Case in point from the 1881 CENSUS... My 73 year old GGGrandfather lived at "Roadside" in the Midmar parish - a farmer of 12 acres. Barbara Gavin Bell wrote: > > > > "Roadside" may well have been given as the "Census Address" for vagrants > found sleeping under hedges, but was also used as a placename (or part > of a placename) in various parishes.......... > > >

Thankyou yet again, Gavin, Mary I have just replied to Sandra (or was it Bob?) about the status of Woodside, which will give you some of the answer. The village probably came into existence in the early 19th century. The original "Statistical Account" of 1796 mentions others of Aberdeen's satellite villages, but not Woodside. 50 years later, Lewis's "Topographical Dictionary of Scotland" states that the 'quoad sacra' parish (which he dates from 1834, earlier than other sources) contained three villages: Woodside, Cotton and Tanfield. These were reported as largely inhabited by (and one presumes were built specifically to house) the employees at the woollen and cotton mills which were established along the banks of the River Don. Gavin Bell

Thanks Goldie, I had forgotten about that site. Will give it a go. Pretty sure that neither of those are his parents, my only reason being that Scottish naming rule they seemed to follow. No Bathias, Williams or Marys in the descendants. But I can be wrong. Thanks for giving it a try though. :sjl

Hi Goldie,   I see your not seeing something.   John Duthie and Elizabeth Walker are not married. The first daughter of John Duthie:Barbara A dau age 7 abt 1894 Cruden Abd Scholar. Elizabeth Walker was 18 in the 1901 census which would have made her 11 years old to have had Barbara Duthie;so now we know Elizabeth Walker is out. I cannot find Jemima listed on the LDS site as daughter for George Walker and Barbara. Unless Jemima is spelt different and I am not going to go into it at this point. Don't mean to be rude Goldie but I am stuffed from too much turkey.Ha!Ha!.   Ray has a good point.   Now,about some of the womens maiden names. I feel that they are proud of who they are and want to be know by their given birth names. As far as they are concerned they are listed as married or widowed and that takes care of any concerns. The other thing could have been the census takers asked what her maiden name was to be correct. I have found that this continued past 1901 and that is OK!! I only wished it occured here in the US because we could trace relatives better.   I hope everyone had a Great Turkey Day!!! opps!!Thanksgiving.   Vicki --- On Fri, 11/27/09, Ray Hennessy <ray7033@googlemail.com> wrote: From: Ray Hennessy <ray7033@googlemail.com> Subject: Re: [ABERDEEN] Picking some brains here... To: aberdeen@rootsweb.com Date: Friday, November 27, 2009, 5:14 AM Hi Goldie That's better.  [see below] Why do you assume that Jemima WALKER married John DUTHIE?  Scotland's People shows one marriage of John DUTHIE to a female WALKER in Cruden in the 1893 but it is NOT Jemima nor [unsurprisingly] is it the much younger Elizabeth.  So it would presumably be another WALKER sister. My credits have expired on ScP otherwise I would have looked at the hit list but I'll leave that to you. There is one death of a female DUTHIE a.k.a WALKER in 1900 in Cruden which is almost certainly John's wife and the missing sister of J & E, and mother of the girls, Barbara, Christine and Jane. Q.E.D. You didn't notify Jemima's or Elizabeth's or John's marital statuses. I'd guess John was "W" and the women were "U". Panic not! -- Best wishes Ray ********************************************************** >From                                      Ray Hennessy Forenames website:                www.whatsinaname.net Preferred Email address:         ray@whatsinaname.net Hints for Scotland's People at   http://bit.ly/WIAN-SCP ********************************************************** --------------------------------------------------------------------- 2009/11/27 goldie and Lido Doratti <lidogold2@shaw.ca>: > Thanks Ray, here is what I have....... > 1901 Census Cruden ABD address 19 Harbour St > Duthie John head, age 32 abt 1869 b Cruden Abd Cooper > Walker Elizabeth sister in law age 18 abt 1883 b Peterhead Abd Domestic > Housekeeping > Duthie Barbara A dau age 7 abt 1894 Cruden Abd Scholar > Duthie Jane dau age 2 abat 1899 b Peterhead Abd > **** > 1901 Census Scotland Peterhead Abd Low Street No 13 > Walker George head age 58 abut 1843 b Peterhead Abd, fisherman > Walker Barbara wife age 58 abt 1843 b Peterhead, Abd > Walker Jemima dau age 25 b abt 1876 b Peterhead, Abd,Domestic servant > Duthie Christine granddau age 4 abt 1897 b Cruden, Abd > **** > For a fact I know that Elizabeth and Jemima are daughters of George and > Barbara Walker, but I don't understand this.......why is she still a Walker > if she was married to Duthie.......Out of the Walker family Jemima is the > only likely candidate......others are dead, or too young. > I can't get this thru my thick skull, I'm missing something and not thinking > outside the box here. I know I can go to SP and get the answer but I've > blown so many $$ doing this, I thought maybe someone could see something I > can't.  And DON'T anyone spend money on this on my behalf........it can stay > the way it is.  It just struck me as odd..  Thanks for the input, Goldie > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ray Hennessy" <ray7033@googlemail.com> > To: <aberdeen@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2009 5:03 PM > Subject: Re: [ABERDEEN] Picking some brains here... > > > Hi Goldie > > I'm not clear about the relationships in this scenario. > There seem to be two possibilities: > > 1.  If John was married to a sister - now deceased - of Elizabeth & > Jemima, then the relationships all work:  Elizabeth is housekeeping > for her sister's widower and one of his daughters is staying with the > grandparents on Census night. > > 2.  You haven't given us the declared married status of John, > Elizabeth or Jemima.  Are you saying that Jemima is married to John > DUTHIE? [do you *know* this?] If this is the point of the query then > it is likely that the father, when making the return, either > habitually used Jemima's maiden name or didn't put a name in.  If he > just wrote [or said] "daughter" the enumerator might easily have > assumed her surname to be the same as the father's.  Also, it would be > quite possible for Elizabeth to be housekeeping at her sister's - > probably because three children can be a handful and they might need > extra help to bring in income, depending on John's occupation. > > As they say, "there's many a slip..." and enumerators were probably > not very well paid and did everything in a hurry while also having a > day job. > > HTH > > Ray ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ABERDEEN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

There are 2 of them b Strichen,,1- 10 Nov 1838, Father is James mother is Bathia Pirie, 2 - 23 Jan 1840 F is William and mother is Mary Ironsides.......My suggestion to you would be to get his death cert or registration from Scotland's People, and follow the census up thru the 1841, 1851 etc....Have you tried Freecen@roots.com Goldie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robin LAMB" <Robin_Lamb@telus.net> To: <aberdeen@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2009 11:31 PM Subject: [ABERDEEN] James JAFFRAY of Strichen > > > I am once again asking if anyone has any information on James JAFFRAY. His > information is as follows. > > I have been unable to break through this brick wall for years, and it > would > be great if this year is the one to knock it down. > > I do have his descendants, but it is the ancestors that are the problem. > > If you have any suggestions of WHERE I should be looking that I haven't, > please let me know. > > If anyone is willing to do a look up I would appreciate that also. > > Thanks > > Sharon Lamb > Aldergrove, B.C. > Canada > > > > > 1. JAMES **1 JAFFRAY was born Abt. 1831 in Strichen, Aberdeenshire, > Scotland, and died Bef. 1938 in Strichen, Aberdeenshire, Scotland. He met > ANN[E] ** CRAIB 1864 in Strichen, Aberdeenshire, Scotland (Source: Robert > Dunbar,), daughter of JAMES CRAIB and AMELIA BREBNER/BREMNER. She was > born > 16 Oct 1828 in Strichen, Aberdeenshire, Scotland (Source: igi no copy > made), > and died Bef. 1928 in Scotland. > > More About JAMES ** JAFFRAY: > Occupation: 1893, Farmer (Source: Bob of Gold Coast Australia) > > More About ANN[E] ** CRAIB: > Census - England: 1851, Unmarried, House Servant, Aberdeenshire (Source: > 1851 Scottish census) > Christening: 16 Oct 1828, Strichen, Aberdeenshire, Scotland > Occupation: 1893, Domestic Servant (Source: Bob of Gold Coast Australia) > > More About JAMES JAFFRAY and ANN[E] CRAIB: > Partners: 1864, Strichen, Aberdeenshire, Scotland (Source: Robert Dunbar,) > > Child of JAMES JAFFRAY and ANN[E] CRAIB is: > 2. I. JAMES [I]** CRAIB2 JAFFRAY, b. 28 Dec 1864, Strichen, > Aberdeenshire, Scotland; d. 24 Apr 1934, Strichen, Aberdeenshire, > Scotland. > > his parents weren't married at the time of his birth so his birth name was > JAMES CRAIB, which was later changed to James CRAIB JAFFRAY. > I have a copy of his birth certificate to show/prove this. > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ABERDEEN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Ray Hennessy wrote: > 2009/11/27 Alison <royal.brooks@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > > Kathleen, I looked in vain for my 3xg grandmother, May Burgess, on the 1841 > >>census in Cromdale, using S.P. Used all name combinations but no luck . Had >>a brainwave and tried Freecen and there she was. Back to S.P. and tried >>searching for her neighbours also but not there. I wrote to S.P. but they >>replied saying that they do not do searches which was not what I was asking >>them to do at all. My credits for S.P. have expired so I have not done a >>search in the past month. The street (Main Street) cannot have been missed >>by the enumerator as Freecen have transcribed it. Have you tried Freecen? >> > > ____________________________________________________ > > Hi Alison > > When you go back onto ScP, try this out. There are three women on FreeCEN > called BURGESS who live in Moray and are aged 45 on the 1841 Census. These > are Elizabeth in Bellie, Jane in Elgin and your May in Cromdale-Inverness. > > On ScP for 1841 there are no May BURGESS entries aged 45 in the whole of > Scotland BUT there are three women aged 45 in Moray whose surname is > BURGESS. I also have credits expired and no need to access ScP at the > moment so I can't tell you what the names are. However one is in Bellie > [?Elizabeth], one is in Elgin [?Jane] and one is in **INVERALLAN** parish. There is a complication concerning the parish of Cromdale in terms of where its boundary lay, at different dates, and what County it belonged to, and this may have a bearing on how places in the parish are indexed by FreeCEN and ScotlandsPeople. Most of the boundary anomalies of parishes and counties were not resolved until the big shakeup of 1891, but for some reason, there was an Act of parliament in 1870 which changed the county boundaries between Inverness-shire and Elginshire (Moray). One of the parishes involved in this change was Cromdale. Unfortunately, the Act does not give any map of the changes, but only describes them in terms of some fairly abstruse landmarks, such as "the Muckrach or Findlarigg Burn" or the "Fuaranahanish Well". In 1891, there was a further change, whereby part of territory of the parish of Cromdale (Elginshire) was transferred to the parish of Duthil & Rothiemurchus, Inverness-shire. About 30 individual named places were involved. Historical records such as OPRs and Census tend to be catalogued and indexed in terms of what are sometimes called the "traditional" parish and county boundaries (ie those in force from 1891 to 1974) but as all Censuses up to and including 1891 were carried out in terms of the boundaries as they were when the particular Census was taken, certain discrepancies do arise. Gavin Bell

MISS ADELINE MARTIN wrote: > Hi In the 1851 Census for my Gt-Gt-Grandmother she is listed as > Proprietor of Land and her address is Woodside, > Inverurie-Aberdeenshire so I am just curious as to the other > Woodside,Aberdeenshire that Mary wondered if it was a Farm, Village > or a Hamlet or was it the right answer from Gavin explaining the area > of what is now the Woodside distrct of Aberdeen City. Our ancestors were often not very original when they gave names to their settlements, so there are at least 25 instances of "Woodside" in Aberdeenshire, not counting variants like "East Woodside" or "Woodside Croft". The "Woodside" in the parish of Inverurie seems to have disappeared between the 1851 Census and the publication of the 1st Edition of the Ordnance Survey large-scale maps in the 1860s. In 1851, it is enumerated as part of the town, rather than of the "landward" or rural part of the parish. To judge from the names of neighbouring places in the enumeration, it seems to have lain to the west of the town centre, and may have been swallowed up by the town's expansion in the later 19th century. But there only ever seems to have been one "Woodside" in the parishes in or near the Royal Burgh of Aberdeen, and that was the industrial village on the Don which was the subject of my previous post. Gavin Bell

Kathleen, I looked in vain for my 3xg grandmother, May Burgess, on the 1841 census in Cromdale, using S.P. Used all name combinations but no luck . Had a brainwave and tried Freecen and there she was. Back to S.P. and tried searching for her neighbours also but not there. I wrote to S.P. but they replied saying that they do not do searches which was not what I was asking them to do at all. My credits for S.P. have expired so I have not done a search in the past month. The street (Main Street) cannot have been missed by the enumerator as Freecen have transcribed it. Have you tried Freecen? Alison At 05:44 a.m. 27/11/2009, you wrote: >Would everyone in Scotland be on the 1841 census, or would some persons be >missed for whatever reason? > >Thanks > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >ABERDEEN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without >the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > >-- >Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. >Checked by AVG Free Edition. >Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.16.0/1137 - Release Date: >18/11/2007 5:15 p.m.

2009/11/27 Alison <royal.brooks@xtra.co.nz> wrote: Kathleen, I looked in vain for my 3xg grandmother, May Burgess, on the 1841 > census in Cromdale, using S.P. Used all name combinations but no luck . Had > a brainwave and tried Freecen and there she was. Back to S.P. and tried > searching for her neighbours also but not there. I wrote to S.P. but they > replied saying that they do not do searches which was not what I was asking > them to do at all. My credits for S.P. have expired so I have not done a > search in the past month. The street (Main Street) cannot have been missed > by the enumerator as Freecen have transcribed it. Have you tried Freecen? > ____________________________________________________ Hi Alison When you go back onto ScP, try this out. There are three women on FreeCEN called BURGESS who live in Moray and are aged 45 on the 1841 Census. These are Elizabeth in Bellie, Jane in Elgin and your May in Cromdale-Inverness. On ScP for 1841 there are no May BURGESS entries aged 45 in the whole of Scotland BUT there are three women aged 45 in Moray whose surname is BURGESS. I also have credits expired and no need to access ScP at the moment so I can't tell you what the names are. However one is in Bellie [?Elizabeth], one is in Elgin [?Jane] and one is in **INVERALLAN** parish. Without seeing the original films nor the images, it is difficult to tell if this third person is a ringer for your May BURGESS but it would be worth investigating. It is certainly odd that there is no May on ScP but there are three hits of that age on both ScP and FreeCEN. If you do find that there is a likely error it would be necessary to go back to ScP and tell them what you find and how it compares with FreeCEN. But best would be for you to look at the films of the Census, certainly for Cromdale and, if relevant, for Inverallan. If you prove there is an error, ScP will probably refund any credits you may have "wasted" sorting this out. If you have to rent the film[s] they may add credits for that cost as well [but I wouldn't rely on that!!] If you are a member of ANESFHS, they will do the look ups on the film for you but they may charge for facilites used, e.g. photocopies, print-outs.& postage. -- Best wishes Ray ********************************************************** >From Ray Hennessy Forenames website: www.whatsinaname.net Preferred Email address: ray@whatsinaname.net Hints for Scotland's People at http://bit.ly/WIAN-SCP **********************************************************

Hi List Just a short addendum to Gavin's reply: Those people discovered by the enumerator who were itinerant, possibly in a caravan or just under a hedge, would be given the address of "Roadside". Some of these folk might have been semi-permanent but would most likely have moved about a lot between censuses. Anyone dossing in the barns would likely be recorded as "Barnyard" or "Outhouse" but this might have included employed workers too. The details recorded for each person and the properties on successive Censuses changed frequently [e.g. the ages recorded in 1841 are differently calculated from every other census] but, as Gavin says, the rules for *who should be included* have stayed the same. -- Best wishes Ray ********************************************************** >From Ray Hennessy Forenames website: www.whatsinaname.net Preferred Email address: ray@whatsinaname.net Hints for Scotland's People at http://bit.ly/WIAN-SCP **********************************************************

Have you searched for a Will and/or Register of Sasines perhaps. Someone will add to this about female inheritance of land which might help your research. Janet ----- Original Message ----- From: "MISS ADELINE MARTIN" <martin8118@sbcglobal.net> Hi In the 1851 Census for my Gt-Gt-Grandmother she is listed as Proprietor of Land and her address is Woodside, Inverurie-Aberdeenshire so I am just curious as to the other Woodside,Aberdeenshire that Mary wondered if it was a Farm, Village or a Hamlet or was it the right answer from Gavin explaining the area of what is now the Woodside distrct of Aberdeen City. Adeline

Hello again Gavin, I must agree it was Skene Aberdeenshire, (don't know where my brain was ), thankyou for the correction. However, what was Woodside ? Back in the early & mid 1800's was it a large Farm, a Village , or Hamlet ? I know the main House, was a Rest Home at least 15 years ago. However, that would have been a more modern use for it. Also I am grateful for the correct spellings for North Broadford, & place & history of Stocket Road . Mary -----Original Message----- From: aberdeen-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:aberdeen-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Gavin Bell Sent: Thursday, 26 November 2009 11:17 p.m. To: aberdeen@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [ABERDEEN] Duff MURRAY Mary Legarth wrote: > Thankyou Gavin, > I suppose I should have mentioned that it was family oral history which put > the Birth at Woodside. Fair enough. > William MURRAY Bap 7 April 1801, at Skene, ( assume to be Banffshire ), Why Banffshire? Ray Hennessy and I have done a pretty detailed survey of placenames in Banffshire, and there is no instnce of "Skene" or anything much like it in the county. However, there is a parish of Skene in Aberdeenshire, roughly 9 miles west of Aberdeen. > died 1879 38 North Prioadford , ( ? spelling), North Broadford. An earlier name for the western part of what later became George Street. Old Machar, was the father of > William Duff MURRAY. > Old Machar also became part of family oral history. > William Murray 1861 was age 58 years, ( apparently Baptised 1801,) living > 233 Stricket Road, ? Aberdeen City. I think that is probably "Stocket Road". The "Stocket Forest" (to the north-west of the town) was part of the lands gifted to the town by Robert the Bruce, and the name persists in today's "Midstocket Road". On 19th century maps, you will also find the "High Stocket" and "Low Stocket" roads, names which are now disused. These all lie in the arc of country to the north and west of St Nicholas, the ancient town parish of Aberdeen, and are in the parish of Old Machar, where much of the 19th century expansion of the city took place. Gavin Bell

Hi In the 1851 Census for my Gt-Gt-Grandmother she is listed as Proprietor of Land and her address is Woodside, Inverurie-Aberdeenshire so I am just curious as to the other Woodside,Aberdeenshire that Mary wondered if it was a Farm, Village or a Hamlet or was it the right answer from Gavin explaining the area of what is now the Woodside distrct of Aberdeen City.   Adeline

Hi Gavin Whilst we have been unable to locate the birth/baptism of my great Grandmother in any records in 1852/3, in all census records 1861 to 1901 she records the parish of her birth as "Woodside" Aberdeenshire. ?? Bob in Oz ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gavin Bell" <g.bell@which.net> To: <aberdeen@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2009 6:59 PM Subject: Re: [ABERDEEN] Duff MURRAY > Mary Legarth wrote: > > >> The MURRAY family that I research, has William Duff MURRAY Baptised / >> Born >> 1836 Woodside, Aberdeen , Scotland, -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.709 / Virus Database: 270.14.83/2526 - Release Date: 11/26/09 05:43:00

Hi Goldie That's better. [see below] Why do you assume that Jemima WALKER married John DUTHIE? Scotland's People shows one marriage of John DUTHIE to a female WALKER in Cruden in the 1893 but it is NOT Jemima nor [unsurprisingly] is it the much younger Elizabeth. So it would presumably be another WALKER sister. My credits have expired on ScP otherwise I would have looked at the hit list but I'll leave that to you. There is one death of a female DUTHIE a.k.a WALKER in 1900 in Cruden which is almost certainly John's wife and the missing sister of J & E, and mother of the girls, Barbara, Christine and Jane. Q.E.D. You didn't notify Jemima's or Elizabeth's or John's marital statuses. I'd guess John was "W" and the women were "U". Panic not! -- Best wishes Ray ********************************************************** >From Ray Hennessy Forenames website: www.whatsinaname.net Preferred Email address: ray@whatsinaname.net Hints for Scotland's People at http://bit.ly/WIAN-SCP ********************************************************** --------------------------------------------------------------------- 2009/11/27 goldie and Lido Doratti <lidogold2@shaw.ca>: > Thanks Ray, here is what I have....... > 1901 Census Cruden ABD address 19 Harbour St > Duthie John head, age 32 abt 1869 b Cruden Abd Cooper > Walker Elizabeth sister in law age 18 abt 1883 b Peterhead Abd Domestic > Housekeeping > Duthie Barbara A dau age 7 abt 1894 Cruden Abd Scholar > Duthie Jane dau age 2 abat 1899 b Peterhead Abd > **** > 1901 Census Scotland Peterhead Abd Low Street No 13 > Walker George head age 58 abut 1843 b Peterhead Abd, fisherman > Walker Barbara wife age 58 abt 1843 b Peterhead, Abd > Walker Jemima dau age 25 b abt 1876 b Peterhead, Abd,Domestic servant > Duthie Christine granddau age 4 abt 1897 b Cruden, Abd > **** > For a fact I know that Elizabeth and Jemima are daughters of George and > Barbara Walker, but I don't understand this.......why is she still a Walker > if she was married to Duthie.......Out of the Walker family Jemima is the > only likely candidate......others are dead, or too young. > I can't get this thru my thick skull, I'm missing something and not thinking > outside the box here. I know I can go to SP and get the answer but I've > blown so many $$ doing this, I thought maybe someone could see something I > can't.  And DON'T anyone spend money on this on my behalf........it can stay > the way it is.  It just struck me as odd..  Thanks for the input, Goldie > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ray Hennessy" <ray7033@googlemail.com> > To: <aberdeen@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2009 5:03 PM > Subject: Re: [ABERDEEN] Picking some brains here... > > > Hi Goldie > > I'm not clear about the relationships in this scenario. > There seem to be two possibilities: > > 1.  If John was married to a sister - now deceased - of Elizabeth & > Jemima, then the relationships all work:  Elizabeth is housekeeping > for her sister's widower and one of his daughters is staying with the > grandparents on Census night. > > 2.  You haven't given us the declared married status of John, > Elizabeth or Jemima.  Are you saying that Jemima is married to John > DUTHIE? [do you *know* this?] If this is the point of the query then > it is likely that the father, when making the return, either > habitually used Jemima's maiden name or didn't put a name in.  If he > just wrote [or said] "daughter" the enumerator might easily have > assumed her surname to be the same as the father's.  Also, it would be > quite possible for Elizabeth to be housekeeping at her sister's - > probably because three children can be a handful and they might need > extra help to bring in income, depending on John's occupation. > > As they say, "there's many a slip..." and enumerators were probably > not very well paid and did everything in a hurry while also having a > day job. > > HTH > > Ray

Mary Legarth wrote: > I must agree it was Skene Aberdeenshire, (don't know where my brain was ), > thankyou for the correction. > > However, what was Woodside ? Back in the early & mid 1800's was it a large > Farm, a Village , or Hamlet ? I have just replied to Sandra (or was it Bob?) about the status of Woodside, which will give you some of the answer. The village probably came into existence in the early 19th century. The original "Statistical Account" of 1796 mentions others of Aberdeen's satellite villages, but not Woodside. 50 years later, Lewis's "Topographical Dictionary of Scotland" states that the 'quoad sacra' parish (which he dates from 1834, earlier than other sources) contained three villages: Woodside, Cotton and Tanfield. These were reported as largely inhabited by (and one presumes were built specifically to house) the employees at the woollen and cotton mills which were established along the banks of the River Don. Gavin Bell

SANDRA DENISE DUNBAR wrote: > Whilst we have been unable to locate the birth/baptism of my great > Grandmother in any records in 1852/3, in all census records 1861 to 1901 she > records the parish of her birth as "Woodside" Aberdeenshire. Arguably, the Enumerator should not have accepted that entry, as the Schedule clearly asked for the *Parish* of Birth, by which is generally understood the "quoad civilia" Parish (ie the civil or administrative parish). Woodside lay in Old Machar. Woodside became a "quoad sacra" Parish at a date which is variously reported as in the 1840s and 1860s, but never had its own separate Kirk registers of baptism and marriage, and did not, in 1855, become a separate Registration District. Woodside did (again at a date that I can not precisely state - it was some time after 1833) become a "Police Burgh", with its own Council and Provost. Sadly for the Woodsiders, this dignity was snatched away in 1891, when (along with Old Aberdeen) it was incorporated into the new City of Aberdeen. Perhaps we can forgive your ggm and her friendly neighbourhood Enumerator for not being aware of all the administrative twists and turns! Gavin Bell

Hi Goldie I'm not clear about the relationships in this scenario. There seem to be two possibilities: 1. If John was married to a sister - now deceased - of Elizabeth & Jemima, then the relationships all work: Elizabeth is housekeeping for her sister's widower and one of his daughters is staying with the grandparents on Census night. 2. You haven't given us the declared married status of John, Elizabeth or Jemima. Are you saying that Jemima is married to John DUTHIE? [do you *know* this?] If this is the point of the query then it is likely that the father, when making the return, either habitually used Jemima's maiden name or didn't put a name in. If he just wrote [or said] "daughter" the enumerator might easily have assumed her surname to be the same as the father's. Also, it would be quite possible for Elizabeth to be housekeeping at her sister's - probably because three children can be a handful and they might need extra help to bring in income, depending on John's occupation. As they say, "there's many a slip..." and enumerators were probably not very well paid and did everything in a hurry while also having a day job. HTH Ray 2009/11/26 goldie and Lido Doratti <lidogold2@shaw.ca>: > What would be the chances, do you suppose, of a female on the 1901 census who was married being listed under her maiden name? > I have a Duthie in Cruden with his sister-in-law Eliz Walker who is given as 'Domestic Housekeeping', and 2 of John's daughters. > > In Peterhead I have the parents to Eliz Walker, then a Walker, Jemima also a Domestic servant (I know she belongs to the family) and another Duthie child given as Granddaughter. > I dislike the word assume.........but it looks like Jemima is at home with her parents and has taken a child with her, while her sister keeps house in Cruden with their other 2 children. I can understand the siters helping out a sister so that makes sense to me.  But, again, why is she showing up as WALKER, not Duthie?  Was it still done in 1901? > Bear with me, I'm coming down the home stretch here with the Walkers.....Then I'm going undercover for a month or more....I hope.  Goldie >

And some folk are just bloody minded when it comes to Government involvement in their private lives! My feisty friend, until his untimely death at the age of 42, refused to sleep at home on census night, choosing to 'camp' in various out-of-the-way places - often in his car - and forbade his parents to include him on the forms. Pity I'm unlikely to be around when those census details are released! Pat "Here's tae us! Wha's like us? Damn few! - an' they're a' deid!" Old Scots Toast -----Original Message----- From: aberdeen-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:aberdeen-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Gordon Johnson Sent: 26 November 2009 22:43 To: aberdeen@rootsweb.com Subject: [ABERDEEN] 1841 Census Kathleen asked: Would everyone in Scotland be on the 1841 census, or would some persons be missed for whatever reason? ------ Kathleen - almost everyone should be covered, except those out of touch, such as fisherman at sea (Many coastal census returns have notes mentioning fishermen being absent). However, "missing" may not mean not present! If you are searching an index, the person you seek may be indexed under a misread name. I was looking for a lawyer in Wick, a local worthy, who had to be present in a particular census, but the index did not reveal him. As I knew his place of residence, I went through the microfilm, and he was there - the handwriting of the enumerator was apalling, and the name wrongly indexed. Gordon. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ABERDEEN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Definitely still married? Not a widow? Many a widow reverted to her maiden name after the death of her spouse. But, of course, women in Scotland do not 'give up' their maiden name on marriage and can (and do) choose to continue to be use their maiden name. Pat "Here's tae us! Wha's like us? Damn few! - an' they're a' deid!" Old Scots Toast -----Original Message----- From: aberdeen-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:aberdeen-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of goldie and Lido Doratti Sent: 26 November 2009 23:10 To: aberdeen@rootsweb.com Subject: [ABERDEEN] Picking some brains here... What would be the chances, do you suppose, of a female on the 1901 census who was married being listed under her maiden name? I have a Duthie in Cruden with his sister-in-law Eliz Walker who is given as 'Domestic Housekeeping', and 2 of John's daughters. In Peterhead I have the parents to Eliz Walker, then a Walker, Jemima also a Domestic servant (I know she belongs to the family) and another Duthie child given as Granddaughter. I dislike the word assume.........but it looks like Jemima is at home with her parents and has taken a child with her, while her sister keeps house in Cruden with their other 2 children. I can understand the siters helping out a sister so that makes sense to me. But, again, why is she showing up as WALKER, not Duthie? Was it still done in 1901? Bear with me, I'm coming down the home stretch here with the Walkers.....Then I'm going undercover for a month or more....I hope. Goldie