parish to the one in Diedendorf? I'm trying to analogize to the situation I've encountered in Eastern European research, which is, if you live in village X, you attend church in village Y, and your baptisms, marriages, funerals, are recorded in village Y 99.999% of the time, unless for some exceptional reason you happen to be in village Z when an important life event happens. Hence my question, can I analogize this properly to Reformed parishes in the Alsace? That is, if someone lives in Kirrberg, will they always go to the parish which "covers" their village for ecclesiastical acts? If so, did that change in 1723 or so for Kirrberg? Otherwise, why are Brions from Kirrberg mentioned in both Diedendorf and Rauwiller records? Any resources which can help me understand the development of these parishes would be very much appreciated. 3. Third, I've read that a Dr. Gerhard Hein has done extracts from many parish records in this area, compiling the records into family groups. Did he do complete extracts for all the families of a given parish for a given time period? Is there a record of which parishes, and time periods, he extracted? I heard that his work is available on CD-ROM. Where might I purchase it? Such a guide would likely help me focus my search of the parish registers to specific dates and names, rather than reading page after page. 4. Fourth, has anyone ever translated the old statements on the opening page of the Diedendorf parish register? I'm curious as to what it says. My Germanic-script reading is good enough to make sense of most of the vital acts, but when one gets into narrative sentences, my ability rapidly declines! I'm happy to share any of the family information that I have that might be of interest to anyone. In addition to the Brion/Jouin group from Kirrberg, I have other Alsatian roots which lead back to Joseph Schneider who lived in Diedendorf and who came from Melchnau, Canton Bern, Switzerland; David Mertz who lived in Hangwiller (now Phalsbourg), in Lorraine (as I understand it); Johann Barnhardt Borst, said to have been from "near Strasbourg" and who came to Pennsylvania in 1766; Johann Eader/Ader/Otter/Etris (c1711-1784), whose origin is mysterious, but who *may* have come from Alsace and settled in Montgomery County, Pa., where he was active in the Reformed Church. I am also related to a number of Anabaptist Schürchs who came from Sumiswald, Switzerland, to Alsace in the 17th and 18th century. Thanks for any insight that anyone can provide. I'm very glad to have found this list and look forward to joining in the discussions as time permits. Justin Houser Scranton, PA -- Resources for Alsace-Lorraine list members: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~valorie/Alsace-Lorraine-L.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Laura, I'm not aware of anything similar that covers earlier periods. One thing you can try is doing searches in Geneanet (www.geneanet.org). If you don't have an account you can still do searches and see initial results (in the category Online Family Trees), which will usually show you the time period, the name of the community and the department. You can't get any deeper unless you have an account. With the free account you can look at the results from individual files and get a contact e-mail address. All the rest of the content requires a paying membership. I suggest this site because it is based in Europe, so it has a more representative sampling from which to determine distribution of surnames in France than does the rough American equivalent, Rootsweb's WorldConnect Project (wc.rootsweb.com). Since you mention the name Schmitt, you may already be aware that the three most common surnames in Alsace are Schmitt, Meyer and Muller (all of which also have multiple variant spellings), while the most common surname in France as a whole is Martin. Robert -----Original Message----- From: Laura <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Mon, Aug 8, 2011 8:24 am Subject: Re: [A-L] Surnames in Moselle Very cool - thank you Robert! I've played with nearly every surname in mytree - even my Schmitts. :o) I can see where my ancestors' descendants livedwhich is really neat. Do you know of anything earlier? Or plans to addanother time period?On Thu, Aug 4, 2011 at 12:17 PM, <[email protected]> wrote:>> Laura,>> Try www.geopatronyme.com>> This site tells you the distribution of surnames in France for four> periods over the past 120 years. The default is the earliest period> (1891-1915) and the results show you both a map and a list of> departments. The get the names of the towns just click on the name of> the department you are interested in (in the list, not on the map).>> Robert Behra>> -----Original Message-----> From: Laura <[email protected]>> To: [email protected]> Sent: Thu, Aug 4, 2011 10:43 am> Subject: [A-L] Surnames in Moselle>>> In an earlier email, Dave wrote " The surname Abba is only listed in> Mosellein Walscheid and is not listed at all in Alsace for that time> period."I would like to know more about the list to which Dave>-- Resources for Alsace-Lorraine list members:http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~valorie/Alsace-Lorraine- L.htm -------------------------------To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Pam,  you're more likely to get the help you need on the Pommern mailing list or by contacting the PRG (Pommern Regional Group) in MN. The Pommern list [email protected] It appears that you are looking for present Polczyn, Swinin, West Pommerania, Poland. It is not far from the former Regenwalde where some of my ancestors lived. On the old German maps it is about halfway between Stettin and Danzig. Here's a start, a list for Pommern genealogy websites that includes the PRG. http://www.genealoger.com/german/pommern/pommern__societies.htm There is a decent chance that church records are not extant for that area, but I would not assume that. You may be able to contact the archivist at the Center for the area. Good luck, Dave "Can use some direction on Pommern research. Looking for any family records for individuals last known residence was Polzin, Pommern. Born 1844, 1846 and a son born in 1872. FHL records for this area start I believe 1874. I'm finding the family names Damaske/Drawanz on some of the Pommern websites but am not having any luck with finding church records for this time period. Could these records have been destroyed for this time period? Any direction on websites that might be helpful. Thank You, Pam"

Very cool - thank you Robert! I've played with nearly every surname in my tree - even my Schmitts. :o) I can see where my ancestors' descendants lived which is really neat. Do you know of anything earlier? Or plans to add another time period? On Thu, Aug 4, 2011 at 12:17 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > > Laura, > > Try www.geopatronyme.com > > This site tells you the distribution of surnames in France for four > periods over the past 120 years. The default is the earliest period > (1891-1915) and the results show you both a map and a list of > departments. The get the names of the towns just click on the name of > the department you are interested in (in the list, not on the map). > > Robert Behra > > -----Original Message----- > From: Laura <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Thu, Aug 4, 2011 10:43 am > Subject: [A-L] Surnames in Moselle > > > In an earlier email, Dave wrote " The surname Abba is only listed in > Mosellein Walscheid and is not listed at all in Alsace for that time > period."I would like to know more about the list to which Dave >

Not to be too pedantic, but that's not what I remember as having been described as how we came to have twelve months. The Romulan calendar created by "Romulus", founder of Rome, had 10 months Martius, Aprilis, Maius, Lunius, Quintilis, Sextilis, September, October, November and December. Janurius and Februarius were added by the second ruler of Rome Numa Pompillius, at the END of the year. I don't know what historical artifacts support the existence of either of these two mytho-historical figures. But by the time of Julius Caesar in 45BC, there were twelve months and the Roman Senate renamed Quintilis to Iulius in 44BC,in honor of Julius Caesar. Likewise with Sextilis to Augustus in 8BC in honor of Augustus Caesar. So, it was a renaming of month "5" and "6". The later emperors did the same, but none of those names stuck. However, Charlemagne, renamed all the months and they stuck. You'll see them often in German language documents as Wintermonat, etc. March was the first month of the year. Which Julius shifted to January 1. Wikipedia, incorrectly states this was to align it with the tropical year. Not sure what is meant by that. But the choice of January 1 or any particular day is arbitrary. (March 1st would be more logical to me as being the month in which Spring begins.) Hence, September through December were properly the 7th through 10th months, until Julius Caesar that is. It was the reform of the Julian Calendar making January the first month. Although some countries and the Roman Church had their own ideas. But not relevant to Alsace. Just had to correct that. Brian (I had to use Wikipedia to add in some of the particulars.) On Sun, August 7, 2011 2:33 am, Ewald Klein wrote: > Hi, > > The other months have a normal name (in French:Janvier, février, mars, > avril, mai, juin, juillet, août). > > Here what I found in Rootsweb archives: > > << In ancient Rome, BC, they only had ten months, of which the first six > had > a > name: Januarius, Februarius, Martius, Aprilis, Maius, Junius. The next > ones > only had a number: seven, eight, nine, ten, but in Latin of course: > septem, > octo, novem, decem. > > At one time they decided that they actually needed twelve months, and they > named these months after some of their famous emperors: Julius and > Augustus. Logically, these named months were placed after the other named > months: Januaris, Februarius, Martius, Aprilis, Maius, Junius, Julius, > Augustus, but this also meant that the 7th, 8th, 9th and 10th month moved > up two places. Therefore the seventh month actually became the ninth, the > eight the tenth, etc.

Hi Bernd, Bin mit Ihnen einverstanden! I agree with you! I was too quick to send the message that I have not read in detail: the added months to the Roman year which comprised ten months are effectively January and February. Here another source: http://ancienthistory.about.com/od/romancalendars/qt/RomanFebruary.htm Alles Beste aus München wo ich mich momentan aufhalte Ewald +++++++++++++++++++ 2011/8/7 Bernd Krause <[email protected]> > Hello Ewald, > > I'm sorry, I have to correct you. > You are right: The Roman Calendar originally had 10 months. But the two > new months which were added were January and February, not July and > August. This happened about 713 B.C., only 40 years after that year 753 > B.C., which is known as "Urbe condita", the foundation year of Rome by > Romulus. Therefore, to make it easier to understand, and because we > don't have enough information about the earliest Roman Calendar system, > we can say: The Roman Calendar always had 12 months. > > The problem is, that the Roman year did not always start with January, > as it is common in our times, but with March. The reason for this was, > that the Romans were not able to start their military activities before > March, because of the weather conditions. So the year began in spring, > together with the beginning of the military campaigns. > > In the year 153 B.C. there was a reform, and since then the year began > with January. In spite of this, the old names of the months remained, > and therefore "septembris" - which in fact was the seventh month - > became the nineth month, and so on. > > The Month July originally was namened Quintilis (latin "quintus" = the > fifth), August was Sextilis (the sixth). > > Quintilis was renamed to July in in 44 B.C., with the death of Julius > Cesar. The same with Sextilis to August, as far as I know in the year 8 > B.C., the beginning of the consulate of Augustus. > > You may read further details in Wikipedia: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_calendar > > > I hope this will make it clear. > Regards > Bernd (Historian) > www.geschichtswissenschaften.com > > > > Ewald Klein schrieb: > > Hi, > > > > The other months have a normal name (in French:Janvier, février, mars, > > avril, mai, juin, juillet, août). > > > > Here what I found in Rootsweb archives: > > > > << In ancient Rome, BC, they only had ten months, of which the first six > had > > a > > name: Januarius, Februarius, Martius, Aprilis, Maius, Junius. The next > ones > > only had a number: seven, eight, nine, ten, but in Latin of course: > septem, > > octo, novem, decem. > > > > At one time they decided that they actually needed twelve months, and > they > > named these months after some of their famous emperors: Julius and > > Augustus. Logically, these named months were placed after the other named > > months: Januaris, Februarius, Martius, Aprilis, Maius, Junius, Julius, > > Augustus, but this also meant that the 7th, 8th, 9th and 10th month moved > > up two places. Therefore the seventh month actually became the ninth, the > > eight the tenth, etc. > > > > In earlier times, and still early in this century, many people, > especially > > those who had still learned Latin, wrote the abbreviated forms: > > - 7ber = September means 7th month, but is actually the 9th > > - 8ber = October means 8th month, but is actually the 10th > > - 9ber = November means 9th month, but is actually the 11th > > - 10ber = december means 10th month, but is actually the 12th > > > > In some cases you may also find Roman numerals used: > > > > VIIber , VIIIber, IXber, Xber > > > > The "ber" is usually in superscript. > > > > The ending -ber becomes -bre in French>> > > > > I hope that this clarify a bit.... > > > > Ewald >

Is anyone doing research on these people? Joseph BARDEL/BARTEL/BARTHEL (abt 1758-1838) & Magdalena BALMER/PALMER (abt 1763-1833) or Joseph STEPHAN and Maria Eva BECKER. Emigrated to the US in 1833. If so and you would like a photo of their Riedseltz home please contact me personally. In the coming weeks I’ll do the same for other village homes that I’ve photographed and can be identified. Charlie [email protected]

Hello Ewald, I'm sorry, I have to correct you. You are right: The Roman Calendar originally had 10 months. But the two new months which were added were January and February, not July and August. This happened about 713 B.C., only 40 years after that year 753 B.C., which is known as "Urbe condita", the foundation year of Rome by Romulus. Therefore, to make it easier to understand, and because we don't have enough information about the earliest Roman Calendar system, we can say: The Roman Calendar always had 12 months. The problem is, that the Roman year did not always start with January, as it is common in our times, but with March. The reason for this was, that the Romans were not able to start their military activities before March, because of the weather conditions. So the year began in spring, together with the beginning of the military campaigns. In the year 153 B.C. there was a reform, and since then the year began with January. In spite of this, the old names of the months remained, and therefore "septembris" - which in fact was the seventh month - became the nineth month, and so on. The Month July originally was namened Quintilis (latin "quintus" = the fifth), August was Sextilis (the sixth). Quintilis was renamed to July in in 44 B.C., with the death of Julius Cesar. The same with Sextilis to August, as far as I know in the year 8 B.C., the beginning of the consulate of Augustus. You may read further details in Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_calendar I hope this will make it clear. Regards Bernd (Historian) www.geschichtswissenschaften.com Ewald Klein schrieb: > Hi, > > The other months have a normal name (in French:Janvier, février, mars, > avril, mai, juin, juillet, août). > > Here what I found in Rootsweb archives: > > << In ancient Rome, BC, they only had ten months, of which the first six had > a > name: Januarius, Februarius, Martius, Aprilis, Maius, Junius. The next ones > only had a number: seven, eight, nine, ten, but in Latin of course: septem, > octo, novem, decem. > > At one time they decided that they actually needed twelve months, and they > named these months after some of their famous emperors: Julius and > Augustus. Logically, these named months were placed after the other named > months: Januaris, Februarius, Martius, Aprilis, Maius, Junius, Julius, > Augustus, but this also meant that the 7th, 8th, 9th and 10th month moved > up two places. Therefore the seventh month actually became the ninth, the > eight the tenth, etc. > > In earlier times, and still early in this century, many people, especially > those who had still learned Latin, wrote the abbreviated forms: > - 7ber = September means 7th month, but is actually the 9th > - 8ber = October means 8th month, but is actually the 10th > - 9ber = November means 9th month, but is actually the 11th > - 10ber = december means 10th month, but is actually the 12th > > In some cases you may also find Roman numerals used: > > VIIber , VIIIber, IXber, Xber > > The "ber" is usually in superscript. > > The ending -ber becomes -bre in French>> > > I hope that this clarify a bit.... > > Ewald > > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > 2011/8/6 Carolyn J Thomas<[email protected]> > >>> Ewald, thanks for sending this it is very helpful. Could you list the >> rest of >> the months. I write all of this stuff in a book which helps me so very >> much >> when I am "trying" to read records. >>> Walk in peace, >>> Linn >> >>>> Used in civil records to say months: >>>> 7bre = Sept. >>>> 8bre = Oct. >>>> 9bre = Nov. >>>> 10bre or Xbre = Dec >>>> Ewald >> >>

Hello all, Can use some direction on Pommern research. Looking for any family records for individuals last known residence was Polzin, Pommern. Born 1844, 1846 and a son born in 1872. FHL records for this area start I believe 1874. I'm finding the family names Damaske/Drawanz on some of the Pommern websites but am not having any luck with finding church records for this time period. Could these records have been destroyed for this time period? Any direction on websites that might be helpful. Thank You, Pam

Hi, The other months have a normal name (in French:Janvier, février, mars, avril, mai, juin, juillet, août). Here what I found in Rootsweb archives: << In ancient Rome, BC, they only had ten months, of which the first six had a name: Januarius, Februarius, Martius, Aprilis, Maius, Junius. The next ones only had a number: seven, eight, nine, ten, but in Latin of course: septem, octo, novem, decem. At one time they decided that they actually needed twelve months, and they named these months after some of their famous emperors: Julius and Augustus. Logically, these named months were placed after the other named months: Januaris, Februarius, Martius, Aprilis, Maius, Junius, Julius, Augustus, but this also meant that the 7th, 8th, 9th and 10th month moved up two places. Therefore the seventh month actually became the ninth, the eight the tenth, etc. In earlier times, and still early in this century, many people, especially those who had still learned Latin, wrote the abbreviated forms: - 7ber = September means 7th month, but is actually the 9th - 8ber = October means 8th month, but is actually the 10th - 9ber = November means 9th month, but is actually the 11th - 10ber = december means 10th month, but is actually the 12th In some cases you may also find Roman numerals used: VIIber , VIIIber, IXber, Xber The "ber" is usually in superscript. The ending -ber becomes -bre in French >> I hope that this clarify a bit.... Ewald ++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 2011/8/6 Carolyn J Thomas <[email protected]> > > Ewald, thanks for sending this it is very helpful. Could you list the > rest of > the months. I write all of this stuff in a book which helps me so very > much > when I am "trying" to read records. > > Walk in peace, > > Linn > > >> Used in civil records to say months: > >> 7bre = Sept. > >> 8bre = Oct. > >> 9bre = Nov. > >> 10bre or Xbre = Dec > >> Ewald > >

> Ewald, thanks for sending this it is very helpful. Could you list the rest of the months. I write all of this stuff in a book which helps me so very much when I am "trying" to read records. > Walk in peace, > Linn >> Used in civil records to say months: >> 7bre = Sept. >> 8bre = Oct. >> 9bre = Nov. >> 10bre or Xbre = Dec >> Ewald Hi Linn, If you¹re really interested in deciphering and translating Germanic/French records (or other languages, for that matter), you can find a slew of websites with genealogical vocabulary lists which you can then printout for your use anytime. One starting place for that would be the LDS familysearch.org vocabulary lists. <https://www.familysearch.org/node/894> will help you find the German lists. Almost any book on Germanic [or French] Genealogy will have some German [or French] gen vocabulary in it; but, for German, a fantastic, IMO, resource book is Ernest Thode¹s German-English Genealogy Dictionary [ISBN 0-8063-1342-0] with 286 pages of Ger-->Eng A-Z definitions, plus 35 additional helps such as numbers, months/days, symbols, suffixes, prefixes, etc. Since Alsatian is a Germanic dialect, their early records are in this same early German Schrift/handwriting. IF you¹re interested in learning how to do the deciphering yourself, I highly recommend Edna M.Bentz¹ <If I can, You Can ---- Decipher Germanic Records> [ISBN 0-9615420-0-4]. You CAN teach yourself with the help of this book! Good luck Cari Thomas